Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: HDMI with embedded audio.

This is topic HDMI with embedded audio. in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 01-29-2013, 07:10 AM:

Is it possible to take a HDMI signal with embedded audio, put it through an embedder and embed new audio, replacing the original, or would the original embedded audio have to be removed first?

I've seen de-embedders and dis-embedders, but they seem to split off the audio to s/pdif or analogue, but still leave it in the HDMI as well.

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 01-29-2013, 07:27 PM:

This is convoluted, but there are devices that take DVI + S/PDIF (or DVI + RCA) inputs with an HDMI output.

So you could take your HDMI input, convert it to DVI, then attach that to the device, and run your alternative audio into the appropriate input into that same device.

Think it should work but it's got a bit that could fail obviously...

Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 01-30-2013, 09:54 AM:

I've seen such devices, they extract the audio to either analogue and/or S/Pdif outputs, but they seem to leave the embedded audio in place in the video output. While most DVI devices don't handle the embedded audio it can be in place in the dvi signal; they just ignore it.

I'm trying to end up with the original video but with a new english commentary replacing the original one. This is to go into a HDMI distribution amplifiier feeding large flat panel monitors in four rooms. There are no separate audio cables going to the four rooms, which is why I'm trying to embed the new audio in place of the original. I have the new audio, and the video with the original audio, but don't have the video without the original embedded audio.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 01-30-2013, 11:27 AM:

I guess you need to test one of these:

http://www.amazon.com/Digital-Inserter-Embedder-Converter-SPECIALTY-AV/dp/B005PRDN9S/ref=s r_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359566681&sr=8-1&keywords=HDMI+audio+embedder

'Removing' the original audio is not a separate task. Every HDMI audio embedder will simply have to remove any audio from the incoming HDMI before embedding new audio. As you can see on the picture of that embedder, there is a switch to choose wether analog, optical, or original HDMI audio is passed on.

Don't know, though, what happens when HDCP is involved.

How will you deal with sync issues, if video and audio is coming from separate sources? What is the source of the original video/audio?

- Carsten

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 01-30-2013, 12:55 PM:

quote: Stephen Furley
I've seen such devices, they extract the audio to either analogue and/or S/Pdif outputs, but they seem to leave the embedded audio in place in the video output.

The device I referred to isn't an audio extractor. It does the reverse.

But really my idea was presuming that if you were to do HDMI -> DVI the DVI signal would then have no embedded audio. Apparently, this presumption was wrong.

And on the audio inserter devices like the one shown above

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/889742-REG/Sescom_SES_AUDIO_N_HDMI_HDMI_Audio_Inserter.html
That one indicates it is HDCP compliant. Oh and the manufacturer's website says it too... [Smile]

Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 01-30-2013, 02:14 PM:

I'm confused. What's the source of the audio and video? A DVD? A Blu-ray? Using some free applications for Mac and PC, it is not too hard to say take an audio track that was on a DVD and sync it to Blu-ray video and make one nice m2ts file.

AJG

Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 01-30-2013, 03:46 PM:

Chris,

what I was wanting to do was to use a device similar to the one you linked to to insert new audio into a HDMI video signal which already has embedded audio, without having to first remove the original audio somehow. I'm hoping that such a device would simply 'overwrite' the original audio bits with the new ones.

Aron,

The original is on a Blu-ray disc, the replacement audio is on a USB stick. The video loops continuously, it's only about 4 minutes long. It's made from still photographs of some artworks, with the artist talking about them in Czech. She has recorded the new English version, and if I trim it to exactly the same length as the video and play it on my loptop it stays close enough in sync with the original video; there's no lip sync on it.

I was planning to take the English audio from the laptop, and insert it into the video from the Blu-Ray player, but maybe copying the video from the BD onto the laptop, replacing the audio there, and then playing the whole thing from the laptop would be a better idea. I can't write Blu-Ray disks, but I could run it from the hard disk. There's no HDCP involved. The laptop can output HDMI with embedded audio which I could feed into the distribution system.

Posted by Carsten Kurz (Member # 5396) on 01-30-2013, 04:20 PM:

I guess both methods will work. However, if you substitute the audio based on a digital files on the laptop, it may be converted into a new DVD or BluRay or HD playable file for repeated use. You would have to get a BluRay Ripper and drive somehow, somewhere. It probably could be captured digitally as well, a BluRay like this may not have copy protection set, thus HDMI capture might be possible.

You will have to ask around what type of gear will possibly be available for no or low cost.

In the long run, a solid method for BluRay Rip or capture might be worth the money more than having a rather special device like an HDMI embedder in your gearbox - if that is a useful consideration for you.

Of course, IF it works, the embedder is the easier and faster solution.

- Carsten

Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 01-31-2013, 05:13 AM:

Importing the video from the Blu-Ray into the computer and editing the audio worked. It can be played in Quicktime. I've written a copy of the Quicktime file to a CD-ROM as a backup. It's only needed for a few days

Thanks for the help.

Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 02-02-2013, 04:55 PM:

That's good to hear!

I was going to recommend a free app called tsmuxer, which can take an HD video stream and then mux it with any audio of your choosing...very easily.

AJG