Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Senator Theatre is playing Fiddler on the Roof in IB and 4-track

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Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-04-2007, 07:08 AM:

The Senator theatre in Baltimore, MD is now playing Fiddler on the Roof in 4-track magnetic stereo sound! Furthermore, the print is an IB technicolor print!

Show times daily are 12:00, 4:00 and 8:00pm. The film will play from 12/4/07 until 12/13/07 when it will be replaced by Blade Runner in 35mm.

Please note that the Senator will once again have its annual Maryland Food Bank Benefit showing of the double feature of Its a Wonderful Life and A Christmas Carol (1951 version) on December 16th.

On December 21st, the Senator will start Charlie Wilson's War.

For more information go to www.senator.com

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-04-2007, 10:18 AM:

Cool! Thanks for the alert Steve. Kate and I will definitely try to make that.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-04-2007, 10:29 AM:

That's a original 1971 181 minute version, not the trimmed 1979 Dolby Stereo 149 minute version.

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 12-06-2007, 05:59 PM:

That answers the question I had. Thanks, Bill.

Posted by Per Hauberg (Member # 529) on 12-06-2007, 07:11 PM:

Uhh - Baltimoore.... on the other side of the planet.
Wish I was there - to stay with the cinema's own word in the homepage. Rest of the month too.
Hope, it will pull in the crowd [thumbsup]

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-06-2007, 10:03 PM:

Kate & I are planning to be there tomorrow (Friday the 7th) at 12 Noon.

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 12-07-2007, 05:22 AM:

Is that a collector's print? UA sure didn't have a 4trk IBTech print when I was offering them my first born AND the wife -- all I got was a cut mono optical. And at 60/40 too. Ripped me off but good. I just love it when people come out of the theatre insisting there were parts of songs missing. I run and hide but my associate stands there and takes it....appologizing and refuned money to those who made a pressing point of coming and finding us.

By the third show we had signs up that the print that was being shown was edited BY THE DISTRIBUTOR and was beyond our control. We made sure the sign was pointed out to everyone before they bought a ticket.

In the revival business, your audience 9 out of 10 have already seen the film, some of them MANY times and know it inside and out. In the case of a musical, they know EVERY note....they have the soundtrack album at home. And maybe even the tape or DVD. So they come to your theatre to see it IN THE THEATRE and the BEST version. Cheating them with a cut version is heresy....as far as I am concerned, you might as well be defiling some sacred artifact of their religion or something, or calling a teadybear by a sacred name.

The cut version of CAMELOT was the worst I've ever seen -- whole choruses of songs were cut. An entire chorus and finale of the title song "Camelot" was cut, and right in the middle of a joke, loosing the punch line. The very early sequence where Guenivere first meets Authur and doesn't know that he is the king, he tries to convince her how wonderful living in Camelot will be. Authur sings the first half of the song, pauses and then explains that the leaves just wisk away, "at night...(he pauses)....of course." She laughs and chides him in semi-mocking/semi-disbelief, "Of course." and the full last chorus immediately follows with the two singing a duet. In the cut version, Guenivere never answers "Of course." it just cuts to the end of the scene -- no duet, not end of the song even. It was a horror. At one show, someone in the audience actually screamed out, "OF COURSE" when he realized what Guenivere's line was missing. Also, the entire exposition of how Merilin knows everything before it happens because he is going backwards in time -- he "youthens," is all cut so no one gets to understand the whole subplot....unless they remember it from the last time they saw the full version. Luckily we were able get a 4trk full version from WB after two years of my persistant hounding everyone I could ever get on the phone; one old timer happened to get my call by accident and knew where there was a studio print in a closet somewhere that was not in the inventory. Another three months to convince them to give it to us. The 4trk mag sounded spectacular, especially the bombastic lead up to the intermission. It gave me goose bumps every single time it came around (I ran every show). I'd be surprised if that 4trk mag print hasn't been shreaded.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-07-2007, 10:40 AM:

Frank if you go to the Senator's web site it's says it's a collector's Roadshow print.

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-07-2007, 11:45 PM:

We saw it today, and I still have "If I were a rich man" stuck in my head. What a great show. The print looked good and sounded great. I talked to the projectionist and thanked him for a great presentation. He was kind of surprised, and said "Usually when people want to talk to me they want to complain about something." No complaints here. Steve, he said to thank you for your hard work in making sure that it sounded good. It did sound fantastic, so thanks! Congrats to The Senator. A show well done. And a big thanks to the collector for letting his print be shown, not to mention to the studio for letting it be shown. Excellent job.

If you live in the area, make an effort to see this show.

[thumbsup]

Mark

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-08-2007, 08:20 AM:

While I'm in the Senator as much as any to service it...my most recent vist was to prep for the 70mm show of Lawrence....Neal set up Fiddler for 4-track.

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-08-2007, 09:38 AM:

When is Lawrence? Or did I miss it?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-08-2007, 09:11 PM:

Lawrence preceeded Fiddler...you missed it...shame on you!

Steve

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-08-2007, 11:06 PM:

That sucks! Guess I better pay better attention next time!

Posted by Michael Coate (Member # 757) on 12-10-2007, 06:01 AM:

I was at the evening show on Sunday. Surprisingly, considering I generally dislike musicals, I enjoyed the film. (I had never seen the film before in its entirety or in a theater.)

Despite the great reputation the SENATOR has, I'd give the presentation a "C" due to poor sound during the first half an hour or so, as well as showmanship faux pas such as not closing the curtains and projecting the "tails" during the end of the first act following the Intermission title as well as at the end of the feature. And despite what the projectionist said to me after I inquired (i.e. complained), it sounded as though the (mono) optical track was what we heard during Reel 1 and half of Reel 2.

Overall, I enjoyed the film and am glad I went, especially considering how rare such presentations (roadshow length, IB Technicolor, 4-track mag) are these days.

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 12-10-2007, 10:35 AM:

I was there at the 4:00pm show on Sunday. The mix definately seemed to have a mono versus "full" feel to it. Very few pans as compared to earlier multi-channel mixes from the 50s and 60s.

As to the curtain...cut the guy some slack...the curtain machine is BROKEN...the only way to have the curtain open and close is someone to sneak down the aisle and go up on stage and then get to the curtain cords and pull them...pretty tough from the booth but they did close the curtain for the intermission on our show.

For the, the sound was a bit low on the 1st act and I complained...It was louder for the 2nd act but the manager noted that the volume was low due to previous complaints about it being too loud.

The print was entirely watchable with good color. There are few emulsion scratches but many base scratches that vary in quantity and intensity...sometimes they seem to be gone, sometimes it was like rain...but still entirely watchable. The focus was a bit of a challenge at times too.

They are Film Guarding the print so hopefully with each successive showing it will be getting better and better (dirt/scratches and focus). Anyone that hasn't seen Film Guard on Acetate won't believe their eyes....as good as Film Guard is on Polyester...it will erase (fill-in) scratches on Acetate.

Steve

Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 12-10-2007, 11:14 AM:

I saw it when it first came out; I think it was at the Odeon, Streatham, when that place was still one auditorium, and carbon arcs. I'm pretty sure I saw it in 35mm, and not a blow-up, and the sound was good. I do remember that I heard it in stereo. Does the print have 12kHz. tone, because I heard it on many 4-track films, but I don't remember hearing it on that, but it's a long time ago now. I can't actually remember how much use the film made of the surround channel; many films made very little use of it. These days I doubt that I could even hear 12kHz.

[ 12-10-2007, 12:19 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Furley ]

Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-10-2007, 01:01 PM:

When we were there, (12 noon on Friday) they closed the curtains manually for the intermission. I did wonder why the curtain wasn't motorized. Now I know. I'm sure some would have made the case to just leave the curtain open while the machine was broken, so I give them kudos for trying to put on a good show by doing it manually.

The volume for our show was perfect. It sounded great from the back of the theater, which is where we started because we came in a few minutes late and couldn't see, and it sounded great from the 10th row, which is where we ended up after our eyes adjusted. The sound was definitely stereo for us. We noticed dialog panning on a few of the scenes, and the music while sounding dated, was still pleasant to listen to, and did surround us. I also noticed a very very faint ticking noise coming from the right channel during the first half of the second half. It was extremely faint and I'm not complaining, but it was there.

Like Steve said, the scratches were hit and miss. Most folks wouldn't notice most of the scratches. There was one wavy dark base scratch down the center of the screen that lasted about a minute, and I did notice a couple of emulsion scratches, but they were quick and hardly distracting. I thought I saw Film Guard, but I wasn't sure.

There were a few splices here and there, mostly near the heads and tails of the reels, but only one, maybe two that removed a line or more of dialog. An interesting note: when you see the splices, you're instinctively ready to hear a break in the sound, but it never comes. Another clue that we were listening to the mag track.

It sucks that your show suffered a little, Mike. All things considered, ours was great. Especially when you consider that this print is probably one of the best ones in existence.