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Author Topic: Superman movies in 70mm Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 03-31-2011 10:57 AM                     quote: Jonathan Goeldner I thought the first commercial split surround mix was 'Apocalypse Now' in '79, what's the story here? Superman: The Movie was originally mixed for 5.1 split surround, but the original 70mm prints didn't use the split surround mix just baby boom and mono surround instead. Richard Donner talked about the 5.1 mix and theaters not being able to use it on his director's commentary track (on DVD and Blu-ray). It's been awhile since I listened to the track so I can't go into a lot of specifics. There is a number of logistical hurdles in getting a new sound format playing in movie theaters. "Format 43" just wasn't completely installed in time for Superman. Apocalypse Now was the first movie to actually use 70mm Dolby Format 43 during its original release.  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-31-2011 11:46 AM                     Francis Coppola explained that APOCALYPSE NOW was the first film officially "announced" to have the new 70mm format with split surrounds, but they took so long making the movie that SUPERMAN made it to theatres first.  |  IP: Logged Bill Gabel Film God Posts: 3873 From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA Registered: Jan 2002 posted 03-31-2011 11:51 AM                     If you want more information on "Apocalypse Now" in 70MM with Split-Surrounds. Go to the warehouse on this site and look up Dolby SA-5 Surround Adapter. The manual shows the setup with the Dolby CP-100, before it was called format 43 on the CP-200. SA-5  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-31-2011 01:19 PM                     Interesting! I just re-read Bobby's post -- I never saw SUPERMAN in 70mm so I never knew there were problems getting the original mix to theatres. Unfortunately, I saw SUPERMAN with mono sound. But it was nonetheless the movie that made me want to know more about film-making. So...APOCALYPSE really was the first 70mm with split surrounds? Wow. Even Francis didn't know that!  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 04-01-2011 11:59 AM                        Manny: Yes, that is correct, although at least some reels of the Superman release were involved in tests. I installed an SA-5 adapter with the CP-100 at the Uptown in D.C. for Apocalyps. louis  |  IP: Logged System Notices Forum Watchdog / Soup Nazi Posts: 215 Registered: Apr 2004 posted 10-07-2015 12:57 PM                 It has been 1650 days since the last post.  |  IP: Logged Michael Coate Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1904 From: Los Angeles, California Registered: Feb 2001 posted 10-07-2015 12:57 PM                     When was the SA-5 adapter first made available? Dolby's company chronology does not make it clear. Was the adapter even available in time for "Superman"? Or was it not introduced until "Apocalypse Now"?  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 10-07-2015 01:25 PM                       You'd have to define available. An early version was installed for Superman for R & D. It was not provided officially until Apocalypse Now. They were based on CP50 frames and power supplies with a different backplane and cards.  |  IP: Logged Michael Coate Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1904 From: Los Angeles, California Registered: Feb 2001 posted 10-07-2015 01:33 PM                     To clarify, I'm not referring to the research & development period or "Superman"'s post-production phase. I'm referring to commercially. In other words, did any of the two dozen or so theaters in the United States that played a 70mm print of "Superman" first-run have the adapter so they could play it in split-surround format?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 10-07-2015 03:25 PM                     Check the Washington Post ads for it at the Uptown. The Uptown DID have a CP100 and SA5 but it was before I worked there so I can't tell you if they had it for Superman or not. The SA5 definitely looked like a kludge.  |  IP: Logged Michael Coate Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1904 From: Los Angeles, California Registered: Feb 2001 posted 10-07-2015 03:42 PM                     Steve... The newspaper ads don't provide any details about a split-surround presentation or the processor types used. "Superman" didn't play at the Uptown, anyway.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 10-07-2015 05:10 PM                     I'd think that split surround would have been advertised for that one. As for DC...the Uptown was the only theatre with the SA5. I think SA5s are a bit of a rare bird. I've never been able to land my hands on one. We do have a pretty full up CP100 and a few format modules for it. I'm sure I could take one of our CP50s and make it "look" like an SA5.  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 10-07-2015 11:37 PM                       I don't believe Superman was advertised with stereo surrounds as it was still in R & D. I just spoke to someone involved and there were a couple of early wire wrap card frames built before the SA5's were built. The Chinese or the Egyptian came to mind as the LA venue for this test.. North Point was likely the SF test venue. Apocalypse was always intended to be the first public release. Michael Karigosian was the engineer in charge so he would know best about the gory details..  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 10-09-2015 04:57 PM                        I did the Superman world priemere at the Uptown; standard Dolby 70mm. I installed the Sa5 for Apocalypse Now at the Uptown; also connected the Sennsurround Subs for LF. That film did have split surrounds; also World Premiere. (I think s/n 0005)  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 10-09-2015 07:49 PM                       My memory coincides with Louis, for once. I did research screenings and private tests in the bay area during the final mix phase of Apocalypse Now prior to being hired at Dolby Labs. I did a few of the SA5 installations including one in Vancouver and all were in low serial #'s.  |  IP: Logged

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