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This topic comprises 3 pages: 1 2 3
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Author
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Topic: Core-only film shipment
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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today
Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99
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posted 07-04-2010 08:00 PM
quote: Joe Redifer
Dan, please upload your picture directly to Film-Tech. Do not link to outside pictures. Your link isn't even working!
Worked for me just now, you ass.
quote: Brad Miller
Dan - upload the pic to this web server or I will remove this thread.
He means it, Dan!
quote: Brad Miller
A proper wind can be accomplished in a number of ways.
...........
Breaking down from a GOOD platter directly onto a split reel, as in a Christie, SPECO, etc. Not shit platters like Strong that don't have backtension.
I use Strong platters and I get extremely tight winds, tight enough to use as a discus. They make a very solid sound when you knock on the film that is wound to the core. I don't have a clutch, don't hold the deck with a rag or anything and I get tight winds unless I am winding ridiculously slow. So long as the spring on the MUT has a bit of tension on it, the wind will be tight. Tight winds on the takeup deck coming from the projector, now that's another story entirely. I'm not sure how to accomplish this on the Strong without skipping rollers. I know it can be done because the prints wrapped very solid at Greenwood.
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Monte L Fullmer
Film God
Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004
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posted 07-05-2010 12:44 AM
Trick with winding films on cores, no matter what size of core you have, and using either a core winder disc, or a 2000ft split reel (preferred, since the split reel will lock the core in place compared to the core winder since the tension on the film coming from the 'free spindle' will actually pull the core off the winder at the beginning, unless you hold the core in when you begin the wind), is to hold the film lightly against the flange of either device while the film is winding on the core
I never use the automatic arm, but do the entire wind manually so I can have full control of the entire wind.
I have enough tension so the film winding on the core is being snug to tight on the core -about the same as the labs do when they wind the film on the cores prior to shipment.
Taking up on shipping reels was and is a common practice with changeover booths on the last night of showing with us "old school" projectionists.
If using a split reel, have the threaded part of the reel hub on the rewind shaft. That way, with the spindle rotating clockwise and soundtrack to the outside, the outer flange won't come unscrewed.
With this, no matter how much footage of film is winding on the core, you'll have a very smooth and tight wind on the core.
good luck-Monte
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Mitchell Dvoskin
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1869
From: West Milford, NJ, USA
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 07-05-2010 01:19 PM
> We have a Kelmar 7900 rewind bench.
You can not get a "true" tight wind with a Kelmar rewind bench, although you can get close enough with a little practice and patience. A true "tight wind" is accomplished with a winder that can use a tight wind attachment. A split reel is not used, but rather the attachment that consists of a heavy weighted roller and guide arm/bracket that allows it to ride on top of the film as it is being wound. The weight of the roller creates the tight wind, not excessive back tension.
To get a good core wind with a Kelmar table, you will need a real split reel, not those cheap shipping reel flanges. Rewind normally onto the core/split reel, at a little under 50% speed, lightly holding the feed reel with your hands if the tension pads on the Kelmar table do not provide a consistent smooth even wind. There should not be a lot of back tension, just enough to lift the rewind roller up.
> have always been told never to use split reels on the projectors.
Bullshit. If your projectors takeup has enough speed to take up with the smaller diameter cores, then there is no reason not to use them on the projector. Some projectors do not turn the takeup fast enough to take up on 3" or under cores.
> and only in a certain orientation on the rewind bench.
One side of the split reel grabs the rewind shaft pin, and turns the core. The other side grabs the pin, but does not turn the core. If you put this side in, the split reel will come apart during winding.
> if the split reel is on the left spindle it actually spins counter clock-wise
See answer above. Does not matter which way it is spinning.
Would tightening the tension on the left spindle on the rewind bench help?
NO!, that will just cause cinch mark scratches on the film.
> How do you know when is too much tension?
Just enough tension to lift the automatic shutoff arm.
> should I use the automatic arm?
You do not have too, but unless it does not spin freely, there is no reason not too. Provides a more even tensioned wind when coring, since the back tension pads do not always provide an even back tension.
> Is it really safe to take-up cores using split reels?
Yes.
> We have a Simplex XL
Should work fine.
> Is it ever a bad idea to take-up onto shipping reels
Only if the shipping reel is bent or damaged.
> Do split reels indeed unscrew accidentally on a spindle?
Only when they are put on the rewind facing the wrong way.
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Ottilie Young
Film Handler
Posts: 15
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 08-09-2010 12:24 PM
Hi:
Mitchell, thanks for your incredibly helpful, detailed explanation of how split reels work. Sorry it's taken so long to respond.
Just to be clear I understand what you're saying.
You said:
“One side of the split reel grabs the rewind shaft pin, and turns the core. The other side grabs the pin, but does not turn the core. If you put this side in, the split reel will come apart during winding.”
On only one flange of the split reel, there is a pin (not the “key” on the spindle post, but one an inch or so away on the flange itself that sticks out about ¼”) that engages the core in one of the 8 indented segments (between the outer perimeter of the core and the inner spindle hole). I’m assuming that flange of the split reel which has the pin that engages and turns the core should be inside, toward the rewind table/projector and the other flange should be out, toward the operator.
Thanks Again!
Ottilie Young
Equipment Chair
Doc Films
University of Chicago
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