Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: And You Thought Gasoline Was Expensive!

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Posted by Jim Cassedy (Member # 4115) on 03-13-2008, 11:07 AM:

The cost of gasoline at the little station near my house is now $4.97/gal. If you think that's expensive, consider this:

Last night I was out buying another cartridge for my inkjet printer. An "HP-#56" BLACK inkjet cartrige, commonly used in many printers sells locally for $25.00(without tax.)
According to the package, the cartridge contains 19ml of ink.

There are 3785ml in a gallon. So if you "do the math" that means that a gallon of plain black HP ink costs $4,980 or over $5,000/gallon if you include CA sales tax. WoW!

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-13-2008, 11:32 AM:

I had the same thoughts about printer ink when I bought some carts recently. I think mine came to just a little over $3700 a gallon.

There are a lot of things that are more expensive than gas that shouldn't be. Bottled water, perfume/cologne, the list goes on. But printer ink is ridiculous. The other major rip is when any new model printer comes out, there must be new "improved" ink carts to go with it.

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 03-13-2008, 12:38 PM:

The little printer cartridge packaging and other ad materials help raise the price some. But the main reason why consumer printer ink cartridges are so expensive is because of the cheap printers. The companies often sell the printers for very cheap and even at a loss. They make their money back with the replacement cartridges.

The 54" wide Roland VP-540 printer I use in my studio takes 4 separate and fairly large ink cartridges. Each cartridge holds 440cc of ink and costs about $100. I'm pretty sure that's a lot more ink for the money than what you get in little consumer cartridges. The downside is the printer and its media take up system cost well over $20,000. Add another $8000+ for the laminator.

Of course, I don't think the printer ink analogy to somehow make gas prices not seem so bad works very well at all. Even when we're running our large format printer pretty much all day, all week, the printer cartridges last at least a good couple of weeks and are generating product that can be sold for significant mark-up.

People have to use a lot more in terms of gasoline. I'm lucky I live close to my work place. So I'm only filling up maybe once a month. Others are blowing a fortune on gasoline. We're spending out the wazoo on diesel. And that issue is pretty aggravating considering diesel doesn't cost as much to make as standard grades of gasoline. But since so many commercial businesses have to use diesel trucks and can't cut back on their driving, the oil industry has then by the short and curlies.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 03-13-2008, 01:37 PM:

Sometime last year I read a magazine article which argued that in pure volume terms, inkjet printer ink is literally the most expensive liquid it's possible to buy through retail sale, and by a considerable margin. A bottle of Chateau Wanquer '59 is a positive bargain in comparison!

As for gasoline, it's not friggin' funny. When I started my current job in November 2006, a return trip to work burnt between £4 and £4.25's worth of the stuff (depending on traffic, how much electrical stuff was on in the car etc.). It's now £6.50, give or take 10-20p. Doing a rough sum based on the local price of 105p/litre here, that's $8.76 for a US gallon.

Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 03-13-2008, 06:49 PM:

US Gov. Energy Information Administration sez this about Diesel fuel pricing (although some of the data is apparently a couple years old).

What Are The Main Factors That Affect Diesel Fuel Prices?
Besides excise taxes [6 cents higher per gallon of Diesel, compared to gasoline], the following are the main factors that affect diesel fuel prices:

Cost and supply of crude oil: Crude oil prices are determined by worldwide supply and demand, and over the past few years increasing demand has put intense pressure on available supplies. The Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) has significant influence on prices by setting an upper production limit on its members who produce about 40 percent of the world’s crude oil, have essentially all of the spare production capacity, and possess about two-thirds of the world’s estimated crude oil reserves. Prices spike in response to disruptions in the international and domestic supply of crude oil, such as the oil embargo in 1973, the Iran/Iraq war in 1980, the current war in Iraq, and the 2005 hurricanes in the Gulf of Mexico.

[Figure 4. Diesel Fuel Prices Follow Crude Oil]

Tight refining capacity and international diesel fuel demand: U.S. refineries have been operating at above 90 percent capacity over the last 10 years. Most other countries rely even more heavily on distillates and diesel for transportation than does the United States, and refining capacity is tight worldwide. U.S. diesel fuel prices are more and more affected by competing international demand for refined distillates.

Product supply/demand imbalances: Prices of transportation fuels are generally more volatile than prices of other commodities because the U.S. transportation fleet is so heavily dependent on petroleum and few alternative fuels are available. If supply declines unexpectedly due to refinery problems or lagging imports, diesel inventories (stocks) may decline rapidly. When stocks are low and falling, some wholesalers and marketers may bid higher for the available product. If the transportation system cannot support the flow of surplus supplies from one region to another quickly, prices will remain comparatively high. These are normal price fluctuations experienced in all commodity markets.

Seasonality in the demand for diesel fuel and distillates: While U.S. diesel demand is fairly consistent and generally reflects the overall health of the economy, prices tend to gradually rise during the fall, decline in the late winter, rise through the early spring, and then drop a bit in the summer. Diesel fuel use by farmers and for transporting goods for stores to build inventories during the winter holiday season, as well as cold weather in the Northeast where most heating fuel oil is consumed, can apply upward pressure on diesel prices.

Transportation costs: Transportation costs generally increase with increasing distance between the retail location and distribution terminals and refineries. Areas farthest from the Gulf Coast (the source of nearly half of the diesel fuel produced in the United States) tend to have higher prices.

Regional operating costs and local competition: The cost of doing business by individual dealers can vary greatly depending on where the dealer is located. These costs include wages and salaries, benefits, equipment, lease/rent, insurance, overhead, and State and local fees. Even retail stations next to each other can have different traffic patterns, rents, and sources of supply that affect their prices. The number and location of local competitors can also affect prices.

Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 03-14-2008, 05:56 AM:

The price difference between petrol and diesel has been widening here, too. There used to be only a penny or two in it, but it's now around 5-6p. Some oil industry spokesman they wheeled into a TV studio claimed the reason to be that as smaller diesel engines have got more efficient (common rail technology, engine management computers etc.), the proportion of road fuel sold has gradually been shifting from petrol to diesel, but that oil companies have failed to shift refining capacity accordingly. So although the process of refining diesel is actually simpler and cheaper, refinery capacity is getting out of kilter with consumer demand, hence rising diesel prices.

I can kind of believe that - a decade ago only one person I knew had a diesel car. Now it seems to be most of my friends and relatives. When I changed my car last summer I decided to stick with petrol, because I don't do a high enough annual mileage to offset the increased maintenance costs of a diesel. Given the variables of fuel cost and maintenance (parts and labour) cost here, you really have to be doing over 15k miles a year for diesel to be worth it.

Posted by Phil Blake (Member # 2012) on 03-14-2008, 10:08 AM:

I just picked up a new canon printer $140 aud, it has new improved ink tanks , the cost of replacing all on the five tanks is $132.00

Gee does one just hurl the printer and buy a new one when the ink runs out or replace the tanks ? and I have proven that it does non pay to refill or replace tanks with non genuine.

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 03-14-2008, 01:42 PM:

Thats why there are so many places that re-fill inkjet cartridges. You can also do it yourself and I;ve done it many times. The reason the print cartridges are so expensive is because the valves that work the ink flow for the print head are part of the cartridge. Laser is better and in the long run ALOT cheaper.

Mark

Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 03-14-2008, 01:59 PM:

That depends on the printing purpose.

Thermal inkjet printing is the best choice for printing photos on glossy paper. Electrostatic color laser printer technology isn't well suited for that purpose, but it is definitely more economical.

But some color laser printers are not very good and can end up costing you lots of money as well. We used to use a Konica-Minolta MagicColor 2300W for color laser printing client sketches, spec sheets and lots of other stuff. Unfortunately the printer wasn't efficient in how it used its toner and that was costing quite a bit of money. On top of that it had more than its fair share of technical problems.

We switched to using a larger Konica-Minolta "Dialta Color" machine that does scanning, copying and color laser printing. It has a built in EFI Fiery Postscript RIP that delivers far more accurate color quality. The printer costs a lot of money (we have it on a lease plan), but our office printing and copying costs are quite a bit lower. So the thing is more than paying for itself.

Posted by Wayne Keyser (Member # 2420) on 03-14-2008, 09:26 PM:

Great savings on 3rd-party cartridges at http://inkgrabber.com

Phone in your order or else phone before online ordering and they'll be glad to tell you the codes for their (perpetual) 20%-off and free-shipping specials.

When I first started buying off-brand ink cartridges, the quality was "iffy" - now it's justr fine. And I'd rather pay $12/per than $20 per any day (that's a "blue sky" example, not a price quote.)

These guys save me a bundle!

Posted by James Westbrook (Member # 3690) on 03-14-2008, 11:11 PM:

gasoline will remain expensive unless we can get more refineries built and running.
I am glad no one used the annoying "Milk is more expensive than Gas" argument as I know of no one who buys 12 or 20 gallons of milk at one time (The institutions get the little cartons to distribute.)
Projector parts was what kept Strong going all these years. Ink cartridges keeps HP going. And going.

Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 03-14-2008, 11:42 PM:

Ink cartridges certianly do NOT keep HP in business. Check the pricing on a Superdome [Big Grin]

Even then, they're cost effictive though.

Though they do help the consumer lines remain profitable.

Refinery capacity is not the cause of high gas prices.

Posted by James Westbrook (Member # 3690) on 03-15-2008, 07:31 PM:

I thought refineries were bogged down by having to make different "blends" of gasoline for the polluted metro areas of the country, for winter and summer. [Confused]

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 03-15-2008, 11:07 PM:

quote: Jason Burroughs
Ink cartridges certianly do NOT keep HP in business.

That's what HP's server guys tell me every time I mention to one of them that HP is the best printer company in the world. [Smile]