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Author Topic: Recommend me a dimmer Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-23-2009 07:03 PM                        I will also vote for the Kelmar! I've used them before and they are cool. The problem with Kelmar is that everything they sell is overpriced for what they are, it seems. I have also used LFI dimmers and they are fine if a bit weird, but they don't have buttons directly on them to press the level you desire so that usually confuses me for a good 45 seconds or so when I need to turn the lights up or down without the automation.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-23-2009 08:55 PM                     Kelmar also has buttonless dimmers...called Architectual Dimmers. Kelmar dimmers are NOT over priced...they are right priced and made here in the good ol' USA. What is the cost/year of owning a Kelmar dimmer. Do you really think Kelmar's folks are living like AIG bonus babies?  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-23-2009 09:42 PM                        For an automated house, I really like the blue "Lehigh Electric Movie Pack" dimmers that seem to be in every ex-GCC house. They are very flexible and adjustments are easy to make without having to open up the unit. Unfortunately, I don't believe that they are made anymore.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-24-2009 01:28 AM                        quote: Steve Guttag Do you really think Kelmar's folks are living like AIG bonus babies? Wanna fight about it?  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 03-25-2009 12:50 PM                        quote: Joe Redifer The problem with Kelmar is that everything they sell is overpriced On what do you base that? Merely the numbers? Everything I've purchased from Kelmar is built like brick *houses and has required little or no attention. Their rewind benches are almost everywhere. Their dimmers don't quit. Their dowsers could probably pull 6 times the weight they're normally hooked up to (and sound like it). I've even seen a couple of their old, monaural amplifier packs around... unfortunately, still working very well. I think the first solar cell conversions I worked with were Kelmars. Not everything is only worth having if it's the cheapest version you can get. So there.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-25-2009 12:54 PM                        I didn't say they weren't any good! Except for those mono amplifiers. They suck. That entire sound rack sucks.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-25-2009 01:37 PM                        Agreed with Jack--Kelmar makes good stuff. None of it is very exciting, but it all works. I actually don't mind the Kelmar mono sound systems, aside from the fact that all of them should have been upgraded to Dolby years (decades) ago. They are reliable. The pots don't go bad over time (at least not as far as I have seen). The 50-watt version is enough to fill a 700-seat house with sound if there's an A4 behind the screen. There's a 1/4" test jack to connect an RTA when doing A-chains. And the monitor amplifer is a built-in backup in case anything fails. It would be nice if they had a greater adjustment range on the projector inputs and some sort of electronic changeover logic, but that is a minor quibble. I tend to make fun of theatre owners who still use stuff like this, but that doesn't mean that they aren't good products.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 03-25-2009 03:24 PM                        I once serviced a 1700 seat theatre with a 15 watt Kelmar and an A-1X. With the very effecient speaker, it was way enough power. BTW: no great gain adjustment was to force cheap owners to actually repair the soundhead, rather than to just turn down the loud one. Louis  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-25-2009 03:48 PM                        quote: Scott Norwood Agreed with Jack--Kelmar makes good stuff. None of it is very exciting, but it all works So I guess people think I said Kelmar makes bad stuff. Their dimmer excites me. Their rewind bench is good, but it only has a motor on one side and the table itself is particle board which ends up sagging after a few years. It is a nice table and much better than the Neumade which I currently have, but look at the price of a new one. It's over $1000 last I heard. Kelmar also cut costs on their media cleaner. They have those tiny little thumbscrews instead of the custom fat ones that used to be on them. I hate those little flat round ones. Oh well, at least Kelmar sells it for much cheaper than Christie did when they were the distributor.  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-25-2009 04:11 PM                     lets be fair there mono amps and stereo racks sucked there rewind table in concept was great but the table top sags the motors have more brush issues than any other I have delt with and the control box is over engineered There automations are far more trouble than ones like the TA10 there reverse scan readers have had the highest powersupply failure rates we deal with yes they make nice products but they are not the best just my humble opinion  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-25-2009 04:46 PM                     I only agree with one thing Gord posted... the reverse scan power suppliers are really bad... the new ones are fine though. I've replaced two ole ones this year so far... Now on to the rest... The mono amps... well they're mono... what do you want? Theya re among the most reliable mono amp systems ever built and with the built in spare amp you can just switch sides and keep going... if it ever does die. The rewind benches... You're not suposed to let your 350 lb projectionists sit on them. We have more Kelmar benches in this area by far and I've had the least amount of problems with them. Want over engineering... look closley at the current Neumade rewind bench cluster fuck control box! And Joe... the Kelmar benches can be ordered with motor at both ends if desired. Their automations are no more or less reliable than others of the type... and all microswitch/relay based automations are going to be experiencing ALOT MORE TROUBLE then usual since lead has been deleted out of switch contacts... Ditto for Strong PLatter micro switches! Also there are but a handful of companies that provide the corteous support that Kelmar does. Thomas really knows how to take care of his customers like a gentleman. Mark  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-25-2009 04:47 PM                     quote: Joe Redifer So I guess people think I said Kelmar makes bad stuff. No, you implied that it was somehow over priced...and that is simply not correct. Over priced implies low value...As most others have noted, their stuff performs very well and lasts a long time...implying high-value. quote: Joe Redifer Their rewind bench is good, but it only has a motor on one side You can have it with one or two motors, your choice and had been that way for as long as I can remember. quote: Joe Redifer and the table itself is particle board which ends up sagging after a few years. Actually, it was worse than particle board, it was honeycomb board... They've changed that...I don't have sagging problems. They also wrap the edge now with a molding so you don't have laminated formica peeling off. They've changed the leg design for MUCH faster assembly and rigidity. Their control box is now UL listed (with the largest UL badge I've ever seen...don't know the story there...I guess they were proud). Is it over $1000...I would hope so. Just how many rewind tables do you think are sold per year? Just how can a company that is making low-volume equipment sell things at Wal-Mart made by the millions prices? In fact...is there anyone making a motorized rewind table for under $1K? If they are, is it legal (OSHA/UL)? There is a time for custom hardware and a time when it just adds to the cost of things. The film cleaner is a very expensive piece in many eyes. If their thumb screws were custom (and likely were not), they would have to order how many of them? At two per film cleaner...how many would they have to sell to even get their nut back. Again, un-realistic if Kelmar or any Movie industry manufacturer wants to remain profitable. BTW...Gord...I don't think I've ever had a Kelmar motor brush issue...I've had the variac wear out (Stancor), belts wear/shed and numerous shafts wear out. In fact, the shafts are the worst part of the whole table...the 5/16" ones bend if you look at them too hard. As to their amplifiers...they are not great Hi-Fi, for sure but they have pleased a great many folks and are easy to service. Generally, it is their electrolytics that fail. There is one that is often inserted backwards and it fails (being used as a DC blocking cap to the input signal). I agree, their stereo racks were very wanting in many respects. I've never liked any of their booth monitors. As to their automations...I've had a mixed feeling about them. For what they were, they did just fine. They are rather clumsy now for handling anything but basic stuff. I absolutely HATE their current manual switches and the Series VII method of choosing the sound format is retarded. Steve  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-25-2009 06:05 PM                     actually the kelmar rewind motors have been a major failure over time almost as bad as the neumade bodine motors  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-25-2009 07:08 PM                        Is it legal to sell a table for under $1000? That's a good one. So because Kelmar doesn't sell many tables at all, I should happily pay out the ass? I guess they need the money more than me, that's only fair! I could understand if they were selling it for more in other countries just so they could sell it for less here and undercut everyone else. I think that is called Dumping or something like that. Their mono amps failed on us ALL THE TIME. We would have to take the extra amp out which served as a booth monitor and plug it in to be the speaker amp. Then those would eventually fail and we'd have no sound at all. So Steve, even if a Honda Civic cost $38,000 and had rock solid reliability (which they do), you wouldn't say it was overpriced? That is not implying the Civic is a bad car, it is implying that they are asking perhaps a bit much for it. Well over $1,000 for a honeycomb board table which sags, one motor, some switches, a dial and some steel legs is pushing it. It couldn't cost them anywhere near that much to make, and this is in 1990's dollars I am talking here (when they were making much more of these tables to boot). I am glad that they improved their product, though. I hope Kelmar isn't going out of business like I hear Neumade is.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-25-2009 07:17 PM                     Gord.... You do have pretty awful Hydro up there in some areas! I can't remembner the last time we had a Kelmar motor fail... even if they do they are rebuildable. Mark  |  IP: Logged

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