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Topic: Xenon Bulb blowup damage the truth the myth?

Aaron Mehocic
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 804
From: New Castle, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 99

posted 09-17-2005 04:20 PM

Edited for clarity below

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Aaron Mehocic
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 804
From: New Castle, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 99

posted 09-17-2005 04:24 PM

quote: Monte L Fullmer
Wonder if that OSRAM cover has a Kelvar inner coating of sorts...especially, for a 4K bulb since they can be a bit nasty when they go.

Did a 3K about two hours ago in which the new cover didn't seem to have anything extra protective about it. Just a very thick, very dense weave of man-made cloth. I like it. A welcome change given what was said on the previous page. [thumbsup]

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 09-17-2005 04:32 PM

quote: Louis Bornwasser
I don't typically use protection either....this is a bad example. I am EXTREMELY careful not to put any stress on any part of the bulb.

I am pretty much in the same boat there Louis!! I only wear my glasses as protection but am also VERY careful when handling and turning any connection. In 25 yers I've yet to have a lamp crack, explode or otherwise explode when I was handling, removing or installing it. I respect xenon lamps much like I respected that 18kv high voltahge line at the TV transmitter [evil]

!! Now I will usually wear a face shield when I remove very high hour lamps but I've never had one of them go either. The funny thing that I do which is really the correct thing that I should ALSO be doing for myself is to make the customer that is watching me change his/her lamp wear the face shield, gloves, and bullit proof vest is one is available. I've gotten funny comments about why they are so dressed in protection when I'm not...... I always tell em its an insurance liability precaution and they seem to buy that. Heck in 25 yers I've only had two lamps explode both were new and it happened right at ignition... both oddly were Christie Lamps but this has not happened to me now in over 14 years..

Mark

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Alexander Smith
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 128
From: Walney Island, Barrow-in-Furness, Cumbria.
Registered: Jun 2003

posted 09-17-2005 06:35 PM

The fibre-jacket is also being used on Osram 3kW lamps.
We received one last week, in an all-new box which seems
to consist entirely of spongy foam.

Coming from the school-of-thought of always having new
Xenons being supplied in blast shields, it's a bit of a
culture shock. It can only be beneficial. If Osram say the
fibre sheath will contain the force of any lamp explosion
then who am I to say it won't?

The apparent flimsy-ness of the sheath further reinforces
my respect for Xenons.

Alex.

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Daryl C. W. O'Shea
Film God

Posts: 3977
From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from)
Registered: Jun 2002

posted 09-17-2005 07:40 PM

With no space for the quartz to accelerate you're pretty safe. The same principle is behind why you should put heavy things in your trunk right up against the rear seat backs.

SQP has been using something similar, a rubber peel-off coating, since around the start of the year.

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Wolff King Morrow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 490
From: Denton, TX, USA
Registered: Feb 2004

posted 09-18-2005 02:44 AM

I started getting the new packaged 4ks last month. It was a bit of a shock for me, having been so used to the plastic shell. When I got the fabric sheath guys in, I said "WTF is this crap? Oh well, if it works, it works."

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David Graham Rose
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 187
From: Cambridge, UK
Registered: Sep 2002

posted 09-18-2005 01:56 PM

Gretings All From Cambridge

When I worked at the ABC Nesquick House, a former colleague of mine used to enjoy the pleasures of the ladies who worked in the oldest profession, who worked from the neighbouring flat. Apparently, he used to take used 2K Xenons that the Chief had disposed of and use them in the antics for which he paid them. I always remember the famous time when he was due to report for a shift and his wife rang up to tell us he was in hospital after (quote) 'a nasty fall in the garden whilst repairing his greenhouse'. Needless to say he had only been seen an hour before being carried out of the den of iniquity 3 hours before on a stretcher!. How we laughed!

The Chief always made sure from that day to the day he retired (with a hernia) due to ill health, that said person was always the one who would be on duty when a lamp was changed.

Ah the heady days on single screen ABC's - can't beat them!

From a stormy Cambridge, I bid you all Goodnight

David

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Tommie Evans
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 116
From: Birmingham, West Midlands, UK
Registered: Sep 2004

posted 09-19-2005 10:10 AM

Hmmm, don't xenon give of a white light, not red? [Big Grin]

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Frank Dubrois
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 896
From: Cleveland, OH
Registered: Mar 2005

posted 09-23-2005 10:10 AM

After reading all this, I'm scared. I've been changing bulbs for years and never had an incident until about 2 weeks ago. I changed a 4k bulb (no protective gear as only a face mask is offered in the booth) and the bulb seemed to install fine with no complications. I left. The projectionist came in and ran the projector and said with in a minute of ignition, it blew. He mentioned something about this bulb being cracked. I assumed if the bulb was cracked (small crack at the + end) the bulb would have or should have blown immediately or possibly on installation when the crack formed. First of all, how far from disaster was I when I installed it, and, if only a face mask is available in the booth, should I even bother to change these anymore? We are instructed to get roughly 50% over manufacturers recommended hours out of bulb...does that put us (and out equiptment) at a substantial risk? I plan on printing out these responses and turning them into the corporate office in hopes to get protective gear. Because of money concerns, I dont think anything will be done about the the extra hours on the bulb, but so far, operational wise, we havent had any issues. I am concerned about uninstalling a weakend bulb now. Should the plastic wrap that came with the bulb be wrapped around an old bulb before trying to take it out?

Thanks

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 09-23-2005 11:37 AM

Almost every bulb manufacturer has documentation listing safety procedures. I would suggest: goggles, (protects the eyes-little bits of glass will fly up under a face shield) face shield, (protects your face) gloves, flax jacket with sleeves (protects upper body).

To borrow and twist a phrase from motorcyclists, 'If your safety isn't worth anything to you, then don't wear any safety equipment.'

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 09-26-2005 07:12 AM

Frank: The NASA Glenn Research Center in Cleveland uses xenon lamps for solar radiation simulation and other uses. They have an excellent safety manual that details all the procedures that should be used:

http://smad-ext.grc.nasa.gov/gso/manual/chapter_26.pdf

quote:
Glenn Research Center Glenn Safety Manual – Chapter 26 High Pressure Arc Lamps (Xenon)
BMS Document: GRC-M8300.001
Revision Date: 10/04 – Biannual Review
CHAPTER 26 - HIGH PRESSURE ARC LAMPS (XENON) Table of Contents 26.1 Scope 26.2 Applicability 26.3 Authority 26.4 General Precautions for Handling All High Pressure Lamps 26.5 Regulations Applicable To Use of High Pressure Lamps 26.5.1 Lamp Enclosures (Shielding) 26.5.2 Lamp Installation 26.5.3 Lamp Operation 26.6 Hazards of High Pressure Lamps 26.6.1 Skin Injury 26.6.2 Eye Injury 26.6.3 Ozone 26.7 Storage of High Pressure Lamps 26.8 Procurement of High Pressure Lamps 26.8.1 Purchase 26.8.2 Shipping 26.9 Disposal of High Pressure Lamps 26.10 Training 26.11 References

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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 09-26-2005 07:45 AM

quote:
I am pretty much in the same boat there Louis!! I only wear my glasses as protection but am also VERY careful when handling and turning any connection. In 25 yers I've yet to have a lamp crack, explode or otherwise explode when I was handling, removing or installing it. I respect xenon lamps much like I respected that 18kv high voltahge line at the TV transmitter !!

Mark, I am really surprised that you are less than enthusiastic about observing known proper safety precautions. I mean, the fact that you have not been sliced and diced by an exploding bulb in upteen years doesn't lessen the threat of an exploding bulb, the risk of which remains constant no matter how how many times good luck has been on your side. It is as illogical as the motorcyclist who says he hasn't taken a fall in 25 years of biking, so what's the point of wearing safety gear?

You know very well that mishandling a bulb is probably on the bottom of the list of what causes bulbs to explode. The top reason is that there is a defect either in manufacturing or one precipitated by the environment it is placed in; you can't tell when this is going to happen. Explosions happen no matter how carefully a bulb is handled. And as for only wearing face protection, you know how small a shard of quarts has to be to sever important nerves in your hands and wrists that could severely and permanently limit your dexterity? To say nothing about arteries in the neck that can kill you if they are cut? Then there are those other most excellent favorite parts of the body that guys want to protect at any cost. Hey, gimme the coat that goes down to my knee caps!

So come on brother Mark, cover up EVERYTHING....we don't want you to be one of the guys who has a horror story that you can post on the "What's the worst accident you ever had in the booth while handling a xenon bulb?" thread. We love ya, man.

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Frank Dubrois
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 896
From: Cleveland, OH
Registered: Mar 2005

posted 09-27-2005 10:20 AM

Perhaps I misread, but are there documented cases where a bulb explodes when its being removed even though it wasnt dropped or knicked? If all power is disconnected, and you take the leads off, can it just blow?? Thats scarey as hell. Does the fact that we go sometimes more than 50% past the manufacturers recommended life span? I'd hate to think that the company is putting us at risk just to save a few bucks.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 09-27-2005 10:28 AM

Any handling of a lamp may accidently put it under enough stress to cause explosion, for example a twist as you tighten the anode lead, or accidently bumping the lamp on the base of the reflector. Lamps run too hot or well beyond their warranteed life may have weakened seals or(vitrified)quartz. Without proper safety protection, an exploding lamp may be the last thing you will ever see. [Eek!]

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000

posted 09-27-2005 12:04 PM

Here's a recent 'documented' failure for you (firsthand account). My buddy Dave is getting ready to install a new 5k. We have our face shields on and Dave is just starting to lift the cover off the bulb's box when we both hear a muffled "pop." He pulls the lid off, and there in the box are the shattered remains of a brand new bulb in its plastic safety housing. First time I've seen one go like that.

So yeah, occasionally these lamps can just 'go' even when there's no obvious stress being applied. But I think these cases are pretty rare. Catastrophic failure of the quartz seems to happen most often while the bulb is operating, when the internal pressure is much higher than it is when the bulb is at room temperature. But even at room temperature they are still pressurized and thus need to be treated with respect.

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