Reel to reel question

[Frank Raia]

May be a dumb question but curiosity has got the best of me. Most of the reels I have feed head out from the left side of the upper reel to the projector. I have some new reels that feed head out from the right side of the reel to the projector?

Is this a product of the whole emulsion in/out debate?

Does it make a difference?

[Steve Guttag]

Yes and yes.

[Frank Raia]

Steve.. what is the difference? other than the emulsion in/out?

[Steve Guttag]

That is the difference. SMPTE RP39 shows the results of a study on the subject. Emulsion-in relaxes the emulsion and it only goes under tension when the film hits the gate, typically (curved gates). With smaller diameter reels (like 4 and 5 inch), you can see a marked focus variance throughout the reel. This is accentuated if the reel is a 6000-foot one. As the hub diameter increases, like with platters, the difference is significantly less. The higher intensity lamps (higher heat) also seem to accentuate the problem.

In my own projecting career, I've done my own longer-term studies and came to the same conclusion. Running emulsion-in results in a more stable focus from beginning to end of reel. This is a cumulative effect. The longer you run emulsion-out, the worse it gets. If you then switch to emulsion in, it can take months, if not years to counteract it. However, if a print is run, from day-1 emulsion-in, the print will remain stable for its run.

[Frank Raia]

Steve.. so should I rewind all my reels emulsion in? If so my MUT the reels sit flat, I would have to put the reels being rewound sound track down tail out to the empty reel spinning clockwise. Is that correct?

[Steve Guttag]

What you do is your choice/business. When I've shown films (a lot of them over 4-decades), I have run emulsion-in for the bulk of it. On the rewind bench I run over-over.

Now, if you are talking about platter operation, that is a different story. Again, the diameters are not as small as on reels. On platters I run emulsion out. If you look at nearly all platters, running emulsion out has the advantage that nearly all potential film contact is towards the base, not the emulsion. Having the film under tension tends to decrease "spoking," which can play havoc on typical platter centerfeeds.

If your concern is to how the film is shipped when you are done. That is up to the print owner as to how they want their films returned. Back in the day, you would ship tails out and that was always emulsion in. Now, they tend to want them heads out. Absent direction from the owner, do what you feel is best and are most comfortable with.

[Frank Raia]

Steve.. thank you

[Ryan Gallagher]

We see all varieties arrive to us, with and without instructions. When in doubt we tend to return them in the same orientation they arrived, though often this seems just to be adopting whatever decision a prior projectionist made, cause rarely do these release prints in the general collections (and not archives) get touched at all upon return before going to the next person these days.

We still run emulsion out of the left side of the feed reel, but only because the vast majority of prints arrive heads out emulsion out, aside from inspection, we are only playing them once. Maybe it's something to consider changing but requires overruling a lot of muscle memory in the rewind onto the house reels. With a somewhat rotating cast of 35mm projectionists having to pay attention to which way you are using the rewind bench depending on context feels like "maybe" asking for trouble.

Not an argument against the other way, especially if dealing with a personal collection. For what it's worth. Library of Congress endorses it for their handling/returning instructions. Though they don't go so far as to weigh in on which way you should be playing it off your feed reel.

[Randy Stankey]

I have always stored and shipped prints tails out and emulsion in. When the operator at a theater works on the print, they will either spool the print onto their own reels or build onto a platter. Any good operator should build prints at a workbench before spooling onto the platter. Working at a bench, you would build the print in reverse order so that your large reels end up heads out before plattering.

Then, when you're done, reverse out. Spool onto large reels from the platter and break down from the bench. It all ends up tails out. If you're running from changeovers, you can either rewind onto shipping reels after you're done or you can just play the last show onto the shipping reels. Either way, the film ends up the right way around.

If everybody does things the same way, nobody has to do any extra work, the film always ends up the right way and, except for a quick check when you receive the film and start working, you hardly have to think about it.

[Jim Cassedy]

Back in the day, before all this platter nonsense, all prints arrived tails out
mounted on 'shipping reels'. They were inspected while being hand
rewound onto the Goldberg "house reels", On the last show, you'd use
a shipping reel for take-up on the projector, and then put the reel bands
back on the print and ship it, also tails-out. There was a special bonded
film delivery service that had keys to all the theaters, and they would
come at some point overnight and pick up the print & deliver a new one.
No FedX, UPS, or USPS, except occasionally for trailers. The exception
to this was if one or more of the shipping reels were bent or bad in bad
shape, then I would use a regular take-up reel on the last show, and
re-rewind it afterwards back onto one of the shipping reels, also tails
out, for pickup. I was in a 1st run theater, so 98% of the time, the prints
were brand new, the shipping reels were in good shape, and inspection
mostly involved making sure that I had all the reels I was supposed to
have (and not two "reel threes' or something like that) and also making
sure that there were cue-marks where they were supposed to be.
Fortunately, I've never had to take a platter-projection job.

[Chris Wehrman]

Steve, in your experience, does the emulsion in versus emulsion out make any difference on straight gates compared to curved? Is it the same effect?

[Steve Guttag]

I have not tested, myself, on straight gates but it shouldn't matter. The problem is that the emulsion is stretched while it is stored on the reel. You can even get horizontal cracks in the emulsion if it gets brittle. I used to see this, back in the day...long before polyester film was the norm and prints were in circulation for years, if not decades.

I'd say, do your own experiment except you are likely not getting a new print so you will be working with the storage of months/years in whatever wind it has. Where I saw it most is over a longer run (2-4 months...yes, we did that once upon a time). The longer it ran, the worse the focus got from beginning to end of reel...until we switched to emulsion in. The problems stopped...just like that.

[Frank Raia]

Man, I have a lot of reels to fix!

[Ryan Gallagher]

If you're running from changeovers, you can either rewind onto shipping reels after you're done or you can just play the last show onto the shipping reels. Either way, the film ends up the right way around.

If everybody does things the same way, nobody has to do any extra work, the film always ends up the right way and, except for a quick check when you receive the film and start working, you hardly have to think about it.

I don't trust most shipping reels we get these days in back catalog prints as far as I can throw them (when full). The idea of playing out onto shippers sounds crazy from our position, but gone are the days of first run 35mm houses and shiny new reels.

The one "new" print we showed in recent times (Brutalist), was on new 24in film-tech reels/shippers, superbly built and packaged BTW, and we just used those cause they were actually in better shape than any 24in 35mm house reels we had available (not many). In that case we did (and were instructed) to play out onto shippers and send it along, tails out emulsion in.

[Frank Raia]

So emulsion in is it for me.

Another question tho, I remember receiving new movies and the name of the movie that was printed on the heads out always faced out and read left to right. If I rewind a reel now head out emulsion in, the name of the movie printed on the head is inverse. So did the distributors ship emulsion out?