This is topic The iNotaphone 4 in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=006210
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-19-2010, 02:35 PM:
 
First let me express a minor amount of frustration. WHAT A PIECE OF SHIT THIS "PHONE" IS!!!

Ok, that being said, for those not in the know, this phone actually isn't a phone. You can't use it AS a phone. Sure its got silly little animated everything that impress the iPeople of the world and ten gazillion apps of which are for the most part a waste of my time, but whatever. There are widespread reports of these things dropping calls if you hold the phone a certain way, but honestly no matter how I grab this thing I am in such a good reception area it doesn't matter.

That being said the problem is the proximity detector. Basically as I am talking, the screen keeps turning back on, causing me to bang out numbers during the call, initiate a 3 way call, mute the conversation or simply hang up on the other caller.

My phone is in essence an emergency line of sorts in the event a theater needs immediate assistance with something, and I've had this thing for a week or so and haven't had one normal conversation. Once a call comes in, I usually have to run find a land line somewhere and waste time explaining to them that the call is bound to be terminated at any point and that it isn't me hanging up on them.

I will never understand why people love iProducts so much. Every single one, and I do mean EVERY single iThing I have ever had was substandard, troublesome and in terms of computers, crashed repeatedly. Ugh! It must be because I don't drink enough Starbucks coffee.

Regardless I'm done with the iProduct and I am going to switch to the Droid X or HTC Evo 4G.

The questions for everyone here are:
#1 Do you have any knowledge between the Droid X or HTC Evo 4G? I am leaning toward the Droid X on every aspect except the 4G capability, but I'm not sure if it would really even benefit me enough to bother.

#2 Does anyone know when the 30 day "return the phone and cancel the ATT contract" actually STARTS? Is it when I received the phone in the mail, when it was activated, or when I initially ordered the phone online and signed that agreement?

There is a week'ish waiting period for the real phones, so I am trying to figure out how to transfer my number, but keep the iJunk active until the real one arrives. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-19-2010, 03:09 PM:
 
From people I know that keep track of this stuff, apparently the proximity sensor bug is supposed to be fixed in the next firmware release. But I wouldn't hold my breath.

And the only reason I'd personally go with the iphone line of products is that I've got a fair number of apps I purchased on my ipod touch that I'll use in school/future job that have no port for android phones. But those are industry-specific/niche-market apps.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-19-2010, 03:29 PM:
 
Evo and the droid X are both great phones!

Before rambling off minor differences, what are you looking for out of them?

Also, it might be worth checking out androidforums.com
 
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 07-19-2010, 04:07 PM:
 
From what Steve Jobs said on the weekend, they will accept a return if you're not happy no questions until September 30.

I think that's what he said anyway. Take a look at the video for confirmation.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 04:18 PM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
Every single one, and I do mean EVERY single iThing I have ever had was substandard
What other iThing have you owned besides an iPhone? I've never been a fan of the iPhone. My current cell phone works fine. It is old, but what more does it really need to do? Answer: nothing. It just needs to make and receive calls and texts. For everything else I have the iPod Touch, which has no reason to be substandard. True, many things could be improved like the onscreen keyboard, touch mapping, yadda yadda. I haven't noticed much if any animation in any of the apps or even the OS itself, just scaling when you touch something.

Solution to your problem: Get an Android phone and wait for it to arrive before you get rid of the iPhone 4. Be sure to get one of the more expensive models, because the Android OS runs pretty choppy on most non-expensive phones I have seen. And they still can't do Flash. What you can try to do in the meantime is hook the iPhone to iTunes, do a backup and then reinstall IOS4. This is the first I have heard of a proximity detection bug and if it is as bad as you say for everyone, it would be all over the news. So reinstall and it may go away or decrease.
 
Posted by Mike Olpin (Member # 1115) on 07-19-2010, 04:37 PM:
 
What? The iPhone is a phone too?
 
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 07-19-2010, 04:51 PM:
 
I can't speak to the iPhone for I do not have one (have a Sanyo M1 that I have been VERY pleased with for many years now). I also do not have an iPod <gasp> and, thus far, don't have a desire for one.

I do own an iMac...however and, quite frankly, have been VERY pleased with it. Its service record, as compared to equivalent aged PCs has been far above...I don't recall the last time it crashed...it has been that rock solid. It also is rather brisk. In fact, I was thinking that the next time I need a laptop, I may skip the PC because it take them FOREVER to load...and then they are not really loaded...they are still loading their services and processes and such while giving the illusion of being ready. So, in terms of reliability and speed, I'll take my iMac (despite being several years old now...something like 4 or 5 years) over an XP machine. For what its worth, I'm running "Snow Leopard OS X 10.6" on a first generation intel iMac. The only issue I've ever had was a crashed hard drive...which I've had on PCs to in equivalent amount of time. I changed the drive and it is better than ever.

Steve
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 05:20 PM:
 
I wouldn't own an iMac or iBook. Too limited for what I want to do. They may be fine for someone who lives in the ancient past before platters were invented *ahem* but they don't do it for me. [Razz]
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-19-2010, 06:31 PM:
 
Problem solved. The local Verizon store had the Droid X (which was the one I was leaning more towards) in stock so I switched in the store.

Yes Jobs admitted the proximity detector issue, but the media went nuts over that youtube video of the guy showing the antenna "death grip" issue and hence, the free cases. He gave no estimation of when the proximity detector would be fixed. Had he said it would be fixed in an update within a week or 10 days I might have considered waiting, but I can tell already the Droid X is a superior machine anyway.

The phone bill also went down and coverage is better.

Joe, go check out the new iPods. The sound quality on them sucks.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-19-2010, 06:54 PM:
 
On July 5th I dumped my iPhone 3G for an Evo 4G. Let me summarize my Evo experience for you.

My final complaint is the phone is just too big.
Call quality on the Evo seems good but no better than my iPhone 3G was (not 3G-S). Sprint's 3G service is definitely faster than AT&T's 3G. You can easily get various discounts from Sprint, up to around 25%.
Some of the Evo's current faults will be fixed in future releases of Android and as 3rd party software evolves. Right now it's just not ready unless you REALLY like tinkering under the hood. I just want a smartphone where all these features work and I don't have to spend hours on a single task like associating artwork with my music files in a way that the phone will accept.

Other than that how did you like the parade Mrs. Kennedy?
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 07:11 PM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
Joe, go check out the new iPods. The sound quality on them sucks.
I used to have an iPod Mini and the sound quality did not meet my minimum standards. The iPod Touch, however, sounds MUCH better. The Touch is the only iPod model I care about (I cannot stand the click wheel navigation scheme). It is also one of the best music players as far as usability and GUI are concerned, though I admit it's not 100% perfect (that would be hard to accomplish). Playlists and Shuffle are handled much better on the Touch than other non-touch iPods. Still, if the sound quality is not good enough for you, you can buy an external pre-amp. I can hook my iPod Touch to my receiver and control it with the receiver's remote. All audio data is transferred digitally. The iPod can play MP3s, AACs, uncompressed AIFs and WAVs at higher than CD quality specs. I doubt it can play WMA's or Real Audio, though.

My biggest problem with the iPhone/iPod Touch web browsers is that they cannot download the large PDF manuals from here on Film-Tech. It will show maybe two and a half pages no matter which browser I use. It can display the smaller PDFs just fine, though. It's always good to have access to manuals in the field.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-19-2010, 07:21 PM:
 
The Evo seems to play music with fairly high fidelity, but it lacks any native EQ capability. You need an app for that.

I forgot to mention I ordered an iPhone 4 on 7/11. I hope it gets here before my 30 day trial is up with the Evo.

Poor Apple. The iPhone 4 is their counterpart to Windows Vista. It's tainted now and nothing they do will "fix" its reputation. I'm getting one anyway. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 07:25 PM:
 
I often wonder if the iPhone will play sound with the same quality as the iPod Touch. You would think it would be identical, but the iPhone has to do a lot more than the iPod does and they may have made some sacrifices to get it all to fit in there. I am just speaking out of my ass because I have seen no evidence one way or the other. But you WILL like:

-Being able to assign artwork easily to any individual song or group of songs in iTunes.

-Playlists that play the entire thing.

-Shuffle within any given playlist (something I hear other iPods do not handle well).

-Being able to tell the song when to start or end in iTunes (all of this carries over to the iPod/Phone).

I made sure that I don't let iTunes update my iPod unless I tell it. That way my iTunes and iPhone library do not have to match. I delete songs from iTunes all of the time yet they remain on my iPod, despite iTunes warning otherwise.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-19-2010, 07:45 PM:
 
I hope you like working with one hand David, because if you like to shoulder the phone, you can forget it.

So far no complaints on the Droid X. We'll see as I start to use it more, but there is one thing it definitely does...it actually works as a phone.
 
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 07-19-2010, 08:07 PM:
 
Wonderful what they can do nowadays...
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 08:19 PM:
 
I'd be afraid to use any "smartphone" hunched between my shoulder and my face. They're too skinny to get a good grip. My head would have to be near-horizontal. That would hurt my neck.

Why not use it like this instead?

-
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-19-2010, 08:49 PM:
 
I've had the HTC Evo 4G phone for about six weeks. I don't have as many problems with mine as what David was experiencing with his. Naturally, I'm quite a bit more happy about with it.

I might have considered the Droid X if it had been available in early June, but I needed a new mobile phone and had already been doing without for a couple weeks. Sprint's unlimited data plan, even with the additional $10 "4G" fee, made for a significantly lower phone bill than what I would have paid through AT&T for an iPhone or an Android phone from Verizon.

The only major complaint I have about the HTC Evo 4G is its battery life. Any smart phone with a large LCD screen is going to use up battery life much faster than standard phones. The Evo 4G just takes battery drain to another level. One upshot is the battery is removable and can be easily replaced with a spare. It also doesn't take very long (maybe an hour or two) for the phone to recharge. My old Samsung phone would take around 4 hours to recharge.

I recharge my phone battery usually once per day, usually with between 50% and 30% remaining in the battery. I use the Advanced Task Killer application and also check the phone's running services to shut down anything I don't need running in the background. We don't have 4G service here in Lawton yet, so I leave the 4G and WiFi antenna turned off (Wichita Falls and at least a dozen or so other cities in Texas have 4G).

I think Sprint has better service quality here in Southwest Oklahoma than AT&T. My call quality and reception is certainly quite a bit better.

The HTC Sense user interface is easy enough to use and more visually polished than the straight Android UI. The downside is while Android 2.2 is apparently already running on the Droid X anyone with an Evo 4G will have to wait a few more weeks for HTC to get its Sense UI built on top of it for an update.

I wish someone had told me about Swipe (a unique texting application) before its beta on the Evo 4G was closed. A lady at Oklahoma Blood Institute showed it to me on her Evo 4G and it seemed really cool. I think the Droid X comes with Swipe pre-installed.

quote: David Stambaugh
Apps that are "official" on the iPhone, like the CNN news reader, are only available from unknown 3rd party sources for Android. Netflix is another example.
I'm not sure I understand this complaint. Whether an app is available in Apple's app store or the Android market or is downloaded directly from a specific web site how is anyone going to know for sure whether the app is "official" or not? The most important thing to know is if the app is any good or not.

I haven't installed very many applications on my Evo 4G up to this point, just ones I know will be fun or useful. I'll usually check some reviews and opinions on a couple Android forums before installing.
 
Posted by Julio Roberto (Member # 4976) on 07-19-2010, 10:03 PM:
 
I can only comment on the Samsung Omnia 2.

It runs some flavor of Windows.

The veredict: don't get it either.

Reasonably good as a PDA. Totally worthless as a phone.
 
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 07-19-2010, 10:19 PM:
 
I want my phone to ring when people call me. I want to push numbers on the keypad when I want to call other people.

I don't want a touch screen. I don't want a camera. I don't want a calendar/datebook/notepad. I don't want games. I don't want iApps. I don't want to play music. I don't want slide-out keyboards.

I don't like the form factor. I either want a flip-open phone or I want the Nokia style monoblock phone. I don't want shit that rotates, slides or pops open. More shit to break.

It's a fucking PHONE, not a personal masturbation device.

Besides all that, the thing is too fucking expensive. It's too expensive to purchase. It's too expensive to pay the monthly bills.

I want to flip it open and talk to people. That's all.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-19-2010, 10:31 PM:
 
Take Netflix for example. If I want to manage my Netflix queue on an iPhone, there's an official Netflix-supplied, and Apple-verified, app for that.

If I want to do the same thing on the Evo, I can pick one of the numerous apps available, but none comes from Netflix.

The difference is I don't want to give any login credentials to an unknown and untrusted 3rd party, such as Pageonce, BeeKay, Next Mobile Web, The Hope Machine, Rishi Srivatsavai, Eddie Webb, SilentSmuggler, and pgray16. Those are the "companies" making apps for Android to manage Netflix queue. I'm not giving my login credentials and passing my info through an app that's completely unvetted.

I could live with the Evo. The problem is I've had an iPhone so everything else seems like a step in the wrong direction in too many ways.

I would never shoulder a smartphone. What about a Bluetooth headset?

Randy, I had ZERO interest in any smartphone, let alone one made by Apple, until I used an iPhone to get remote mail access working for some of my users. I thought I didn't want a camera or notes or web browsing or anything other than a functional phone. I learned otherwise and now there's no going back.

EDIT: I came back to edit my post but it's mangled on the edit screen so I'm recomposing parts of this. Sorry.

A couple other things. A lot of businesses use Microsoft Exchange for email, and set up mobile access for their employees. The Exchange admin can enforce a policy requiring mobile users to secure their devices with a PIN so if the phone is lost, there's less chance of compromise.

There's an Android app that easily bypasses the PIN policy. So much for that layer of security. I've read the same thing can be done on an iPhone too but only if the phone is jailbroken (have not confirmed).

Speaking of phones locked with a PIN... To silence an iPhone, I flip a switch on the side of the phone. I can do that without unlocking the phone with the PIN. To silence a PIN-secured Evo, I have to wake up the phone, slide the unlock screen, enter my PIN, press "Unlock", then either hold down the volume-down button or hold down the main sleep switch for several seconds until the menu appears that lets me silence the phone. The point being the PIN lock on the iPhone is far less intrusive and seems less likely to be thwarted. The Evo lock is a big nuisance in comparison.

Again much of this is fixable in software but we're discussing the phones as they work now, not how they might work in the future if the user is patient.
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 07-19-2010, 11:10 PM:
 
I don't have an iphone or a droid but I'm looking at going to a smart phone in the next few months. And I'm glad to hear (from Joe) that the iPod Touch has the best sound, because I just bought one of them for Lynn for our 10th anniversary. Always nice to know I made a good pick! (She loves it, too.)

The one iThing that really bugs me is iTunes. I switched computers recently and made a backup of my iPod songs onto CDs. When I loaded the CDs back into the new computer, a few albums' worth of songs are now missing. No idea how many, yet. I just keep finding new ones not being there when I want to listen to them. #&$#%

Also on iTunes, why don't they make it possible to "stitch" two or more songs together so they automatically play one after the other in shuffle mode? For example, Queen's "We Will Rock You" should always be immediately followed by "We Are the Champions." Alan Parsons' "Sirius" should always be followed by "Eye in the Sky." Pink Floyd's "Speak To Me" should always be followed by the entire rest of the "Dark Side of the Moon" album. And so on.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-19-2010, 11:11 PM:
 
quote: David Stambaugh
The difference is I don't want to give any login credentials to an untrusted 3rd party or risk having that 3rd party snooping around my phone. Netflix apps for Android are offered by "companies" like Pageonce, BeeKay, Next Mobile Web, The Hope Machine, Rishi Srivatsavai, Eddie Webb, SilentSmuggler, and pgray16. They can't manage my queue without me being logged in and passing my info through their app. Not gonna happen.
Thanks for the explanation.

In that regard, I've downloaded Android based applications for managing certain financial accounts (mortgage, credit card accounts, car insurance, etc.) directly from those companies rather than trusting the Android Market on whether what I was seeing was the official application.

Some applications seem a little unnecessary such as ones that are only a watered down mini version of a web site.

I do like how Facebook integrates with my phone book. The mobile version of Yelp integrates with my phone's GPS to add certain features I don't get through the regular Yelp web site. I've had some fun using the language translation app Talk To Me -although it tries to bleep out bad words, but isn't great at censoring words like "shit." Google Sky Map is pretty fun if you're into astronomy at all.

quote: Randy Stankey
I don't want a touch screen. I don't want a camera. I don't want a calendar/datebook/notepad. I don't want games. I don't want iApps. I don't want to play music. I don't want slide-out keyboards.
My problem is too many people I know like texting comments more often than making phone calls. And I've too often found myself in the situation where texting is better than talking -like when you're in a loud night club, bar or rock concert.

I simply cannot tolerate using a standard numerical phone key pad for entering text messages. A smart phone touch screen isn't the easiest thing to use for typing messages, but I can text on it a lot faster than I could ever manage with my old phone.

Originally, I was only looking at a "feature phone" with a full keyboard, such as the Samsung Impression through AT&T. Unfortunately, to qualify for a phone like that I would need to add a $20 per month texting plan or $30 per month data plan on top of the base plan. At that price it seems like you're getting a better bang for the buck going with a smart phone.

Edit - had to add something regarding music on phones:

My new phone definitely works better than my old phone for playing music, but I don't use it for playing music files or listening to radio. Most of the time when I'm listening to music on a portable player I'm working out -bicycling, jogging, lifting weights at the gym, etc. My $50 Sansa Clip+ is perfect for that. The device is small, very easy to use, supports a good variety of music formats, has a built in FM/AM radio, voice recorder and even has a MiniSD card slot. Because the device is small and cheap I'm not nearly as worried about breaking it while exercising as I am of ruining a smart phone.

Also, the Sansa Clip+ will play WAV files off a music CD seamlessly without inserting stupid 2 second breaks in between the songs.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-19-2010, 11:21 PM:
 
Bobby (et al), Sorry, I went back to add something to my post and the forum editor mangled it. I had to recompose a lot of it and it's not the same now as what you quoted. Just wanted to explain that. Not that I changed the general gist of anything I originally said.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-19-2010, 11:45 PM:
 
quote: Mike Blakesley
Also on iTunes, why don't they make it possible to "stitch" two or more songs together so they automatically play one after the other in shuffle mode? For example, Queen's "We Will Rock You" should always be immediately followed by "We Are the Champions." Alan Parsons' "Sirius" should always be followed by "Eye in the Sky." Pink Floyd's "Speak To Me" should always be followed by the entire rest of the "Dark Side of the Moon" album. And so on.
If certain songs are ALWAYS meant to be together, they should be a single file.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-19-2010, 11:50 PM:
 
Mike, if you end up going the iRoute, don't get the 4 unless there is documentation that the proximity detector is truly fixed. Otherwise if you simply must get an iProduct, stick with the 3GS since you can actually use that as a phone.

So far no complaints on the Droid X. It's response is faster than the iPhone 4 too and I LOVE that I can plug it straight into my computer and drag/drop files into and out of it just like an external hard drive instead of having to use that damned iTunes. I have also found it is noticeably easier to hold as a phone, despite the case being just a tiny bit larger and the top end being a little fatter. (That lip makes it easy to pull out of your pocket quickly too.)

The case design was the one major improvement to me on the iPhone 4 was the squared edges made it easier to grasp...but of course that isn't an actual phone, so its back to the rounded slip-out-of-your-hands 3G/3GS for your iPhone options should you simply HAVE to have one. [Razz]
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 07-20-2010, 03:27 AM:
 
quote: Joe Redifer
If certain songs are ALWAYS meant to be together, they should be a single file.
Not necessarily. In one of my examples, the Alan Parsons tunes, you could definitely play "Eye In The Sky" on its own (it was a hit single, after all) but the song "Sirius" segues directly into "Eye" so it sounds dumb if played by itself.

I just am surprised that with all the other bells-n-whistles they can build into software that they haven't thought of this semi-obvious thing.

Brad - thanks for the advice. I'm hearing more and more good things about the Droid phones but by the time I'm ready to get one in a few months, there'll probably be a few more generations gone by.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-20-2010, 04:07 AM:
 
Mike, you can do that in iTunes. Just make sure your tracks are sequentially numbered in the GET INFO screen. Make sure both tracks have the same GROUPING name. Under track number, make sure that the first song is track 1 of 2. The second track should be track 2 of 2. On both tracks, go to the OPTIONS tab and check "Part of a gapless album". Select OK to close the window. In iTunes, go to CONTROLS > SHUFFLE and select "Shuffle by Groupings". Then select "Turn on Shuffle". This way, if track 1 randomly plays, it will always go to track 2. But track 2 can still be selected by itself randomly.

Unfortunately, this does not seem to carry over to the iPod, at least no way that I have yet found.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-20-2010, 11:23 AM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
So far no complaints on the Droid X. It's response is faster than the iPhone 4 too and I LOVE that I can plug it straight into my computer and drag/drop files into and out of it just like an external hard drive instead of having to use that damned iTunes.
That's a feature I like about my HTC Evo 4G. I can charge the phone's battery while having it attached as a USB external disc drive. The USB cable also comes with a wall power outlet adapter for conventional charging.

With my old Samsung phone I used the MiniSD card a lot for transferring files between the phone and computer. The arrangement with my Evo 4G is more simple. And it's a good thing too. The MiniSD card in the Evo 4G is tucked deep in the phone, under the battery.
[Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-20-2010, 11:39 AM:
 
USB mode is "trickle charge" on the Evo, will take substantially longer to charge the battery than using the AC adapter. iPhone is the same way.

The stock Evo battery is rated at 1500 mAh. The largest aftermarket battery I can find right now is 1700 mAh. If one comes out that's > 2000 mAh that might be worth getting.

The Evo is indeed substantially faster than my old iPhone 3G. It runs circles around it in terms of, say, rendering a web page.

EDIT: I'm told by a fellow Evo user that there's an 1800 mAh battery for the Evo and that's the limit for a 1-cell battery. Someone is offering a 2-cell 3600 mAh too. The 3600 is larger and requires a new rear case piece for the Evo, and of course that makes the phone itself thicker and thus standard phone protective cases won't fit it any more.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-20-2010, 12:09 PM:
 
Seidio sells a 3500mAh extended battery for the Evo.

Trickle charge is correct, but typically that's limited by the USB port.

FWIW, my wife has been an iphone user since the 2G iphone... she recently made the switch to an Evo and LOVES it.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-20-2010, 12:17 PM:
 
Yeah, it's 3500, not 3600. Seidio 3500 mAh Evo Battery
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-20-2010, 04:34 PM:
 
quote: David Stambaugh
The Evo is indeed substantially faster than my old iPhone 3G. It runs circles around it in terms of, say, rendering a web page.
Yeah, the default Safari browser is horribly slow and poor. This is due to Apple's incompetent browser-programming abilities, which are extremely lacking. There is an App called the Atomic Web Browser which is a shit-ton faster than Safari. Unfortunately it costs 99 cents. You can download the free version, but it won't remember bookmarks or where you left of browsing. Anyone who likes Safari on the iPhone/iPod is an idiot.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-20-2010, 09:37 PM:
 
The iphone's safari browser may not be the greatest by any means, but Opera's browser for the iphone/ipod is truly awful. Sure, it renders faster and better than safari, but it's useless since they never included ability to do incremental zooms. If you double-tap on the screen it goes to being an extreme close-up view. There's no option to zoom somewhere in between. Essentially, you get the option of viewing the page from way too far away to read anything or be zoomed in to nearly pixel layer. And it's too bad, because most everything else I've seen from Opera was ok.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-20-2010, 10:19 PM:
 
quote: Chris Slycord
Opera's browser for the iphone/ipod is truly awful.
Agreed. I tried it once, muttered "WTF is this crap?" and deleted it.
 
Posted by John Joseph Fink (Member # 3619) on 07-20-2010, 10:37 PM:
 
Since the new update I honestly haven't had any issues with running iOS 4 on the iPhone 4, places I dropped signals were areas I always had poor reception, but I haven't had any issues even if I touch the "magic spot". Still I'll take my free bumper when the application goes online.

I agree iOS 4 did run slow on my old iPhone 3G, but I'm impressed with iPhone 4 on all fronts.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-21-2010, 12:01 AM:
 
^^^
But you'll notice that people were having signals dropping from having full-signal to nothing. Sure, there's gonna be variation amongst different locations by one location having an amazingly strong signal and another having just enough to trigger the "full signal" bars on the phone, but that still doesn't explain it going to zero bars.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-21-2010, 03:17 AM:
 
Mike Blakesly I demand many thanks for solving your iTunes problem.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-21-2010, 03:24 AM:
 
Chris, I'm sure I don't have to point this out to you, but I do want to stress for the readers that may have skimmed that I had ZERO problems with the antenna or reception on my iP4. I would have probably kept it out of ignorance had the proximity detector not screwed me over on every call.

I will also give kudos towards the iPhone, as there is one feature of it that I had totally forgotten about until I got a voicemail this morning. Only the iPhone stores your voicemail messages ON the phone, so I can play them in any order I need and back it up, etc effortlessly. That is the only thing I honestly miss from the iPhone 3/4. Oh well, other than that one thing, I am finding the Droid X is winning on all other aspects as compared to my previous iP3, notably in sound quality. I'll have to give it a good week or two of use to truly be able to decide the pros and cons, but I don't regret the decision at all.
 
Posted by Lyle Romer (Member # 1266) on 07-21-2010, 08:21 AM:
 
One note on the signal bars and all the variation you can see. The bars are not an indication of signal strength. They are based on an algorithm that mostly considers signal quality. Basically it's a signal/noise ratio but since the phone can't measure that it's based on error rates calculated from known data that is always the same in the control channel signal.

So it's very possible to be in a relatively weak signal area with very little interference and show full bars but then walk a little bit and hit a little interference and have it drop.

Additionally the carriers put pressure on the manufacturers to err on the side of more bars. They don't want you looking down at 1 or 2 bars all the time. This is a big reason (battery life was a smaller factor) that phones stopped having service indicator LEDs. The carriers realized that if you didn't have the red LED to alert you that there was no coverage most of the time you'd be back in coverage before making or recieving a call and never know that you had a dead spot.
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-21-2010, 10:34 AM:
 
I agree... When my AT&T contract is up I'm done with this phone. Don't know what I will switch to at this point in time. There may be other choices in a years time... In my case phone coverage is pretty good, especially considering some of the out of the way places I go to. What I don't like is the shoddy construction of the iPhone. I am an my third phone! Absolute crap... Oh and did I mention all the long ridiculous downloads and updates for both the phone and I-toones. I hope this one lasts to the end of the contract...
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-21-2010, 11:07 AM:
 
Updates for Android and Evo firmware etc. are very frequent. Switching from the iPhone to another device isn't necessarily going to change that situation at all.

Shoddy construction in what way? If you drop the phone a lot, whether it's an iPhone or something else, it's gonna break. Get AppleCare or whatever your carrier offers. Read the plans carefully though. Sprint will tell you their package covers all problems including dropped phones etc. but in the fine print there's a $50 or $100 deductible to replace the phone, depending on the model phone you have. My iPhone 3G flew out of my shirt pocket when I was running across a busy street to beat traffic. It landed on the pavement and survived, probably because I had a nice thick case on it to absorb most of the impact.

I had forgotten until Brad mentioned it that the iPhone stores voicemails on the phone. That is indeed a very cool feature.

My coworker whose Evo keeps crashing since he uninstalled a particular app has learned that this problem seems to only affect Evos that are Hardware Rev. 2, which was the initial rollout model. Subsequent builds of the Evo are Rev. 3 and don't seem to be affected by this problem. That's anecdotal for sure though.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-21-2010, 11:10 AM:
 
quote: Brad
I will also give kudos towards the iPhone, as there is one feature of it that I had totally forgotten about until I got a voicemail this morning. Only the iPhone stores your voicemail messages ON the phone, so I can play them in any order I need and back it up, etc effortlessly. That is the only thing I honestly miss from the iPhone 3/4. Oh well, other than that one thing, I am finding the Droid X is winning on all other aspects as compared to my previous iP3, notably in sound quality. I'll have to give it a good week or two of use to truly be able to decide the pros and cons, but I don't regret the decision at all.
Tried Google Voice?
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-21-2010, 11:23 AM:
 
I must be the only person in the world who isn't enthusiastic about handing over my life's personal details to Google whose business model is to mine that data for ways to sell me stuff. OK I admit I don't know anything about Google Voice but I'm just sayin'.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-21-2010, 11:42 AM:
 
quote: David Stambaugh
My coworker whose Evo keeps crashing since he uninstalled a particular app has learned that this problem seems to only affect Evos that are Hardware Rev. 2, which was the initial rollout model. Subsequent builds of the Evo are Rev. 3 and don't seem to be affected by this problem. That's anecdotal for sure though.
David, can you find out what the specific application that was causing your friend's phone crashes? My Evo 4G is apparently a "Rev 2" phone (Model PC36100 Hardware Version 0002). The only phone crash I've had that resulted in a re-boot was once while skimming for radio stations with the radio application. Maybe I've been lucky.

One of my close friends had an issue with his Evo 4G phone rebooting repeatedly during the first weekend he had it (early June). It turned out to be an issue with the Advanced Task Killer application, an issue that was fixed with an update. Still the Sprint folks say ATK was really designed for the plain Android OS and not the HTC Sense UI layer. My phone has received at least 3 or more software updates since early June.

It seems like I'm updating Android applications more often than the phone's OS software. I installed Yelp a few days ago. Sunday morning I woke to the sound of my phone making cutesy chirp noises. It had an update for Yelp. The "Monocle" feature in Yelp is pretty cool. Foursquare has Yelp integration, but I don't think I'm going to install that app. Yeah, you can tell your friends you're at a certain restaurant and put that on your Facebook page. But then anyone who can see your Facebook or Foursquare posts will know you're not at home. One of those viewers may feel free to rob your house.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-21-2010, 12:45 PM:
 
No, I have never researched it. What is Google voice?
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-21-2010, 12:50 PM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
What is Google voice?
Google it. [Smile]
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-21-2010, 02:48 PM:
 
Brad - http://www.google.com/googlevoice/about.html

Bobby - ATK is the biggest problem with Android. That is, android is NOT a Windows computer.

First question I ask anyone when they are having problems with their phone is if they are using a task killer. While they can be helpful they are typically more harm than good. One of the guys I work with was unable to get his work email to EVER work on his phone, the moment he quit using ATK everything worked fine.

Most people don't realize/understand that Android runs different than their windows computer. Kind of like how most people don't realize that projectionists handle film and thread projectors and just don't hit play on a DVD.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-21-2010, 02:54 PM:
 
I don't have any problems getting e-mail to work on my phone with ATK in use. My battery life sucks a lot worse if I let the phone keep many numerous applications and services running in the background when they're not needed.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-21-2010, 03:26 PM:
 
I'm still trying to find out what the app is that caused the Evo crashing problem. Will get back with that.

I've pretty much stopped using the app killer. Not convinced it does any real good (not denying it either). I've also noticed the battery life seems somewhat better now than the first week or so I had the phone, perhaps due to the battery being "conditioned"?

Here's a plus for the Evo: It has the best display quality in bright sunlight I've seen on any mobile device or camera. Very legible. Most LCD screens wash out so bad in bright sunlight they're almost unusable.

EDIT: OK, here's the rest of the story with the "crashing app". The app is "World Newspapers - Top News". It turns out the guy's SD card became completely full around the time he installed that app, and the phone's internal memory may have also been full. This guy downloads and installs anything and everything. He had to do a hard reset on the phone to cure it, no problems since then, even with that app installed.
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 07-21-2010, 05:47 PM:
 
quote: Joe Redifer
Mike Blakesly I demand many thanks for solving your iTunes problem.
Thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks

I'll send additional thanks after I give it a try...haven't had a chance yet. Thanks. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-21-2010, 06:13 PM:
 
Sorry, just not feelin' it.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-21-2010, 08:16 PM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
I don't have any problems getting e-mail to work on my phone with ATK in use. My battery life sucks a lot worse if I let the phone keep many numerous applications and services running in the background when they're not needed.
This guy was unknowingly killing everything and anything. Clock (so his alarm didn't work), Email (so email didn't push)... etc. He owns a different android phone.

ATK isn't a bad thing (not saying that it's a good thing) when used properly.

Can't wait until my upgrade... goodbye Hero and hello Evo (unless something else promising other than the Epic is announced).
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-22-2010, 04:40 AM:
 
quote: Matt Johnston
Brad - http://www.google.com/googlevoice/about.html
Oh my! I know what I am going to setup in the next day or two!
 
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 07-22-2010, 06:33 AM:
 
Yeah...I thought so too. It's not available outside the USA so far it seems. [Frown]

Besides, Apple haven't OK'd the app. (Not that that would stop most people.) [evil]

Link
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-27-2010, 06:08 PM:
 
I've had my new iPhone 4 for one day now. 1 DAY. I am not afraid to call a steaming pile of shit when I see it so here goes.

I answered an incoming call today that turned out to be a robocall from Sprint customer service about my experience with Sprint (which I have no complaints about). Sure, I'll take your little survey, am happy to say something good about a company that treated me ok. I enabled the numeric keypad on the phone so I could respond to the questions, put it back up to my ear, AND IT STARTED PRESSING RANDOM DIGITS TO THE POINT WHERE THEY HUNG UP ON ME! Oh f**k me.

That malfunction never happened to me even once, not a single time, with my old iPhone 3G.

Brad's experience (and now mine) is clearly not isolated. http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2475236&start=0&tstart=90

If this continues I'll have to exchange this for something else, even if it's a 3G-S. WTH! This phone seems clearly defective in its current implementation.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-27-2010, 06:11 PM:
 
Yup. This is the part where I get to say "I told you so", right?

Remember, you have 30 days to tell AT&T as well as Steve Jobs to **** it.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-27-2010, 06:30 PM:
 
I wasn't even "shouldering" the phone. I hope this is fixable in software, and soon. [Mad]
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-27-2010, 07:20 PM:
 
Apple likes to let their customers do the beta testing. It's cheaper and most people will praise Apple for it because they are Apple.
 
Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 07-27-2010, 11:03 PM:
 
quote: Joe Redifer
Apple likes to let their customers do the beta testing. It's cheaper and most people will praise Apple for it because they are Apple.
They probably also figured that if it worked for Microsoft, then it should work for us too...
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-27-2010, 11:42 PM:
 
It worked for Microsoft? When did that ever happen? I thought most PC customers figured "that's the way it is, I guess we have to live with it." How many Microsoft engineers does it take to change a light bulb? None. Microsoft just declares darkness the new standard.

When it comes to Apple, any change or even malfunction is fashionable. An iPhone4 hanging up intermittently is the new black. Get an iPad and shitty wifi reception to go with it! Fashion plate!
 
Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 07-28-2010, 12:42 AM:
 
It seems that just about every MS OS has updates followed by cumulative service packs very shortly after its wide commercial release. With all these problems they still have close to or over 90% of the home/business pc market. So, I'd say it's "worked" for them.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-28-2010, 03:23 AM:
 
quote: Jeremy Weigel
With all these problems they still have close to or over 90% of the home/business pc market.
And where are you getting this data from?

Take every computer out there currently in daily (or lets be super nice and say monthly) use in the world.

Here are your choices...
1. Linux OS based
2. Microsoft OS based
3. Apple OS based

Now lets hear some numbers. Don't count "phones" and things like that. Actual computers/servers only.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-28-2010, 08:26 AM:
 
Well, if it's servers, then a recent netcraft survey showed that ~46% of webservers were powered by linux/other unixes and just over 41% of them were windows-based. Though I think the unix number should be higher since they included MacOS X server as a "non-unix" when it's actually certified as one. But whatever.

But in desktops, it's still dominated by MS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-28-2010, 12:41 PM:
 
Various kinds of malware are written to attack the biggest target. That means Windows based computers by a wide margin. Most personal computers are Windows based and the vast majority of businesses (the vast majority of which are small businesses) use Windows-based machines. Chances are much greater a thief will score bank account numbers and other valuable data by tailoring malware to attack PCs.

Lots of web servers are Linux-based, which is also why they're targeted by criminals -but not nearly as much as Windows-based PCs.

Mac-based computers represent a far smaller target of opportunity. Not nearly as many people use them. Of those who do use them their collective demographic isn't as loaded with money as the PC demographic.

If 70% to 90% of the computers in use were Mac-based those virus writers in former Soviet republics would have Apple constantly issuing security patches just like what happens with Windows now.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 07-28-2010, 12:50 PM:
 
Back to the iPhone 4: I called Apple support today to register an official complaint about the proximity detection issue. The tech was very familiar with that complaint. Their official response is "we're aware of the problem and still trying to determine whether it's hardware, software, or a combination of both". They offered to swap my phone out but with no assurance that would fix the specific problem. At least I have a case number and it's in the record that I complained about this. The rep was very courteous and, as a bonus I think English was his native language. [Smile]

Separately, I see iOS 4.1 is in beta. There are mixed anecdotal reports as to whether it addresses or fixes the proximity detection issue.

On the plus side, my iPhone 4 battery seems to hold up much better than the EVO battery. If they can just fix the spaz attacks occurring in the middle of calls...
 
Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 07-28-2010, 12:53 PM:
 
Net Market Share

PC World
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-28-2010, 03:50 PM:
 
I want to see those graphs with Windows divided up into all of the separate editions like Windows Home Edition, Windows Home Office Edition, Windows Children's Edition, Windows Business Lite Edition, Windows Business Full Edition, Windows Prosumer Edition, Windows Professional Edition, Windows Complete Edition and Windows Server Edition... for Windows XP and 7, please.
 
Posted by Jeremy Weigel (Member # 4208) on 07-28-2010, 04:00 PM:
 
Here ya go Joe.

or this one.
 
Posted by Scott Jentsch (Member # 1681) on 07-29-2010, 11:48 AM:
 
The perfect solution for people who want to shoulder their cell phone:

Novophone

I'm actually thinking about giving one to my brother, who's always complaining about how hard it is to hold onto his cellphone...
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-29-2010, 12:19 PM:
 
There's also a handset just like that except it uses bluetooth (no cord).
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-30-2010, 10:37 AM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
So far no complaints on the Droid X. We'll see as I start to use it more, but there is one thing it definitely does...it actually works as a phone.
With a couple weeks passed how do you like the Droid X? Did it come with Android 2.2 "Froyo" (or Frodo, Bilbo or whatever it is) already loaded?

I saw a news headline saying Sprint will have its Android 2.2 update available for the HTC Evo 4G next Tuesday, Aug. 3. That update will be gradually pushed out in "waves" to Evo 4G phones through the middle of the month to keep from bogging down the Sprint network. Sprint customers can manually download the update starting Tuesday. The OS update is supposed to add some other features that were glaringly absent before, such as voice dialing over Bluetooth.

BTW, I saw another funny news item from PC Magazine where it refuted Apple's videos of showing "death grip" issues on other phones, particularly the Droid X. The headline was: "Apple's Droid X 'Death Grip' Claim: Bogus"
[Razz]
 
Posted by Jake Spell (Member # 5294) on 07-30-2010, 11:00 AM:
 
Iv had my Droid X for a week now and love it! It does not come with 2.2, but does do voice dialing. The major thing that 2.2 will have is the ability to see Flash content.

As far as the phone's functionality it is super easy to use, and Verizon is a much better network than AT&T. Plus Google has some pretty neat stuff, like Goggles. I had a BB Bold and my Dad had an iPhone 3G. We both are very happy with the Droid X

As far as a Death Grip, I haven't found it. I have never dropped a call and it even works win my house, something that no other phone can do,
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-30-2010, 01:55 PM:
 
Voice dialing is only for pompous assholes who feel self-important enough to talk to inanimate objects. I am always annoyed by those around me who use it.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 07-30-2010, 02:08 PM:
 
To be fair, you're likely annoyed by the ones who don't use it too. [Wink]
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-30-2010, 07:29 PM:
 
Bobby - The 2.2 update for the Evo is up on HTC's site if you dig around for it a little bit [Wink]
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-30-2010, 10:07 PM:
 
Good thing, too! You wouldn't want to make an update easily accessible. That's just wrong!
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 07-31-2010, 04:52 PM:
 
I think I'll probably just wait for the update to get "pushed" to my phone. If there's any nasty bugs in the update they'll be known in the first couple days and then possibly fixed before my phone gets the update at all.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 07-31-2010, 06:06 PM:
 
Good call! HTC tweeted (I guess that's what it's called?) and said that this one is NOT the official and there ARE reports of it being buggy.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-04-2010, 01:18 PM:
 
I ended up waiting only a day after release for Sprint to push Android 2.2 to my phone. The HTC Sense interface received an update. Some new applications have come along as well. Flash 10.1 for Android 2.2 is still in Beta; I think I'll hold off installing that until the "gold code" is released. Anyone have any idea with Swype is going to get officially released?
 
Posted by Jake Spell (Member # 5294) on 08-04-2010, 06:15 PM:
 
Swipe is on the Droid X and HTC my touch and works very well
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-05-2010, 09:44 AM:
 
I'm not having much luck finding out when Swype will be made available for the HTC Evo 4G. With it already available for the HTC HD2 it would seem the Evo 4G would follow suit quickly.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-05-2010, 11:02 AM:
 
Late Edit: I did a little more looking in my phone and discovered Adobe Flash 10.1 came bundled with Froyo. However, certain web sites that utilize Flash (such as YouTube, Facebook, etc.) need to update the mobile versions of their web sites for the Flash player to be useful. I'm not sure what websites I can visit to test drive the Flash player properly (the phone already had basic Flash support for .SWF based web page graphics).
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-05-2010, 11:25 AM:
 
You should be able to view Youtube without Flash, same with Facebook. Anyway, can't you change the identifier on your mobile browser so that web sites think it is a REAL browser instead and therefore give you the REAL site?
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-05-2010, 11:54 AM:
 
I'm not sure how you change the mobile device identifier on the web browser to get it to load the real web site instead of the mobile version. The mobile versions of Facebook and YouTube work okay, but they kind of suck compared to the full fledged versions you can see on a regular computer. I need to have my phone connected via 4G or WiFi to get a "high quality" video mode with YouTube. FB's mobile Android app doesn't give access to any of the games or other applications associated with Facebook.

I loaded Rotten Tomatoes' web site (which tried to get me to install their app) and was able to watch a couple movie trailers in Flash Video format. It worked seemed to work okay, even allowing you to tap a full screen mode. Downside: video can be choppy when streaming real time over 3G; it works better if you let it buffer. To be fair I see this issue with streaming video all the time on regular computers.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-05-2010, 12:23 PM:
 
quote: Bobby Henderson
FB's mobile Android app doesn't give access to any of the games or other applications associated with Facebook.
You say that like it is a bad thing.
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 08-05-2010, 02:19 PM:
 
I just upgraded to the iPhone 4. No problems with the proximity sensor, but it didhave the death grip issue; this doesn't bother me much as i always have a case for my phone. I may have to return the phone as there is discoloration in photos when i take pictures. I'll post an example later.
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 08-05-2010, 04:20 PM:
 
Here's the pic.

-
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-06-2010, 12:29 AM:
 
How the hell did you transfer that off of your iPhone? I thought Apple did not allow transfers from phone to computer, only from computer to phone. I have to download a 3rd party app to transfer MP3s and the such from my iPod Touch to the computer.

But yeah, that discoloration is unacceptable.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-06-2010, 02:49 AM:
 
When I had an iPhone I always emailed them to myself. Of course now that I have a non-iProduct, I can simply plug the phone into the USB of my computer and it acts like an external hard drive.
 
Posted by Demetris Thoupis (Member # 833) on 08-06-2010, 07:26 AM:
 
What I like about the iPhones

1. It is the gadget phone of the century whether we like it or not
2. Its SINGLE tasking ability makes it fast and smooth to operate
3. It feels good on your fingers

What I DON'T Like about iPhone

1. It sucks bigtime for business users (company e-mails e.t.c) unless you are willing to jailbreak it or pay insane amounts of money for aps.
2. Everyone things is the BEST phone while it is not
3. Its pricing is ridiculous
4. Even with the new Multitasking abilities, still it lacks the maneuvability of the Android phones
5. Everyone just gets one because it is just `cool` and they thing is the best phone ever to be created from GOD!
6. The iTunes unlocking once purchased and the sometimes lockdown after firmware upgrades (note this was on a 3G phone upgraded via iTunes from a MacBook Pro!!!)

I have NEVER owned an iPhone. My girlfriend wanted one and I got her one but its not a phone I would ever like to use

What I like about my HTC Hero Android
1. Its sleek and it is an iPhone killer [Smile]
2. It supports multitasking to the max even when you don't need it
3. It's the most social network phone ever with continuous status updates on the fly.
4. It integrates excellent with my office Exchange server and I am directly calendar and e-mail linked to it perhaps even better than Windows mobile OS phones.
5. The flow of it is gorgeous but not as sleek as iPhone due to the multitasking on the back.
6. Live backgrounds make it more beautiful
7. Customizable scenes allow me to have moods and widgets set on the phone for work, personal, discreet at the press of a button.
8. It is NOT an iPhone
9. Most of the aps are free and work excellent
10. The 2.1 Android OS that I did a few weeks ago improved a lot of things that I would have listed in the don't like list.
11. The fact that when you lock the phone via password if it is stolen and one tries to unlock it without the correct password it will simply self destruct in Mission Impossible style!!! [Big Grin]

What I don't like about my HTC Hero
1. As with any Android the battery dies easily due to multitasking and screen usage.
2. Not being able to select multiple e-mails or messages to delete while having to select one by one.

Demetris
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 08-06-2010, 09:28 AM:
 
quote: Demetris Thoupis
It sucks bigtime for business users (company e-mails e.t.c) unless you are willing to jailbreak it or pay insane amounts of money for aps.
Huh? It natively supports Exchange ActiveSync as well as or better than any mobile device. What are you talking about?

So one of my two work colleagues updated his EVO to "froyo" this week. His battery life is now much worse. He can't make it through a single day without recharging. He'd already bought a 2nd battery for it and yesterday he had to swap batteries in mid-afternoon for the first time.

I can comfortably make it through two days with my iPhone 4. [Smile] Still waiting for a proximity sensor fix though. And avoiding opening PDF files until that fix is released. [uhoh]
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-06-2010, 09:51 AM:
 
quote: Brad Miller
Of course now that I have a non-iProduct, I can simply plug the phone into the USB of my computer and it acts like an external hard drive.
And that's exactly the way it should be. The iPhone has no excuse whatsoever for not doing this, it's absurd.

quote: Demetris Thoupis
6. Live backgrounds make it more beautiful
What does that even mean?

quote:
11. The fact that when you lock the phone via password if it is stolen and one tries to unlock it without the correct password it will simply self destruct in Mission Impossible style!!!
There is a free app for the iPhone from Apple which lets you log in to your phone and erase it if you lose it. I can't remember all of the details, but you don't even need to wait for someone to get an incorrect password. The bad thing is you probably have to do it from another iPhone, not sure.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-06-2010, 10:05 AM:
 
There's plenty of good/bad about Apple's iPhone and the various Android phones. There's a lot I like about my HTC Evo 4G. The only things I don't like is the battery life and other people asking, "is that an iPhone?"

The price of AT&T's service plans and Steve Jobs' worsening "we're not supporting any technology that wasn't invented here" philosophy were the deal breakers for me considering an iPhone. It's also annoying how the iPhone and certain other products from Apple are catering more towards fashion rather than function -like having a battery that can be removed/replaced. I think every phone or portable music player should allow simple file transfers via USB cable and/or MicroSD card. Most Android phones support both. The iPhone supports neither.

A big plus in the favor of Google's Android OS is that it's open to good ideas from anywhere. Obviously there are trade-offs with that, like security threats from applications that haven't been policed by Google or others well enough. With companies like AT&T and Verizon now plotting to have smart phones act like credit cards and ruin the business of Visa and Mastercard all smart phone makers will have to be incresingly vigilant in improving security and guarding against identity theft.

I don't think Android is the iPhone killer, at least not in the short term. It could be the Blackberry killer though. I don't think the new Blackberry Torch is going to do all that well. One of my friends ditched his Blackberry Curve for an HTC Evo 4G.

Apple's iPhone and iPod products still have so much fashion chic that countless droves of people will still buy those products even if vastly superior alternatives are available. Eventually every fashion trend becomes dated and then shunned. I already see iPods as something tied to last decade. At some point Apple will have to "refresh" its products to keep them relevant with people who buy iPods and iPhones more as pieces of fashion jewelry than gadgets.

quote: David Stambaugh
So one of my two work colleagues updated his EVO to "froyo" this week. His battery life is now much worse. He can't make it through a single day without recharging.
The battery life on my phone has improved a little. However, i turned off a lot of the auto synchronizing stuff various applications do in the background. The battery life still isn't all that great. However, it takes only an hour for the battery to recharge. My old phone would take what seemed like half a day to recharge.
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 08-06-2010, 10:47 AM:
 
quote: Demetris
What I DON'T Like about iPhone

1. It sucks bigtime for business users (company e-mails e.t.c) unless you are willing to jailbreak it or pay insane amounts of money for aps.
2. Everyone things is the BEST phone while it is not
3. Its pricing is ridiculous
4. Even with the new Multitasking abilities, still it lacks the maneuvability of the Android phones
5. Everyone just gets one because it is just `cool` and they thing is the best phone ever to be created from GOD!
6. The iTunes unlocking once purchased and the sometimes lockdown after firmware upgrades (note this was on a 3G phone upgraded via iTunes from a MacBook Pro!!!)
1. Not a business user so I can't comment; however, other most apps tend to cost .99 to 9.99 and yes there's more expensive apps than that, but I'm sure they're equally priced on the other smart phones.

2. This is a matter of opinion. They think it is, you think it isn't. I like mine but is it the best ever? Don't know as I have used the Droid X or Evo.

3. It's pricing appears to be in line with other smart phones. My 16gb cost $199 w contract and the 32gb is $299, and without contract it's $599 and $699 (I think). Droid X is about the same from what I saw.

4. I don't know what you mean by this but it's easy to move around the phone with finger swipes and what not.

5. I'm sure Droid X and Evo fans feel the same way about their phones.

6. Apple doesn't allow unlocking here because of their deal with ATT but there's ways of getting around that.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 08-06-2010, 11:01 AM:
 
The guy with the Evo battery life getting worse since updating to "froyo" thinks it's the Facebook app. It can't be killed, always comes back, and seems to be constantly syncing. When I had my Evo I deleted that app so don't have any experience with it.

Everyone is trying to now paint the iPhone as being a fashion statement rather than a competent mobile device. That's the new iPhone 4 backlash. That's absurd. Well, it's mostly absurd. OK, it was absurd until the iPhone 4 came out. [Smile] But seriously, I don't give a DAMN about owning a fashion statement phone. I want a reliable mobile device and I need to be able to get through 24 hours without worrying about the battery dying on me. If Apple will just fix the proximity sensor issue, and the PDF security thing (which they have already announced will be fixed), the iPhone 4 comes closest to the ideal mobile device for me. If that makes me your grandma because I like the iPhone, so be it. [Big Grin]

Oh yeah, someone else here with some other Android device had to pay $20 for a decent email app to interface with our corporate email system. iPhone has been able to do that natively since iOS 3 was released. Evo had that function implemented correctly right from the start though.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-06-2010, 11:30 AM:
 
quote: Mike Heenan
It's pricing appears to be in line with other smart phones. My 16gb cost $199 w contract and the 32gb is $299, and without contract it's $599 and $699 (I think). Droid X is about the same from what I saw.
The price of the phone doesn't mean much. The price of the plan across its 2-year contract is a much bigger issue. I would be paying roughly $30 more per month with AT&T for the service plan I have with Sprint. Verizon's plans are pretty expensive too.

quote: Mike Heenan
Apple doesn't allow unlocking here because of their deal with ATT but there's ways of getting around that.
With all the news coverage about "jailbreaking" and even the US Library of Congress weighing in saying jailbreaking is legal (even though it may violate AT&T's and Apple's terms of service) that should serve as a big signal to Apple to be more accommodating to its customers. Not much can be done regarding someone wanting to jailbreak an iPhone to use it on another service carrier. But it's a big problem in terms of customer service if a user has to jailbreak his iPhone just to use a certain application/function.

quote: David Stambaugh
The guy with the Evo battery life getting worse since updating to "froyo" thinks it's the Facebook app. It can't be killed, always comes back, and seems to be constantly syncing.
He needs to go to the "settings" menu, choose "accounts & sync" and then uncheck "background data" and "auto-sync." I placed a "sync all" button on my phone's home screen so if I need to sync Facebook, Twitter, e-mail accounts, etc. it will do it all from there.

quote: David Stambaugh
Everyone is trying to now paint the iPhone as being a fashion statement rather than a competent mobile device. That's the new iPhone 4 backlash. That's absurd. Well, it's mostly absurd. OK, it was absurd until the iPhone 4 came out.
I disagree. This issue is nothing new at all.

Apple has been using fashion and attractive youth at the center of its marketing for roughly a decade. The only commercials where I see people as pretty as those in an iPod commercial are ads for Valtrex! The thing that has become absolutely absurd is Apple going overboard with making its products pretty at the cost of making them properly functionable and serviceable. It's one thing for a disposable iPod or iPhone to have a battery that cannot be removed or replaced. It's another thing when the company starts doing the same nonsense with notebook computers.

Other computing and electronics companies try to make their products look and seem cool, but not to the degree Apple does. The battery life on the Evo 4G isn't great, but at least the battery can be swapped for another. The battery can be replaced without having to replace the whole freaking phone.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 08-06-2010, 11:51 AM:
 
I'm not disagreeing at all that Apple designs and markets its products as fashionable. The fashionable part is of no interest to me though. If it was, I wouldn't hide the phone in an ugly case like I do. Maybe I'm an exception.

As far as the non-removable battery, I agree with that too. I've said it many times. Yes I would prefer the battery to be removable just as a design philosophy thing. But in reality, I never had any need to remove the battery in my iPhone 3G in almost 2 years of using it so it became a non-issue. I don't see that changing with the iPhone 4, so far anyway.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-06-2010, 11:58 AM:
 
Joe,
The "live background" bit he was referring to is that in Android you can have the screen's background wallpaper be a live thing that you can possibly interact with by touching the screen.

It's essentially eyecandy that kills your battery.
 
Posted by Mike Heenan (Member # 392) on 08-09-2010, 11:52 AM:
 
So I posted my photo on macrumors and it appears others have the same problem but the consensus was that it's actually a software problem with white balance issues, not a fault of the phone itself. It appears that when photos are taken under fluorescent lighting, this spot will appear. And not just on the iphone but on other phones as well (or ones with the same software issues).
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 08-09-2010, 12:44 PM:
 
quote: Chris Slycord
you can have the screen's background wallpaper be a live thing that you can possibly interact with by touching the screen
That's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard of. What possible good could it be? Please, enlighten me because I don't have a smart phone yet but plan to get one this year, if I can find a smart enough one.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-09-2010, 01:43 PM:
 
I'm not sure how animated, interactive wall paper would be useful in a smart phone; I guess it just makes it seem more glitzy. I'm happy with static background images. Plus those images don't drain the battery as fast.

There is an endless supply of stupid, pointless applications available for iPhone and Android platforms. This weekend a guy with a Droid X showed me a police light/siren application. The guy thought it was a cool app, but I considered it really stupid (I didn't tell the guy what I thought). The app just makes the screen flash red and blue and puts out a siren sound. He was laughing saying, "you can scare other drivers by holding this up to your windshield." I have a hard time believing anyone would be fooled by that.

At least some of the sound board and fart noise applications are funny, but I have no desire to install any of that crap on my phone either.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-09-2010, 01:57 PM:
 
You just gotta love those "flashlight" applications that cost at least $1 and do nothing but show a bright white screen. Or the "mirror" ones that basically just show a black screen.
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-09-2010, 02:03 PM:
 
The Android 2.2/HTC Sense update for my phone bundled in a flash light application. It turns on the camera flash LEDs and has three brightness levels. The application is kind of amusing, but a real flash light is still better. The LEDs can also be used as a top light for shooting video instead of camera flash only. Convenient for those "girls gone wild" moments at the night club.
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-09-2010, 03:57 PM:
 
quote: Mike Blakesley
That's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard of. What possible good could it be? Please, enlighten me because I don't have a smart phone yet but plan to get one this year, if I can find a smart enough one.
quote: Chris Slycord
It's essentially eyecandy that kills your battery.
[Razz]
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 08-09-2010, 09:21 PM:
 
Reminds me of the Mitch Hedberg line, "Some people call this a flashlight...I call it a battery-slowly-drainer."
 
Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 08-09-2010, 10:52 PM:
 
As an example, I recall seeing a background someone recorded on youtube where it looked like an electrical circuit for the device and some of the lines would light up like electricity was flowing and you could tap on a chip to make it light up and send along something that looked like a signal.

It's a way for your friends to go "wow."
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 09-19-2010, 08:13 PM:
 
I gave Apple the benefit of the doubt and waited for the promised proximity sensor fix with iOS 4.1. Not only did 4.1 not fix the problem for me, I believe it made it worse. AppleCare offered to swap the phone out but said it probably would not fix my problem. Well then. No matter how well the iPhone 4 does everything else, if it can't perform its core function, it's of no use to me. So yesterday I returned my iPhone and got a Samsung Captivate. Yes it runs Android. I debated about swapping for an iPhone 3GS but dammit I refuse to move backwards. I'll adapt to the other Android-related crap as long as the *phone* works. AT&T gave me no trouble at all doing the exchange even though I was beyond their 30 days return window and they could have sent me to Apple to sort it out.

Apple iPhone 4 = Apple's Windows Vista.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-19-2010, 11:35 PM:
 
Beware David, AT&T gave me no problems at all either...and now they are charging me $150 for "early cancellation" fee and being a major pain in the ass about it.
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-20-2010, 02:10 AM:
 
AT&T is the devil.
 
Posted by Manny Montes (Member # 5639) on 09-20-2010, 05:20 AM:
 
The only problem I have with my iphone is that it comes with AT&T [Mad]
 
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 09-20-2010, 05:25 AM:
 
I dropped calls like crazy when I lived in Los Angeles. And this was with Sprint and then AT&T.

I couldn't believe I actually got better cellular reception in The Bahamas. We NEVER dropped calls there. Maybe coz I was on a tiny island. But still -- Bad cellular in Los Angeles? In the 21st century?
 
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 09-20-2010, 06:25 AM:
 
Welcome to Indiana University!
 
Posted by Jake Spell (Member # 5294) on 09-20-2010, 10:10 AM:
 
About 2 months after switching from AT&T to a DROID X on Verizon I have only dropped one call and that was right after I had my number ported. I have better signal better quality and their 3G is all expansive. The only time I am ever out of 3G is if the phone is switching between towers, and thats only for a min.

As far as the phone, I still love it, and I'll love it more once Verizon decides to push 2.2 to my phone.
 
Posted by David Stambaugh (Member # 1102) on 09-20-2010, 11:19 AM:
 
AT&T already got their pound of flesh out of me when I switched from my old iPhone 3G to the Evo on Sprint. I terminated my ATT contract a little early, knowing there would be a penalty. Three weeks later I switched back from Sprint to ATT for the iPhone 4. I could not get ATT to waive the penalty I had paid. Now I'm really stuck with ATT unless I want to pay more penalties.

More fun: ATT has their Android phones locked down so you can't install non-Market apps, and you can't uninstall the ATT bloatware, of which there are maybe 15 programs and only a couple of them are useful. You have to root the phone and do something else to clean that crap off it.

Oh yeah I also get to battle Apple to refund me on my AppleCare which is useless to me now. I bet I end up with a credit for the iTunes store.
 
Posted by Matt Johnston (Member # 5457) on 09-20-2010, 01:49 PM:
 
David - You can root your phone (get admin access) and remove the bloatware.

Also, check out "Sideload Wonder Machine" so you can install those none market apps. HERE
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 09-26-2010, 02:14 PM:
 
Wow. I am on a plane and there is a guy 2 rows ahead of me panicking to find out if anyone on the plane has an iphone. He was shocked to find out non-iproducts could find out the score to a game. Moron. [Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by Jake Spell (Member # 5294) on 09-26-2010, 11:45 PM:
 
So I updated my DROID X to Android vs. 2.2 a few days ago and was amazed at how fast it made my phone, however, I now have random program crashes and the camera will not work after ~12hours of up time. I have to restart the hon and it works fine for a while. Any one else experiencing this problem?
 
Posted by Claude S. Ayakawa (Member # 1401) on 09-27-2010, 05:36 AM:
 
It has been almost three weeks since I bought my Samsing VIBRANT which many of you know is an Android phone and I am more than happy with it. As I had mentioned earlier in my thread when I had announced I bought the Samsing phone, my original preference was a iPhone. I am very glad I stuck with T Mobile because of the wonderful plan and service I get from them instead of switching to AT&T and settle for a much less generous plan and pay more just for the iPhone. As it had turned out, I am more impressed with the Vibrant as far as the ease in using the devise as a telephone as it was originally intended. On top of that, I have had no problem downloading pictures and music from iPhoto and iMusic from my Mackbook computer. Because I was not able to get a iPhone, I bought a iPod Touch in early 2008 and have been using it a lot until I bought my android phone. Like Joe, I also prefer the sound quality over the iPod Classic and Nano I also have but the sound quality from the VIBRANT is a hell of a lot better than the iPod Touch. Yes, I know I complained about the android phone quality when I got it but I discovered the setting was incorrect and it sounds marvelous now. I just downloaded Kenny G's new album, HEART AND SOUL from a CD and it just sounds awesome on the VIBRANT phone. It also sounds good on the iPod Touch but the android phone sound much fuller and more dynamic. If T Mobile also offered iPhone service now and I had a choice between the iPhone and the Samsung VIBRANT knowing what I now know about both phones, I would gladly select the Samsung phone.

-Claude
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 09-27-2010, 12:53 PM:
 
-
 
Posted by Claude S. Ayakawa (Member # 1401) on 09-27-2010, 02:19 PM:
 
I like that very much, Joe [Smile] [Smile] [Smile]

-Claude
 
Posted by Claude S. Ayakawa (Member # 1401) on 09-27-2010, 06:03 PM:
 
Another nice feature the Samsung Vibrant has is the ability to remove image and music files with ease on the device itself rather than having to do it on a computer. This is something one cannot do on any iPod and possibly a iPhone and that is another reason I love my new android phone [Smile]

-Claude
 
Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 09-27-2010, 10:21 PM:
 
The prevailing thing is Android-based devices give you more choices on how to move and manage your data and a little more versatility with using the device in general.

I can retrieve an audio, image or data file off my phone via USB cable, using the removable MicroSD card (iPhones don't have flash card slots), using Bluetooth, using WiFi or even e-mailing the file as an attachment. And that's without having to use an application like iTunes, Windows Media Player or something else that would attempt to govern how you can move, copy and delete files.

One minor limitation: if you have an Android phone attached to a computer as an external disc drive the phone may not be able to display/play media files stored on the MicroSD card (my Evo 4G doesn't). But the computer will be able to display/play the files while connected via USB.
 
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 12-31-2010, 02:45 PM:
 
I got the Motorola Droid 2 and am very happy with it so far
 




Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2