This is topic Movie Making is not that fun, yet I wouldn't do anything else. in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Dave Williams (Member # 299) on 07-02-2007, 04:19 AM:
 
I recently had the opportunity to shoot and edit a short film. I have been working on a couple of different projects, and actually shot two training videos for my former employer.

Pre-production on the film takes nearly as much time as editing, but is much more fun. The filming part is incredibly tedious, and working with tired and exhausted crew and talent is frustrating. When your star is throwing a tantrum because shes tired can really set your shooting schedule out of whack as your lighting window goes out the actual window.

It was editing that killed me. We had three hours of shot footage for six minutes of movie time. It took nearly three hundred man hours of editing and I personally watched every single frame of every single captured shot at least ten times, with the final footage about fifty times.

By the time it was done, I didn't care and hoped that everyone would just die and leave me alone! I let my producer take it from there. It was shown to six different audiences and all six apparently loved it! I didn't go for the single reason that I just couldn't watch it again. I hated it. I instead took a new job for some sound design work and some mixing jobs to get my mind off of it.

Now I have my producer wanting me to put together a reel for a behind the scenes look to attach to the film itself. I want to oblige, but I would rather get to our next project. We have most of our actors on board, and it will be all of 15 minutes long this time, but we are waiting for one hold out who wants money but we don't have any. She is an established actress that we offered to make her the absolute centerpiece and pay her expenses, but that just never works!!!

I love film making, but I hate it just as much. Oh I really hate it!!! But I cannot wait to get back to filming.

Anyone else here ever direct or thought of directing before??

Ciao.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-02-2007, 04:59 AM:
 
I don't mind any of that, so long as I have the final say. What I really hate is editing for someone else. You get something so extremely perfect and show it to the person who has the final say and they respond with something like "Oh I love it! It's perfect and just how I imagined it. Fantastic job!! I just want to change one little itty bitty thing." I dread that, because usually it's not itty bitty in reality (though in the mind of the person requesting the change it is), it makes the whole thing worse as a result and that leads to other changes as well. I have a hard time keeping my mouth shut sometimes, but I have to. I always offer suggestions and reasoning as to why it is the way it is, but it never stands. Sometimes I don't make the change and say I did, and then they tell me that the change made it so much better.
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-02-2007, 08:31 AM:
 
quote: Dave Williams
I have been working on a couple of different projects, and actually shot two training videos for my former employer.
If you're referring to the now Red Carpet Theaters I hope you get paid [Eek!] .

Mark
 
Posted by Jim Bedford (Member # 4) on 07-02-2007, 10:47 AM:
 
I show movies. I can often book the right movie, make sure it's shown well on the screen and make people happy to have seen it.

But I'm pretty much in awe of people who can take an idea and put it on the screen in a coherent manner that holds my interest or blows my mind. Thanks and keep up the good work!
 
Posted by Paul Mayer (Member # 355) on 07-02-2007, 06:22 PM:
 
It is fun isn't it. But like Joe says, only when one has the final say. It's kinda like how I feel about flying these days - lots of fun when I do it for myself; not nearly so much fun when I have to do it for someone else.

Yet if it gets into your blood you'll keep coming back for more.

Editing and post was the favorite part for me. Shooting just gives you stuff to edit. The last project I did, a wedding video for my cousin, was a blast - assembling about six hours of footage and another three hours of wild sound down to about 40 minutes running time. The shoot took a couple of days. The post took about a month.

One of my old sig lines:
quote:
"Roll 'em! Speed! Marker! Action! Cut! Print that! Next set up!"
Repeat until dead.

 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-02-2007, 06:49 PM:
 
Wedding videos are my LEAST favorite! I have a hard time not dying from boredom at weddings as it is, but to have to come home and sift though it all again and again... from several different angles... Aaaaahhh!! Granted, the final video is always more entertaining than the actual event, but it's still completely dull. I made a wedding video for one of my friends a few years back, and when I took the discs over to him he popped one in and immediately started to watch it right when I was there. Not again! Nooooo!!!!!
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-02-2007, 07:19 PM:
 
I agree with the "final say" bit. I certainly have filmed and produced tons of films in the last 30+ years...commercial theatrical, adverts, travelogs, and yes boys and girls, even porno! [Smile]

The MOST fun I've had is when I get to write, produce, direct, film, and edit it. If ya get a good reception, it's great! If ya get poo-poo'd, it's depressing! [Smile]

Either way, it's a speculation of many $$$. [Smile]
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-03-2007, 10:14 PM:
 
Yep, I've done a bunch of trailers, shorts, and promos in 35mm. My favorite part is sitting in the audience and hearing the crowd react properly at the right times. What a payoff! It's an incredible feeling. Strangely, people will sometimes find a meaning in something that you never even comprehended, much less planned for. And the things that are thrown together quickly often turn out to be real audience pleasers, while those shots you worked weeks on get yawns. I also find that you can never really finish a project. If you keep looking, you will always find something you can change or make better. At some point, you just have to declare it finished and move on.

One of the greatest moments of my life came at the Digital Cinema demonstration, held for exhibitors in New York last year at the Transit Drive-In. I'd been asked to supply digital content of some of my work, so I took the opportunity to produce a special presentation just for this show. It contained, among other things, a fake "server failure" leading into a blue screen of death. After allowing sufficient screen time for the anti-digital-cinema catcalls and gasps of astonishment, I followed through with an animation revealing that the joke was all on them. The timing was perfect. The crowd roared with laughter and applause, and the show then transitioned into demos of my work.

To top everything off, my director's credit received applause at the end. I was on top of the world!

So, what show did you do, Dave?
 
Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 07-03-2007, 10:39 PM:
 
quote:
like how I feel about flying these days - lots of fun when I do it for myself;
Agreed... much fun!
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-04-2007, 05:25 AM:
 
quote: Timmy
If you keep looking, you will always find something you can change or make better.
Ah yes, the dreaded George Lucas Syndrome. But it's true. I sometimes do this with REEEAALLLY old stuff I shot over 10 years ago just for fun, but I don't announce it as "new and improved". Basically what I'll do with the old footage is, say, change a poster that is hanging on the wall in a camera pan to something much more current or place a framed picture of an old high school friend above someone's sink to see if anyone notices. I hope to get comments like "Waitaminute... how did an Xbox poster end up on my wall back in 1993?" It's pretty convincing... and fun. I had this old camcorder footage of a videogame store which went out of business over 10 years ago that the manager made which he wanted me to put on DVD for him (we're still good friends) and added current Xbox360 games on the shelves and whatnot. He was confused when he watched it. Fun times. Of course I also included the original version in mono.
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-04-2007, 02:58 PM:
 
quote: Joe Redifer
the dreaded George Lucas Syndrome
ROFL! Actually, I was referring to post-production in general, but I am guilty of revisiting earlier productions, too. The Digital Cinema version of my Showbiz Intermission Clock has changes/improvements, made using newer technology; stuff I didn't have when I did the first version, back in 2001. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 03:05 PM:
 
I look back on the films I've done (especially those I did when in my teens and 20s) and thought "What a dumbass! I should have done this or that." Whatever... rather than what I did.

It's real hard not to go back and re-cut to "make it better". [Eek!]
 
Posted by Joshua Waaland (Member # 287) on 07-04-2007, 05:18 PM:
 
I did my first editing work last year when I made a video for my wife's 30th birthday. I used Studio 8 and I had a lot of problems with it crashing.

Last week my boss took me to help him pick out a new camcorder for us to shoot videos of our equipment at work. We are in Cleveland and our engineers are at the headquarters in Toronto so when we have a problem we have to video document it and send it to them. Not being a real connoisseur of editing software I urged him to buy Studio 11 since I was familiar with it. I figured my old version had problems because of Windows XP and thought version 11 should be better. I spent most of last Friday editing footage and had the same problems with Studio crashing. Eventually I got it fixed and finished the video.

Those were my only two experiences but it gave me great appreciation for the people who edit film. What a painstaking process that is! [Eek!] After watching the same footage over and over you grow bored very easily. I definitely like the shooting part better.
 
Posted by Jennifer Pan (Member # 2035) on 07-04-2007, 05:20 PM:
 
Not really movies but they are short silly videos I've made...
http://youtube.com/profile?user=fl21girl

Through out the years I've used Avid, Pinnacle, Adobe Premiere, Power Director, Video Studio, Final Cut Pro Studio Suite, and Magix Movie Edit just to name a few.

I would have to agree that shooting the video is definitely more fun... I'd like to make a full length movie some day soon.
 
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 07-04-2007, 05:49 PM:
 
I'm working on a short documentary right now. Shot on 16mm, sound recorded on DAT, and edited on a Steenbeck. My member photo is a production still of me standing behind a camera. Release prints will be both 16mm and 35mm. Unfortunately, I've been busy and a half-edited version has been (literally) sitting on the shelf for about a year and a half, but I'm hoping to finish it soon. It is theatre-related and I'm hoping that Brad will post it when it is complete, which I hope will be sometime this fall.

Agreed that editing is tedious, but the results can be worth it. Shooting was fun. This is a low-budget doc ("sponsored by Master Card"), so it was just me (director and DP) and a soundman (who was working for free). For this sort of film, there would have been no point to having a full complement of gaffers, gofers, grips, PAs, script-girls, and best boys, anyway, even if funds had permitted it.
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 05:50 PM:
 
Shooting the film/video may be more fun, but *IF* the camera-person is not experienced and knows what and how to shoot, it makes the editors and everyone else's job VERY difficult.

When we were shooting film, the raw footage to usable footage was about a 3-4:1 ratio. With the advent of video (TV) productions, it seems the ratio is unlimited. This is most likely due to the wannabe "professionals" that have NO talent or conception of film-making.

There are tons of "wannabe" camera-persons out there now that have NO clue or talent. They just turn out sh!t! Ya know...the "point and shoot" group that think their shit doesn't stink... HOT TIP! It DOES! HA!

The camera-person is the least important major job of any shoot. The director is the most important position on any production. He/she must have the balls/tits to tell the other crew members when to fuckoff and when they are doing a great job. You know, the old saying: Credit where it is do. And if not, a good tongue lashing! HA!
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-04-2007, 06:15 PM:
 
quote: Phil Hill
It's real hard not to go back and re-cut to "make it better".
Why is that? Because you are dedicating every minute of your spare time to setting up your screening room?
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 06:17 PM:
 
[fu] HA!

When I see you later this month, I will give you a printout of my latest list of "Why I Hate Brad"...it's four pages long...single spaced! [Razz] [beer] [thumbsup]
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-04-2007, 06:57 PM:
 
One of these days (like, when I hit the lottery), I'm going to make a feature. My dream crew would include:

Richard Haines - Producer
Joe Redifer - Writer
Dave Williams - Unit Production Manager [Wink]
Justin West - Associate Producer
Phil Hill - DP
..and, I assume Phil would approve of:
-Scott Norwood - 1st Asst. Camera
-Jennifer Pan - 2nd Asst.
-Claude Ayakawa - Gaffer
Paul Mayer - Location Projectionist

[Big Grin]
 
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 07-04-2007, 07:41 PM:
 
How about John Pytlak as "Technical Consultant", or "Lab Liason"?
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-04-2007, 07:53 PM:
 
Oh, most definitely! [Smile] It would be top-flight all the way. [Wink]
 
Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 07-04-2007, 07:53 PM:
 
quote: Tim Reed
Richard Haines - Producer
[puke]
 
Posted by Jennifer Pan (Member # 2035) on 07-04-2007, 08:17 PM:
 
AWESOME! I can't wait for the Red Carpet Premiere!! [Cool]

Tim, who is going to star the flick? I will need some eye candy to work the camera properly!
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 08:25 PM:
 
Michael, I think Richard "tight ass" Haines would be great. He's produced many cheesy films and I respect him as a film-maker.

I also like Mr. Pytlak as a consultant. He can whip me inline!

Tim, I did disagree with a couple of your choices and assumptions! ... sent you a nasty email as such! They ARE jerks! HA! [thumbsup] [uhoh]

BTW: PLEASE make a part for "Those Lips" The Jen! I *REALLY* wanta photograph her again. [Wink]
 
Posted by Jennifer Pan (Member # 2035) on 07-04-2007, 08:32 PM:
 
I want to appear on screen in the background with that particular pose every time!
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 08:34 PM:
 
Jen! You cracked me up!
That was really funny! [thumbsup] [beer]
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 07-04-2007, 09:25 PM:
 
I'd be glad to be the general "hanger on" around the set. [thumbsup]
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-04-2007, 09:44 PM:
 
Mike, I can get you a pass to get on the set...email me! [Smile]
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-04-2007, 10:08 PM:
 
quote:
PLEASE make a part for "Those Lips" The Jen!
Okay, late changes to the cast and crew lineup... and my first casting announcement:

Jennifer Pan - Girl in Background

Crew additions:
Michael Coate - 2nd Asst. Camera (pending approval of DP) [Wink]
Mike Heenan - PA

[Big Grin]
 
Posted by Jennifer Pan (Member # 2035) on 07-04-2007, 10:14 PM:
 
I'd like to also be the evil twin of the girl in the background! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 07-04-2007, 10:53 PM:
 
John--you definitely have a "special thanks" credit in my short. [thumbsup]

Tim--tell me when and where you'll be making your feature and I'll be there to help in some capacity. I'm sure it will be great.
 
Posted by Joshua Waaland (Member # 287) on 07-05-2007, 12:29 PM:
 
Tim,

Can I be the gofer? That way all of your arrogant actors can yell at me because I brought them a Sam's Choice bottled water instead of an Evian? [Wink]

Josh
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 07-05-2007, 02:04 PM:
 
Haha! Okay, Joshua. The gig's yours, brother. [Wink]

Thanks, Scott. [Smile] You bet. It's you, or it's nobody!
 
Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 07-05-2007, 05:52 PM:
 
Tim, I really like your 1st casting. The hhot, hhot The Jen IS perfect for the parts of the "girl in the background" and "the evil twin"!

I can't wait to film her! Hubba Hubba! [beer]
 
Posted by Joshua Waaland (Member # 287) on 07-05-2007, 06:03 PM:
 
I think Phil should appear in the background too as a pirate like in his avatar. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Gerard S. Cohen (Member # 994) on 07-05-2007, 08:23 PM:
 
What no "Best BOY"?
Or is that too sexist?
 
Posted by Dave Williams (Member # 299) on 07-12-2007, 07:55 AM:
 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
If you're referring to the now Red Carpet Theaters I hope you get paid
Nope it wasn't them. What is the deal with them anyway? Is it still whatsisface and gigantor like always, because it seems the same, only the name has changed... again...

The former employer was American Express actually. And for those I did get paid, and they are still using the videos to this day.

Ciao
 




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