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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » House light levels during show? (Page 2)

 
This topic comprises 4 pages: 1  2  3  4 
 
Author Topic: House light levels during show?
John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 01-23-2001 05:33 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Chris:

Regarding the high level of stray light on your outdoor screen: Can you work with your security and lighting people to put shields on the lights, so they don't shine directly on the screen? Many times, a simple baffle lets the light shine only where it's needed, and not on the screen.

The same applies to EXIT signs in an indoor theatre. Safety regulations often mandate the location and brightness of the signs, but a simple shield would keep the light off the screen without compromising safety. Unfortunately, I've seen too many theatres where the edge of the screen is bathed in light from the EXIT signs.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com


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Rachel Carter
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 248
From: Gloucester, Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 01-23-2001 12:49 PM      Profile for Rachel Carter   Email Rachel Carter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John, about the exit signs....try to picture this. In the front of the autitorium is obviously the screen and directly next to it on the right side is an emergency exit door with a exit light on the top. My problem is that if you put a shield on the exit light it will actually stick out a little in from of the screen. Right now the light from the exit light is glaring on the screen (this really drives me crazy). I was considering using a partial Screen or a smaller screen but from testing and putting a piece of cardboard on the side of the sign I relialized it didn't help. Our building inpector is insisting the sign stay exactly where it is....Any idea? We also have a similiar problem where in another auditorium, there is two sets of stairs below the screen and per the building inspector we have to have the stairs lit....of course this causes our same old problem on the screen....YIPEE...and ideas for solutions would be greatly appreciated!

About the theater lighting...in my opinion it highly depends on the movies...During adult movies I keep the house lights on very low and during kids movies I usually keep them up a bit high because we tend to have kids running around in the theater. The kids and parents usually don't notice or mind the lights being a little higher, I've actually gotten compliments on keeping them higher for the saftey of the children.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 01-23-2001 01:35 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Rachel:

Some of the newer EXIT signs that actually form the letters with strings of LEDs are fairly directional, shining most of their light directly forward, rather than in all directions. Some new directional fiber optic technology is also coming onto the market.

Also, the technology used to make directional traffic signal lights might be applicable. Not sure, but either a fresnel lens or a fiber optic faceplate is used. I'm sure you've seen the traffic lights that are only visible from one lane, to avoid confusing drivers in the other lanes.

What about just masking the edges of the screen so it doesn't reach right out to the side wall? Then you could use a black baffle to shield the screen from the sign, without casting a shadow on the image.

Of course for stairs, the tiny LED path lights usually satisfy the inspectors for outlining the tripping hazard, yet don't throw much light into the auditorium or on the screen. Use the minimum brightness that still maintains safety.

Here are a few links:
http://www.amt4led.com/
http://www.micalighting.com/
http://www.multimediaLED.com/
http://www.schult.com/main.html
http://www.sunnywell.com/
http://www.techni-lite.com/

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com


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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-23-2001 05:10 PM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
All of our NEW buindings at Cinemark are now using self-illuminating "tritium-phosphorus" exit signs.

There are little tubes of green stuff inside them that spell out the word "EXIT". They don't use any electricity or batteries. You don't have to test them and they are supposed to last for 100 years or something like that. (Actually whatever the half life of tritium is, I guess. )

The only, "very minor", thing is that they are radioactive. There are warning lables all over that back of them that say you have to dispose of them in an "approved" landfill.
Just don't open them up, I guess.

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Greg Pauley
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 173
From: Huntington, WV, USA
Registered: Jun 2000


 - posted 01-23-2001 08:32 PM      Profile for Greg Pauley   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Pauley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Like Randy, we choose to use the self-illuminating exit signs on all exits around the screen area and LED signs in all other exitways in the auditorium. The self-illuminating exit signs are more expensive, but well worth the money.

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Aaron Sisemore
Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day!

Posts: 3061
From: Rockwall TX USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 01-23-2001 09:10 PM      Profile for Aaron Sisemore   Email Aaron Sisemore   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Rachel, take sever layers of plain white paper and sandwich them between the red or green color gel in the exit sign and the outer part of the sign. Experiment with different amounts of layers until you get enough light to see the exit sign in the dark without any visibly annoying ligh on the screen. Another idea is to use the smallest wattage bulbs you can find, however even that is not enough, so the paper trick will work in that scenario too.

Aaron


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Rachel Carter
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 248
From: Gloucester, Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 01-23-2001 09:31 PM      Profile for Rachel Carter   Email Rachel Carter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks everyone for the help.

Just to let you guys know...I already have the lowest watt bulbs I can find in the exit signs and use the LED track lights on the stair ways. I was there watching a movie tonight (on my day off) in the theater with the lighted stair problem....I DROVE ME CRAZY!! I need to find a solution for that one.

But really, thanks guys!

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 01-23-2001 09:38 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Go to an office supply store and buy a few of those green or red (depending on the color of your exit signs) transparent book report covers. Take the front cover off of the sign as if you are changing the light and use it as a template. Cut the book report covers to fit and sandwich them inside. Each layer will darken them just a bit, but so long as they are visible during a movie, you should be fine and the solution is very cheap.

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John Eickhof
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 588
From: Wendell, ID USA
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 01-24-2001 12:17 AM      Profile for John Eickhof   Author's Homepage   Email John Eickhof   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Regarding exit signs...there is a little known exception to the rule in the uniform fire code! In a theatrical situation where an exit sign meeting standard illumination requirements either distracts from or disturbs the stage, screen, or performance, it may be illuminated by 50% of rated output. This may be difficult to get the building inspector or fire marshall to accept, but it is in the code book and if they are diligent, they will find it and allow the exit sign to be 1/2 brilliancy. The new 'glow' type radiant type signs comply with this, but the LED types are WAY too bright! The easiest thing to do in an incandescent type sign is to wire the two existing bulbs in series, thus effectivly cutting output in half and giving a lifetime of service to the bulbs,(you should NEVER change the wattage or types of bulbs, as this WILL violate the code!) the thing to stress to the officials is that the 'emergency' section of the exit sign (if equipped) is still at full brilliancy! Thus no light is lost in case of power failure.

------------------
John Eickhof President, Chief Slave
Northwest Theatre Equipment Co., Inc.
P.O.Box 258
Wendell, ID. 83355-0258
208-536-5489
email: jeickhof@nteequip.com

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Rachel Carter
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 248
From: Gloucester, Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 01-24-2001 12:41 AM      Profile for Rachel Carter   Email Rachel Carter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just so no one thinks I'm "Breaking the law", the building inspector accepted the lower wattage of the bulb

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 01-24-2001 04:43 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, the LED signs and stair path lighting are quite bright "out of the box". But they can be run at lower power levels too, as long as they are bright enough to conform to code.

Kodak and film labs use LED path lighting in many of their darkroom areas --- paths and tripping hazards are easily outlined, with minimal light to fog the unexposed film. And most commercial aircraft now use LED path lighting to guide people to exits in the event of an emergency.

Does anyone know if the codes allow maintaining EXIT signs and path lighting in theatres at a very low level during the show, and automatically raising it to a bright level during a fire alarm? EXIT signs must be bright enough to be easily seen, even through smoke.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion


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David Kilderry
Master Film Handler

Posts: 355
From: Melbourne Australia
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 01-24-2001 05:30 AM      Profile for David Kilderry   Author's Homepage   Email David Kilderry   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 

Chris,

Can't one of the F-18's based at Tindal use the security lights for night-time target practise?

Just be glad your outdoor is not at Amberly, then you would have something to complain about with all those F-111 dump and burns causing the screen to glow red!

Only way to run a movie is with all house lights off. We have even dimmed our aisle lights in some theatres as the light fell on the screen. On my trips to NYC at no time has any theatre I've visited completly extinguished the house lights.

David

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Joseph Pandolfi
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 213
From: Milford, CT.
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 01-25-2001 05:47 PM      Profile for Joseph Pandolfi   Email Joseph Pandolfi   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The first thing that hits our screen which is required the state fire marshall and run on our National Amusements screens is our exit policy trailer which show a still frame of the front of the screen and the two exit signs on each side with a dialog that states "LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, IN THE UNLIKELY EVENT OF AN EMERGENCY THE EXITS ARE CLEARLY LOCATED AT THE FRONT AND REAR OF THE AUDITORIUM. THANK YOU.


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William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-25-2001 10:34 PM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just for perspective, the typical 20s-30s movie palace with 3-circuit/3-color lighting usually had an *additional* circuit called "dim circuit" which kept a few low-wattage bulbs burning at all times in various light fixtures behind globes, glass, or some sconces. Usually a "dim circuit" used yellow bulbs, but I think I remember someone mentioning an older house with red bulbs in the dim circuit.

Even in non-palace silent-era theaters (not nickelodeons), there was often a light circuit of bulbs left on at all times in sconces, chandeliers, or coves.

I think when houses were that large (small non-palace theaters were larger than most multiplex auditoriums today) it was not so distracting to leave wall sconces 'way over there at half, or rows of those old-fashioned hooded aisle lights with 10 watt incandescents shining straight down. I like the looks of the old incandescent aisle lights, but they sure would be unneccesarily bright & distracting in tighter modern theater designs. But that's about what the light level was in theaters of typical size during the roadshow heyday, in the 50s, 60s, & early 70s.



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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-25-2001 10:41 PM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, when I set the levels, I have always left the sconces up to the point to where they are just barely aglow.

I feel that it helps define the perimeter of the room and helps keep people from bumping into the walls, if you know what I mean. Especially in those theatres where the Soundfold is a dark color.

A lot of people go right along behind me and turn them all the way down again, but I STILL think my way is better.

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