Talking of Vic 8's we were down in Warwick the other week where they're running two Vic 8's on changeovers, which they picked up for a grand a piece about ten years ago! Looked pretty good appart from the horrible keystoning due to the ridiculous rake in the auditorium, but I'd love to see that at City Screen if he ever gets it going - saw Lord of the Rings down there the other night in the THX screen, and it, well, put us to shame really (I think he may be setting the levels just a tad on the "check out the bass" side of things ;-) - now 70mm in there would be something else...

Rob

That Warners is the nightmare fleapit from hell. Saw 'The Tailor of Panama' there last Spring in the company of a load of rugby-shirted, beered-up yobs who spent the whole film throwing popcorn at the screen and yelling abuse while the cinema staff did nothing. Then about a month later I went back to see Jurassic Shite 3 under extreme duress (a friend came to stay who insisted on the expedition). The print was badly scratched by only its second day on release and then we came out to find that my car had been nicked. This being late on a rainy Saturday evening, ergo no taxis to be had for love nor money, it was a long walk back to Bootham but it served my friend right! I don't care if that place shows my favourite film of all time (which, given that the film in question is silent and a documentary, I don't think is very likely), I ain't going back there again...

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OTHERVISE G R E A T ! !

However, if you are a mainly art house venue then I'd seriously think hard about spending the cash. Art house product seldom has DTS, or SRD for that matter, so you may be able to use the cash on something that's going to get more use.

But I'd highly recommend DTS. Its much more stable than SRD, hardly ever reverts compared to SRD, sounds great and is simple to use.

As for the reversion tree, DTS > SRD > SR... not too sure about how it works on CP65. The basic install is easy so check out the manual in the manuals section. I've a thread running on installing a DTS6D onto a CP55 & DA20 with the intention of doing exactly that. Its not straight forward but I'm getting there, slowly. My solution at the moment is to use an existing relay card from DTS to switch the outputs of the DA20 & the DTS 6D into the processor. It also requires some interfacing of the sense control lines so its not a job for the inexperienced.

As usual everyone on here is a wealth of information as is Karen from DTS.

So if you don't need the cash elsewhere go for it!

As for popping down to City Screen... they don't have DTS anymore.

Ken, I can't say I've had the problems with SRD that you have posted. Are you speaking about new prints, or used prints? I've ran prints for months without any SRD dropout. I commonly don't even turn on the analog backup. SRD is just as reliable as DTS is provided you didn't get a butchered print. No need to burn the led.

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Ken, I can't say I've had the problems with SRD that you have posted. Are you speaking about new prints, or used prints? I've ran prints for months without any SRD dropout. I commonly don't even turn on the analog backup. SRD is just as reliable as DTS is provided you didn't get a butchered print. No need to burn the led.
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The experience I've had with arthouse here is that they seldom have any digital on... but we are talking real arthouse not main stream crossover arthouse!

We have basement readers on our Vic 8's and the general opinion on here is that basement readers are crap!! Maybe a bit harsh but they are certainly less tollerent than penthouse readers. We often see reversion at changerovers etc... It's not a major problem and it's not something I'm paranoid about but it is regular enough to notice.

We don't sit looking at the DA20 all day... at least I don't!

DTS has a four second tollerence before it reverts so in reality it never reverts, unless there is a problem with the print of course.
So I would say it's more robust by design. The Timecode is in an area that has no mechanical friction associated with it so it remains stable. As SRD is placed between the perforations it has to cope with the friction of the gate, sproket pads, platter guides etc etc... so is bound to suffer more wear and damage. Our readers are properly setup with average error rates of 2 - 4, so there's no problem there.

I'm not knocking SRD at all. It sounds great and has the advantage of 'being' there on the print so no chasing disc's. I just happen to like DTS... it's a selling point for some people, in the same way that THX and Dolby Digital are. It's good to be able to display all three logos in the foyer so the public are aware they will see and hear a film in arguably the best way possible.

Alignment of the SRD reader can also be an issue. I've never worked with a Cinemecannica basement, but don't you screen your prints? If the SRD doesn't drop out during your pre-screening but it does later, you are doing something wrong and causing damage to your prints. The lame excuse I hear a lot in the US at multiplexes is that "the digital track wears off". Not so. Scratches and dirt can cause it to drop out down the road, but that's operator error/theater film damage at work, not a failure of the SRD system. The same goes for SDDS.

Gate cleaning, a pet hate of mine, and gate tension.

When I do take the gate out in the morning its always got a tick hard build up on it.... It's not there at the end of my day... so what can you do. Gate tension is another hate, they keep turning it up. I can't argue if they say the picture was jumping.

I'm there very often 6 or 7 days a week I'm not working myself into an early grave just to prove a point.

As for splicing tape, we use Jack Roe.... is it cheapo? I don't know.

Splicers are expensive and we use the bog standard italian, I think, make. Not sure what it is off the top of my head. But again it all comes down to care and maintenance. I'm only one guy...

Prints generally come to us new, so they do deteriorate.... but its not a major problem as I say its just noticable over the first week then settles down. Generally the error rates stay around 4 or 5 maximum, which is about normal from what I gather.

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the gate deposits are a management thing that I am trying to deal with. As I say I'm only one guy and short of being there 24/7 I have to rely on my staff. The error levels I've seen in most cinemas hover around the 4 or 5 mark.

Its difficult to know what to set SRD up on. I've tried setting up on my Jiffy SRD test film but found that when I went back to a real world print the error levels were higher. So I picked a new print and setup on that. Thing is as different reels went thru azimuth etc changed. We do get prints that run very low, 2 or 3. It's much better than it was when the readers were first installed, not by me I should add. When I had to change the LED assy I spent a long time on the setup and made a big difference and dropped the current etc. So I'm happy its at its best. I should add however that according to DRAS the image is over 100% and there is nothing that can be done to reduce it. This may be why the rates are in your opinion too high.
However the advice I've been given suggest this is acceptable.

You may have gotten the impression that its worse than it really is, we do get reversions but its not at a level that I'm concerned about, I just compared it with DTS which hardly ever reverts in comparison.

I'll leave the laptop on a feature this week and see what happens over a newish print.

I'm quite a realist in many ways and whilst I'm capable of consistently good standards of work, not everyone else can or wants to. So I either aim for a realistic standard that I can guarantee or bang my head against a brick wall......

I've got some Film-Guard and have tried it a couple of times on a new noisy print. As we have to apply it by hand I'm not going to allow others to apply it or it'll end up all over the place.

Now, if people would send the discs back with the print, everyone would be happy.