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Topic: My Big Bulge

John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-24-2002 05:53 PM

Rewashing (Kodak Process RW-1) MAY help, in that it swells the damaged emulsion, and heals any minor abrasion or digs. Rewashing and drying the print may also help relax any curl issues, and return the print to the proper humidity equilibrium.
Kodak Rewash Process RW-1

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 07-24-2002 07:32 PM

Jiggidy Jhawk-

I took your advice and ran the print through my dishwasher. Now it is worse than ever. So I guess rewashing it does not help.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-24-2002 08:36 PM

Joe said: "I took your advice and ran the print through my dishwasher. Now it is worse than ever. So I guess rewashing it does not help."

Sounds like you didn't use the Kodak RW-1 recommendation that I supplied the link to. And you probably used the "power dry" setting.

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 07-24-2002 09:06 PM

I think Joe should do it again, but this time use the "two-stage countercurrent wash" cycle.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-24-2002 09:09 PM

A four-stage countercurrent wash would be better for archival keeping:

Counter-Current Washes

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John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 07-24-2002 11:41 PM

I guess I should have said not to try it at work either.
"oops." Send me the bill, Joe.

--jhawk
(who finds the j's jiggle better than the J's, y'know)

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Joe Beres
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 606
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 07-24-2002 11:46 PM

Feature films are only top-rack safe. I'm guessing you forgot about that. Yet another film handler proving that digital is the only way to go. Thanks for ruining it for us all.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 07-25-2002 12:11 AM

quote:
--jhawk
(who finds the j's jiggle better than the J's, y'know)

Ummmmm... I'm not sure but did you just admit to a smaller than average manhood or something?

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Mathew Molloy
Master Film Handler

Posts: 357
From: The Santa Cruz Mountains
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 07-25-2002 04:19 AM

We were having this same bulge problem on our AW3 when we took the theatre over, especially with the print of ALI. That was before FilmGuard. Now that we are using FilmGuard we have not had this problem at all in 5 months.

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Peter Kerchinsky
Master Film Handler

Posts: 326
From: Seattle, WA, USA
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 07-25-2002 05:16 AM

Like I said before and I'll say it again..........
take those damn Supers and ORC platters and junk em.......they're crap.
I've been running AW3s with the removable brains, as you call em, and have never had any problems with them
IT'S THE ONLY WAY TO FLY.

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Jason Burroughs
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 654
From: Allen, TX
Registered: Jun 99

posted 07-25-2002 08:22 AM

Just to state the obvious, it sounds like, from Joe's description, that the damage is occuring in the projector. A roller missalignment or excess tension would not cause sprocket damage. Sounds like either a pad roller is pinching the film or a hooked tooth somewhere. Try reversing the Intermittant sprocket, check the "shoes" for a burr as well.

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David Whitbeck
Film Handler

Posts: 70
From: Tempe, AZ
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 07-25-2002 06:50 PM

With Strong platters, I never had any bulge problems. Sure maybe a head wrap every now and then, but proper maintenance took care of those. But no bulges. With the Christies, it's not too tough to get a good bulge during build up of a print. Made a good one last night with Goldmember, too much tension. Had to rewind it to a 6k foot reel and then put it back on the platter with less tension. Anytime I see bulges, I think about the tension or the ring. Even if the film is too thick where you tuck it in the ring a bulge can happen. We have a Super Platter sitting in the corner, I used it to tear down a movie once, I disassembled it shortly after...

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-26-2002 09:40 AM

David: Glad to see your theatre is up and running again after the Arizona forest fires. How did you and your town of Show Low fare?

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Charles Everett
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1470
From: New Jersey
Registered: May 2001

posted 07-26-2002 03:43 PM

Are those prints new from the lab or circuited from another theater?

If they're circuited they may have been damaged before Joe R got them. Y Tu Mama Tambien has been out in the US since March. Lagaan had its original release in June 2001 and was re-released in the US two months ago.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 07-28-2002 01:36 AM

I was right. The platters pull so tight, that it pulls the film a few perfs worth of tension on the holdback sprocket of the crappily designed Simplex sound head. With the tension maxed out in the soundhead, it damages/stretches each sprocket hole on the non-soundtrack side of the film. Film that is damaged like that ends up buldging. This usually happens when the projector is motored through and stopped and the projectionist fails to break the take up platter by hand in time. Or when the projector stops on it's own for no reason (it happens) and the take up keeps on goin'. And before you even ask: Yes, the pad rollers are set up correctly with the proper tension on the sprockets. And yes, these platters are "timed" as good as they will get. Any slower and the elevator DROPS COMPLETELY when the film begins to motor.

Whoever had the bright idea to use super-high torque VACUUM CLEANER MOTORS in a platter system should be shot in the nuts repeatedly with a rubber band. Vacuum cleaner motors are for vacuums, not platters. There is simply no need for THAT MUCH TORQUE in a platter system. Period. What's next... a platter system powered by an air compressor kept in another room? Oh wait. How are dumb people able to get their designs manufactured by companies?

I am so glad that we are throwing these ORC platters in the trash very soon and getting newer less-crappy platters!

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