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This topic comprises 4 pages: 1 2 3 4
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Author
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Topic: Oil and Oiling?
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Steve Beverly
Film Handler
Posts: 83
From: El Paso, Tx.,
Registered: Nov 2007
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posted 01-05-2008 01:18 AM
Yeah but the problem is digital technology is in constant flux, those 80 grand projectors might be worth 2 grand in 5 years and nothing in 7. There are projectors in theaters, as you are well aware of, that have been in use for 70 or more years and are still running perfectly, PLUS the image is much better on those old machine than the best DLP made. That's one of the reasons I bought a dallies projector, to check fine details, color, focus, etcetera, to see what the image REALLY looked like. I have digital editing software and a small digital projector, but I knew they would never give me what I needed. "Course now an 80 grand one might, I don't know but it's kinda academic, 'cause I don't have that kinda money for a projector, HELL I don't have money for a Century SA or even a Simplex XL, so I went with what I COULD afford and that's the problem with theaters. 80 grand is a LOT of money to lay out and then recoup and there's no real incentive to change because employee salaries are also deductible and from what Tim said it was the MANAGER that thought the oil pump was shot, that's the scary part.
If there IS one thing I've learn dealing with computers, they're just as easy to f*ck up as any other machine and, most of the time, much more difficult to figure out what wrong and repair it. There's no such thing as maintenance free machinery so NOTHING is gonna run day in and day out unmanned for any length of time and certainly not long enough to recoup the 80 grand initial cost.
But hey, you know FAR, FAR more than I do about projection so I would never presume to attempt to challenge your assertions and must bow to your experience and knowledge. If you say it would be better I'll just have to assume you are right. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
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Scott Norwood
Film God
Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 01-05-2008 11:57 AM
Is a complete DLP installation still about $100k? If so, and if it lasts ten years, then it costs $10k/screen/year, not including maintenance and service contracts and such.
If you have a 10-plex, run 80 hours per week, and pay your operators $20/hour, the labor cost is $8k/screen/year.
If you make the assumption that a DLP system a) no longer requires an operator (since absolutely _every_ feature that you would ever want to book is available in the format, bulbs never need to be changed, nothing requires monitoring or regular adjustment, etc....right?) and b) is no more expensive to maintain than 35mm (cost of service contract and parts), then you are still paying more than $2k/screen/year extra.
This does make the assumption that the 35mm equipment is already bought and paid-for, but if we assume that a 35mm system that would be commonly found in a multiplex costs about $30k new (not including sound) and lasts for 30 years, it's still only $1k/screen/year.
I still don't see how the economics work (and how many theatres pay $20/hour for their regular operators?) for a mutiplex situation, unless the cost of a DLP system has come way down.
Admittedly, I can see how it would probably improve projection quality in may multiplexes, which is sad.
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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster
Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 01-05-2008 12:31 PM
quote: Scott Norwood
Is a complete DLP installation still about $100k? If so, and if it lasts ten years, then it costs $10k/screen/year, not including maintenance and service contracts and such.
No! The best gear can be installed for about 80K per booth, less in quantity(obviously). There are so many other things to factor in(or out) related to employees if you look at the big picture and it varies by State... things like sick time, lost work time, payroll expenses, taxes involved over and above the salary you pay... with Union dudes you also pay half the years salary into the union retirement fund IN ADDITION to the normal wages, then there is all the hassle involved in employee scheduling and the expense involved by management there, unemployment taxes, equipment that breaks down because the paid employees can't or don't know how to maintain it properly... like in Tim's post... I see more of that expense in my travels around than all other types of failures! The list literally goes on and on. Believe me if you could get a decent union operator for 8 grand a year don't you think the unions would still be running all the booths actross the USA? So the 80K is is the amount of offset that two of our customers arrived at more or less independently of each other. One has about 80 screens and the other about 130. The latter chain has more trouble because of booth people comming and going than any other chin I've ever delt with... booth employees change about every two weeks there, they discover quickly that McDonalds pays better and the charm of the archaic film gear wears off quickly on all but the biggest of AV CLub fans.
quote: Bill Enos
So Mark, when all the film equipment is gone and DLP or whatever comes next is all in and no more maintenance, repairs or installations are needed, what will you be doing? HA! I believe you'll be busier than ever. When electronic projectors get many thousands of hours on them and are as numerous as film machines the problems will be just as many as film machines and not as readily fixed.
I don't see myself as being any more or less busy but at least the repairs will HAVE TO BE DONE by competant technicians. I can't speak for BARCO and NEC but the folks at Christie have kept the actual booth service time down to a minimum over what I've seen of the other two brands.... Christie's units are much more ergonomically laid out and its incredibly easy to replace any part including the Light Engine, BARCO's light engine is also very easy to replace but BARCO's gear suffers from other major quirks including parts being harder to get than either NEC or Christie. The Christie service manual actually states the replacemnt time for many of the assembleys and or parts and after having been to their training class I would agree with the time assessments they give. How fast parts can be gotten is strictly up to the manufacturer...BARCO is by far the very worst here... but when a dealer has several hundred of the same units in the field its certainly wise for him to carry the major parts on his shelf as the norm. Otherwise you might be down a day at best while waiting for a major part... The AIX/Carmike agreement states a maximum of 4 hours down time before a projector/server is back up and running... how closley they've been able to adhere to that I can't say but a day at worst case would be the norm.... again not much different than a film system.
P.S. With a booth full of the same gear you also have access to multiple other parts borrowed from other projectors/servers to aid in diagnostics if needed... however all of the projectors and servers have extensive "log reports" available to aid both the technician and manufacturer in diagnosing all sorts of problems. Eventually, experience for all will grow over time and we will resume our "instinct diagnostics" ability like we've always done.
Mark
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![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Mark, IF I'da seen that 500 buck Christie DLP, you'd had some competition in the bidding, just so I coulda had a high end DLP! Those are NO DOUBT far and few between but I WILL keep an eye open for them, what other DLPs are comperable to the Chistie?
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Indeed they are!
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