Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Mechanical keyless locks

This is topic Mechanical keyless locks in forum Film-Yak at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.

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Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 03-04-2013, 06:19 PM:

Does anyone have any experience or recommendations regarding mechanical keyless locks? I'm thinking about getting one to put on my garage instead of a lock with a key, but I'm wondering how well those things stand up in cold weather.

I don't want to put an electronic keyless lock on there because those things take batteries, which won't do too well in the cold, and also because I don't want to put a $500 lock on a garage.

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 03-04-2013, 06:56 PM:

I have used these things

for computer room doors in offices in the past. They work fine for indoor locations; I am not sure if or how they are affected by temperature. Note that they aren't cheap: expect to spend $200-300 plus installation.

Some of them have key slots as well, so you can enter with either a key or by punching in a code.

Posted by Chris Slycord (Member # 4239) on 03-04-2013, 07:53 PM:

Btw, electronic locks don't neccesarily use batteries. Electric strike locks often are paired with 12V power supplies that are powered from your existing wiring.

Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-04-2013, 08:49 PM:

I always wondered about that. So many hotels now have the electronic locks and I figured there was some other method besides batteries being used to power them.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-04-2013, 09:53 PM:

Some hotel locks are battery powered.

When I worked as a hotel security guard, the locks there were battery powered with no external connections at all. They worked the same way your car's keyless fob works.

The car's processor has a many-digit code number that increments by a set pattern each time it receives a signal from the fob. The fob increments the code by the same pattern each time the button is pressed. If the codes match, the car opens.

In a hotel lock the code gets incremented when the room inspectress puts her card in the lock as she checks the room into service each day. When you check in to the room at the front desk, the clerk's computer synchronizes your key card with a particular room and ads a certain number of increments which corresponds to the number of days you plan to stay.

At the end of 'n' days (updates from the inspectress's card) your room card and the lock on the door go out of sync and the door won't open.

The Rooms Manager and the security guard on duty also have keys that can resync or unsync the lock.

If the room is to be locked (e.g. the guest doesn't pay) the manager or the security guard can put their "Red Card" into the lock and immediately uncync it. When the room is to be opened again, he puts his Red Card into the lock, immediately followed by the guest's card, then the room is accessible again.

As a security guard, I spent seemingly endless hours going up to guests' rooms to resync keys. We had to check the guest's ID, take the card down to the front desk then come back to sync it up again with the Red Card.

That was 20 years ago. Nowadays, many locks are networked to the computer at the front desk. Resyncing is probably a thing of the past.

Posted by Andrew Thomas (Member # 7000) on 03-04-2013, 10:20 PM:

You could go with something like that Unican mechanical combo lock, but they are pretty limited. Pretty much any non-residential grade electronic lock can be direct wired instead of battery operated. A lot of locks can now being unlocked from a smartphone app.

I grew up working for the family locksmith business. Feel free to PM me if you have an specific questions.

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 03-04-2013, 10:54 PM:

I'm not looking for anything really hi-tech or high security (or expensive); it's just for my garage.

My new truck has a built-in garage door opener. I discovered the hard way this afternoon that it's very easy to leave my key ring in the cupholder in the truck, close the garage door and walk out with nothing other than the key for the truck, now locked in the garage. With the old truck I always had to carry the portable garage door opener to shut the big door so I could just open the door again and get my keys.

So having done that once I'm thinking that I would like to avoid the situation in the future since I can see myself doing it again.

Some kind of a magic keyless lock on the small side door of the garage would probably do the job here. Unfortunately, a lot of electronics don't work really well when it gets to -40 and -50, so the simpler the mechanism the better.

Posted by Joe Elliott (Member # 4006) on 03-04-2013, 11:11 PM:

You could mod it so you can use your phone.

Bluetooth Garage door hack.

Sears has a garage door opener that you can not only use your phone, but you could open it via internet if you needed too. (Someone stops by to pick up or drop off something important, and you are not home. They could call you and you could open it.) However, that would necessitate replacing the entire unit, but I personally would like this option if it were for a business.

Craftsman Garage door openers.

And also, a modification of a motorcyle unit.

Flas h2pass garage door opener.

Interesting why the BBS code on here puts a space between the s and the h, it is not that way in the HTML code. Things that make you go Hmmm . . .

Mechanical sounds easier, but when I lived in Kansas City, the mechanical lock would freeze up in cold weather, and you would have to warm it up, or remember to blast it with a lot of graphite before it got cold. It had a metal casing, which water would condensate on, so perhaps a plastic unit might do better? The coldest I ever remember it getting was -10. I could not imagine it being -40 to -60. You know there are warmer places to live. Silly Canadians. [Smile]

With the electronics, it is more complicated, but they are all inside where it is at least warmer.

Sorry, living in cold climates just reminds me of Sam Kinison talking about people living in deserts . . .

Sam Kinison on world hunger . . . relevant at 1 min in.

Sorry, cold weather makes me cranky. I live in sunny Florida, and it is cold down here right now. It's been getting down to 35 at night, and you can't even go lay out at the beach till about 11:00. It's horrible.

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-05-2013, 12:44 AM:

How about taking a proximity cue detector out of an old projector and mounting one of the sensors in the door frame outside the garage. Hook the wires from the detector to the button that opens the garage door.

If you forget your keys simply wave your wedding ring or other metal object over the spot where the detector is... Open sesame! [Smile]

Posted by Joe Elliott (Member # 4006) on 03-05-2013, 02:45 AM:

That made me think of the ibutton (dallas key) idea. It's expensive, but this thing is nearly an entire automation unit.

ibutton/GSM switch

There has to be something cheaper that is just a simple ibutton switch, that would/should be fairly cheap. Programming in the keys is where it gets more complicated/expensive. There are plenty of DIY articles out there, just haven't found any premade units.

This however is more what you are looking for.

Garage keypad

It is similar to what I used to have, but mine did not have the cover. You could run into issues with the cover freezing on however. To keep from having to replace the batteries, you could always drill a hole through to the inside of the garage, and power it with a 9v transformer.

Posted by Louis Bornwasser (Member # 3063) on 03-05-2013, 06:55 AM:

Drill hole, mount pushbutton behind it. Use rod or twig to push the button. (Thanks, Randy) Louis

Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-05-2013, 08:48 AM:

Years after I quit working for Cinemark, I was cleaning out my car and I found one of the sensors from a proximity cue detector in the bottom of the trunk of my car, down in the spare tire well.

It's one of the ones we used to use to convert Kelmar failsafes from rollers to proximity. As far as I remember, it's got just three wires. Positive, negative and the contact closure.

I've had this thing in my tool box for years, just waiting for me to figure out something to do with it. I just like the idea of waving your hand and saying, "Open sesame!"

Posted by Frank Cox (Member # 6258) on 03-05-2013, 09:36 AM:

quote: Joe Elliott
I live in sunny Florida, and it is cold down here right now.

Isn't that the state that eats its residents? [Cool]