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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Film Handling Gloves (Page 2)

 
This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3   
Author Topic: Film Handling Gloves
John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

- posted 03-07-2008 12:00 AM      Profile for John Hawkinson   Email John Hawkinson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Stu rights, "The problem with gloves is that you get a reduction in tactility with them, i.e. your ability to sense things with your fingers is reduced."

Do you speak from experience or speculation? I handcheck film with one glove and have done so for years, though occasionally I do without. I find that cotton gloves dramatically increase the sensitivity of my hands. In part this is because there is less friction against the cotton than the skin, so it's possible to get finer control of tension on the sides (without bowing).

I generally take off the glove to remove tape, which doesn't
really slow me down at all. I also find the loose glove handy to smooth down the splicing tape before punching it, because the cotton slides on the tape more smoothly than a finger, which sometimes skips/skids. After performing the splice, I put the glove back on.

--jhawk

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Ben LaCrosse
Film Handler

Posts: 27
From: Alpharetta, GA, USA
Registered: Feb 2008

- posted 03-07-2008 02:48 AM      Profile for Ben LaCrosse   Email Ben LaCrosse   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Cotton gloves leave too much debris for me. When I did use gloves I would also use a can of air to blow off all the little pieces of cotton that just gets everywhere, it seems. It was tedious and timely. I gave up and went all naturale.

I feel I do a much better job without gloves. My splices go through with virtually zero dust. Fingerprints? At first, I had a couple, during splicing. Not anymore. Around the cue's, yeah you'll be able to tell. Those are on the side and in black, no image.

I will say that gloves are not all that bad, however. I did like inspecting film with them. They are useful when winding trailers on from a core. And after you broke in a pair they didn't shed as much, but by that time they're dirty and you need to change them anyway.

It's just a matter of preference. That's what I love about it, you really can't be wrong.

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Ron Funderburg
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 814
From: Chickasha, Oklahoma, USA
Registered: Nov 2007

- posted 03-07-2008 11:08 AM      Profile for Ron Funderburg   Author's Homepage   Email Ron Funderburg   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mike no first I don't break down an assistant does but I taught him to leave one glove on and one off. We put a finger nail or thumb nail under the film and get one side to lift off trying not to touch the film but of course the finger nail has to. Once the side is peeled off we separate the film leaving the tape intact on the head side we attach the film leader to the splicing tape (with gloves back on) and wrap around and return the now full reel to the film box. Then we spice one side of the film and tail together and wind the tail around the next reel and start to take that reel off gloves on. When we get to the next reel joing splice we do it over.

As to the gloves I use film handling gloves a tightly woven glove very thin glove with little if any lent. There is little loss of feeling in them they are as thin as they can be! The gloves I guy (from a theater supply company) are a smallish glove that will stretch over ones hands fairly easy they are generic for left or right! One pair can last a day of build up and break down, they could probable go more but I throw them out after each Thursday.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 03-07-2008 08:45 PM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: John Hawkinson
Do you speak from experience or speculation? I handcheck film with one glove and have done so for years, though occasionally I do without. I find that cotton gloves dramatically increase the sensitivity of my hands. In part this is because there is less friction against the cotton than the skin, so it's possible to get finer control of tension on the sides (without bowing).
It obviously depends... if you go without gloves then you get to feel directly on the film but the friction gets in the way of sensitivity and gloves get rid of friction while keeping your fingers further away so you get less sensitivity. It's a combination.

And most of the chain theater people will tend to have whatever gloves their chain gets... which tend to be the cheapest and only one size.

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John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

- posted 03-07-2008 09:15 PM      Profile for John Hawkinson   Email John Hawkinson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Why does it "obviously depend"? Has anyone who has used gloves found that it decreases their sensitivity? Chris, have you used gloves and found that? (Also, I do not see why "further away" should have anything to do with it.)

I, like Ron, am puzzled by the comments about debris. I've never had any measurable debris from cotton gloves. What's the source of gloves that shed debris?

--jhawk

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

- posted 03-07-2008 10:20 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
I used to be a strong supporter of not wearing gloves, but there came a point where inspecting dozens of prints each week was chewing up the skin on my fingers so I tried the whole glove thing.

I can definitely say that for people who are used to inspecting without gloves, there is a good solid period of time where you WILL miss lab splices and other slight deformations during your inspections. Ultimately now that I forced myself to learn to inspect films with gloves, I can do a better job overall.

Don't splice with them on! You will absolutely get a better splice with your bare hands. I only wear a glove on my left hand and then whenever I have to stop to do some sort of repair work or join reels together, I take it off and do the splicing with both hands bare, then slide it back onto my left hand to continue inspecting. I also toss the glove after inspecting one print (and this is usually after I have flipped the glove "backwards" on my hand halfway through the print to use the other side too). Gloves do tend to get dirty and collect dust that will get attracted to the print if you do not toss them regularly.

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Ron Funderburg
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 814
From: Chickasha, Oklahoma, USA
Registered: Nov 2007

- posted 03-07-2008 11:38 PM      Profile for Ron Funderburg   Author's Homepage   Email Ron Funderburg   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
At K-Theaters in Longmont, co they required you to wear gloves even when threading up!

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Stu Jamieson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 524
From: Buccan, Qld, Australia
Registered: Jan 2008

- posted 03-08-2008 02:16 AM      Profile for Stu Jamieson   Email Stu Jamieson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: John Hawkinson
Stu rights, "The problem with gloves is that you get a reduction in tactility with them, i.e. your ability to sense things with your fingers is reduced."

Do you speak from experience or speculation?
Not speculation, just fact. The skin is an incredibly sensitive organ and if you cover it up, then by default you decrease it's sensitivity to anything on the other side of the covering material. Take a pin and scrape it over the tip of your finger, then put on a glove and do the same; the difference in sensitivity is obvious. Brad makes a valid point that in time your senses sharpen to the point where you can do a serviceable job - no argument there - but that sensitivity can never be as fine as bare skin. It can't! You've put a barrier between the sensing tool and the workpiece.

As for friction, I'd say that (the way I do it, anyway) is negligible. Sure there's some initial friction for about the first second as the respiration is stripped from your fingers but after that it's a pretty smooth action, particularly after the film puts that nice smooth polish on them. The magnitude of friction is more a function of how you hold it.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

- posted 03-08-2008 02:23 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
But as I have found, when wearing gloves it permits you to get a better grip on the edges of the film to feel for defects, which is something the bare hands has to do very lightly.

There is one major problem with wearing gloves though, and that is some people seem to think they can feel the PICTURE area of the film with the gloves because "well, I'm wearing gloves so it's safe to run my fingers over the image area". Not so!

In the end though, whichever method works the best for a particular person is what I endorse. I've got some projectionists that use gloves and some that don't. That doesn't make one any better than the other provided good film handling practices are employed.

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Aaron Mehocic
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 804
From: New Castle, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 99

- posted 03-08-2008 04:48 PM      Profile for Aaron Mehocic   Email Aaron Mehocic   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Didn't Fox send a package of white cotton gloves to all theaters scheduled to play the enhanced release of Episode IV back some years ago? Was this another one of Lucas's idosyncratic meddlings or an attempt to reeducate the masses in proper film handling techniques?

For the record I do not use gloves, but do respect the validity of those who do.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 03-08-2008 06:34 PM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: John Hawkinson
Why does it "obviously depend"? Has anyone who has used gloves found that it decreases their sensitivity? Chris, have you used gloves and found that? (Also, I do not see why "further away" should have anything to do with it.)
Why does it depend? Because no two people are completely alike. And I'd say it's harder for me to notice a splice go by with gloves on than not.

And being further away has everything to do with it. It's called padding. Some of the force is dissipated inside the glove itself.

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Ron Funderburg
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 814
From: Chickasha, Oklahoma, USA
Registered: Nov 2007

- posted 03-08-2008 09:12 PM      Profile for Ron Funderburg   Author's Homepage   Email Ron Funderburg   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Chris, I agree many things are harder with the gloves on. I have cut the fore finger out of right glove on occasion to have easier time with the splicing tape. I have put the film in position on the splicer then removed my right glove to do the splice, turn the film over with the left hand only and splice that side. I have spliced with the gloves on and unaltered it is harder to be sure. But I think the film is better off if you use the gloves.

I have never had a problem feeling the splices go though, but that is me, then again if I didn't feel the splice I would have had to be looking at the screen to know it!

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 03-08-2008 09:48 PM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
I have never had a problem feeling the splices go though, but that is me, then again if I didn't feel the splice I would have had to be looking at the screen to know it!
Huh? I was referring to feeling the splice when tearing down a movie.

Though I'm not your average person in this respect... even now that I'm available to work on Thursdays I haven't been building up or tearing down regularly and last semester I had a class every Thursday night.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 03-09-2008 12:23 AM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
On a similar note:
Do they make cotton finger cots? Since you shouldn't ever have your palm get near the print anyway I thought cots (especially with some elastic on the open end) would deal well with sizing problems that are found with cotton gloves.

The only finger cots I've ever found wouldn't work at all (being made of stuff similar to what Ron was asking about).

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Phil Hill
I love my cootie bug

Posts: 7595
From: Hollywood, CA USA
Registered: Mar 2000

- posted 03-09-2008 12:29 AM      Profile for Phil Hill   Email Phil Hill       Edit/Delete Post 
Brad, our Grand-Poopie-BAH, uses latex finger cots for safesex rubbers...fits him perfectly. [Eek!] [Razz] [Big Grin]

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