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This topic comprises 4 pages: 1 2 3 4
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Topic: 1993-94 DTS audio??
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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."
Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 11-29-2012 08:46 AM
The theatrical DTS format used a waveform compression codec called APT-X100 and ran at 820 kilobits per second (IIRC). It's a completely different format from the consumer DTS lossy compression format (the DTS Coherent Acoustics codec).
I'm not entirely certain, but I seem to remember reading claims from WinAmp users about being able to play audio files from theatrical DTS discs made up until the early 2000's. That goes along with DTS making some changes to how the discs were encoded which apparently broke the WinAmp ability to play DTS theatrical discs made from then on.
quote: Daniel Schulz
There was a slight change made to the file formats immediately after Jurassic Park to correct a few technical issues and update the .exe to support new CD drive hardware.
I thought that all the original 2-drive DTS-6 and DTS-S units used the same 2X speed SCSI-based Toshiba CD-ROM caddy style drives. Perhaps it was an update to improve performance of those drives?
The main technical issue I remember being solved after the 2nd or maybe 3rd Universal release with DTS: the movie title being included in the time code to prevent the wrong discs being loaded for a given movie. Apparently one or more theaters had cases where discs for Jurassic Park were either loaded or simply left in the disc drives for playing Heart & Souls, Universal's 2nd movie with DTS. I'm not sure if Hard Target was the first release done with the corrected time code.
quote: Daniel Schulz
The very first run of Jurassic Park discs do not play back in modern DTS and Datasat hardware for this reason (we have of course since then made new Jurassic Park discs).
Do those discs play with the original first run of Jurassic Park prints, the ones with the shorter "digital experience" snipe and proper looking DTS logo on the end credits? Another run of Jurassic Park prints were made several months later. The logos on the end credits are different; the DTS "digital experience" logo was horribly goofed up looking and the Dolby logo used was the dreaded triple format logo with the silly "verify theater format" tagline underneath.
quote: Monte L Fullmer
Jurassic Park - being the first with DTS in 1993, was four channel only along with their players. By the next year, DTS made the revision on the players for six channel playback.
Even though others have sort of responded to this, I'll do so directly.
The DTS format launched with both 6-track and stereo versions. The stereo versions were offered, at a $1000 price discount, to increase installation numbers. I don't know the breakdown between DTS-6 installation versus DTS-S installations for the original roll out with Jurassic Park. The DTS-S units helped boost that format debut theater count to over 800. At the time DTS was introduced with Jurassic Park Dolby Digital was equipped on perhaps 100 screens in North America, if even that. The first generation Dolby Digital systems were commanding a $20K price tag compared to the cheap price for DTS.
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Brad Miller
Administrator
Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99
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posted 11-30-2012 02:05 AM
Sooooo much confusion here.
Yes "stereo" (Lt, Rt) discs existed in the beginning. Yes they ran through the optical preamp input and matrix decoder as explained above. They were always labeled "STEREO" as opposed to the usual "6 TRACK" everyone is used to seeing.
On a side note, any dts disc with a 4 digit serial number is a standard 5.1 mix (although Louis is correct, there was no actual subwoofer channel...it was derived from stealing frequencies out of the surrounds via a crossover). Any dts disc with a 5 digit serial number is an EX / ES release. (ES was just the dts name for EX, but it is the same thing.)
Yes the first two titles, Jurassic Park and Heart and Souls have since had a remaster done on the discs so they can play with XD10 and newer players. The original discs will play only in dts-6 and dts6-d players...nothing newer.
Yes the remastered discs for JP does have the short dts logo on them, as back then those logos were physically attached (printed on without a splice) to the beginning of the movies. This turned out to be a bad idea, as even mono theaters were playing the snipe, but these early releases had an annoying issue (and these titles are affected) where if you cut the logo off to put a newer version of the logo on, the "start" command in the timecode is lost and the entire first reel will not play in dts digital sound! (Seriously, I have absolutely verified this.) I could be wrong, but I THINK that was corrected by Hard Target...to where you could start mid-reel. In a nutshell, if you were running a Jurassic Park print and had to stop the show during a reel for whatever reason, when you started it back up you would be running analog sound until the next reel change where another "start" command was in the timecode. As I stated, dts quickly fixed that.
No there was never Jurassic Park prints with the longer dts logo printed onto them for the reasons above.
Yes the restruck prints have the same timecode and play with the same discs. This is the same reason why you could have the same discs and play the US (Paramount) or European (Fox) print of Titanic...or similarly, play English discs with a French dubbed print from Canada.
Yes the third release Hard Target had the "technical issue" resolved, and original discs from that day will play fine even in the latest XD20 player.
Yes there IS a Winamp plugin that enables the dts cinema discs to play on a PC. That all changed with the third Lord of the Rings movie thanks to piracy paranoia. I used to have a copy somewhere, but I've no idea where it is or if I still have it.
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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."
Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 12-01-2012 10:46 PM
quote: Louis Bornwasser
Universal releases were dts only with analog backup for a number of years. Perhaps someone remembers when DD showed up on their prints.
Like Robert Harrison said, Blues Brothers 2000 was Universal's first movie release to have Dolby Digital alongside DTS time code on the film print. SDDS was there too. But Universal's first releases using Dolby Digital took place back in 1993, Matinee in January of 1993 and Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story in May.
From Jurassic Park to In the Name of the Father Universal releases had DTS with Dolby-branded noise reduction applied to the analog tracks. Schindler's List was their first release without the Dolby brand on the analog track. From that point onto a few years later DTS was treating both the digital and analog track on Universal releases. IIRC, MGM's Blown Away was the first movie to use both the DTS Digital Sound logo and DTS Stereo logo on poster art, TV commercials, etc.
Universal dropped their exclusive use of DTS for digital sound first with The Boxer at the end of 1997. That one had DTS and SDDS. Universal released Half Baked a couple weeks later with DTS and SDDS.
One thing that hasn't been clear to me, once Universal started ordering quad format 35mm release prints with Blues Brothers 2000 did they start using Dolby-branded A-type or SR-type noise reduction on the optical analog tracks again?
quote:
Yes the remastered discs for JP does have the short dts logo on them, as back then those logos were physically attached (printed on without a splice) to the beginning of the movies. This turned out to be a bad idea, as even mono theaters were playing the snipe, but these early releases had an annoying issue (and these titles are affected) where if you cut the logo off to put a newer version of the logo on, the "start" command in the timecode is lost and the entire first reel will not play in dts digital sound!
From June 1993 to April 1994 the shorter DTS "the digital experience" snipe was attached to the front of all Universal Studios 35mm release prints. I saw it play a few different times in analog sound here in Lawton (at theaters that are no longer in operation) during that period. I don't remember if the longer digital experience snipe was debuted with The Crow. I saw it for the first time one the front of Speed.
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Just my 2 cents on the matter anyways.
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