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This topic comprises 5 pages: 1 2 3 4 5
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Topic: New L.A. Theatre Features 4K Digital Projection
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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster
Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 06-16-2007 07:50 PM
quote: Tristan Lane
I can't count how many times I've had to let a 35mm projector sit dark for over a day due to the fact that parts were unavailable to repair immediately. Even belt failures have cost theaters more than 10 minutes of lost time due to the fact that they didn't have any spare belts on hand. Kinoton machines could have a Lenze inverter fail (due to resistor R2 on the primary PCB blowing), and without a spare onsite, a similar down time could result. All due to that "cursed" new technology that is evil and terrible.
Or........ A platter power supply could fail
Or........ A High Reactance tranny could fail
Or........ An intermittent could fail, with no spare on site
Or........ Resistor R2 could fail on a reverse scan reader in a non-digital equipped theater
Gimme a break................
Break given... I'm on your side for sure and I can't wait till the day I don't have to mess with that googy oil in projectors and sound heads nor clean out the crud that all Simplex shutters manage to suck into the back end.
I also can't begin to tell you how many days I've waited at distant locations for projector, sound, or platter parts to arrive.... gives me good time to explore an area though ![[thumbsup]](graemlins/thumbsup.gif) . When I worked in broadcast once a new unit was debugged and up and running it rarely ever failed... usually never... excepting DBX gear. The most frequent thing replaced was 2" video tape heads back then as they had a limited 1000 hour life to begin with. Big stations had proper cooling for their equipment... the ceiling was the cold air feeding the tops of all racks and the raised floor was the return plenum for that. Things were very reliable... never a Tektronix, Grass Valley, nor other major piece of gear failed. Just two failures of simple components in TK45's over three years.
Yep, I look forword to the all electronic cinema big time be it 2K or 4K! 2K's exist in this area by the droves and do extremely well in the reliability department overall. There is basically zero down time. The worst thing I can remember happenning is a lamp explosion in a Barco. It was pushed over hours to experiment with its life span on purpose.
Overall things will be more reliable .
quote: Ramon Lamarca Marques
Digital is cold, film is warm the only reason film is going is because of money.
I disagree. I've seen quite a few presentations projected digitally now and in fact I have come to prefer it. It doesn't look cold unless the projector's color space is set up improperly. IN fact it can match film quite remarkably. Soon it may actually surpass film in color range and contrast ratio, some projectors are VERY close now!. I agree on the money thing though!!
Mark
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Ramon Lamarca Marques
Expert Film Handler
Posts: 186
From: Edgware, England, UK
Registered: Feb 2006
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posted 06-17-2007 05:41 AM
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
I disagree. I've seen quite a few presentations projected digitally now and in fact I have come to prefer it.
It is certainly a very subjective matter. What I meant is that cinemas for me always represented a big step from what can be enjoyed at home, it used to be a big event for me, the big event is no more and unless they do something radical to bring that "wow" effect back they have lost me as a customer. Nevertheless, I will still go socially sometimes and to see classics (on film support only). It is a personal choice, I know. For 9 sterling pounds I expect to get a large, slightly curved screen, five speakers behind the screen and a quality matching 65/70, no less. I saw K-Pax yesterday at home, a rather well done film, and I thought that there was no difference seeing it at home or at the multiplex, I would never say that about Lawrence of Arabia or How the West was won.
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Tristan Lane
Master Film Handler
Posts: 444
From: Nampa, Idaho
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 06-18-2007 12:02 AM
As someone who deals with it every day, I can honestly say that average presentation quality has increased dramatically since the departure of film in the theaters I service.
That's not to say that film can't out-do 2K. There are many theaters that can produce outstanding images using the correct equipment, and having the right people operate and maintain that equipment. But in this multiplex laden world, where the bottom dollar counts more than pristine presentation, Digital offers a level of consistently reliable presentation that the customer will enjoy. Also, these good theaters are hard to find, and the average customer probably doesn't notice all of the efforts that the operators put into making a stellar show, but we would all wish to think so.
Digital has kept me just as busy as film did. The workload has been evenly distributed between the different components in the system. Basically the film projector head and platter have just been replaced by a light engine and media server. As time progresses, the light engine is proving itself to be very reliable. Most of the calls I have dealt with have been equally spread between sound, server playback (software), content distribution, and the occasional lamphouse issue.
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Scott Jentsch
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1061
From: New Berlin, WI, USA
Registered: Apr 2003
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posted 06-19-2007 01:41 PM
quote:
quote: Ben Wales
Cinema's are only marketing platforms for DVD Home Market sales
I hate this statement. It doesn't give "cinema" the respect it deserves. Without the cinema industry there would be no DVD industry. We are the engine that pulls the train.
I agree that cinemas are currently the engine that pulls the train, that will only be true so long as cinemas continue to be granted the exclusive engagement that studios currently provide to them.
From a marketing standpoint, showing a movie in commercial theaters is still necessary for movie studios because of the credibility that the public (and the industry, such as AMPAS, which requires a theatrical run for qualification for the Oscars, if I recall correctly) holds for movies that appear first in movie theaters and then on home video.
I don't say this to be disrespectful to anyone here, but that exclusive engagement will end at some point, and theaters will lose the cachet of lending that credibility to movies in the eyes of the paying public.
All it will take is a successful launch by a studio of a movie that has a day-and-date release on home video, or a home-video-only release (no theatrical release at all). That will be the first fissure in the dam that will gradually widen and allow the floodwaters to rush through, quite possibly leveling many/most movie theaters in the process.
To date, we've seen only mediocre and/or limited releases done day-and-date. 2929 Entertainment is doing day-and-dates with Landmark Theatres, but since the movies that have been done haven't been blockbuster-scaled movies, a real test has yet to be done.
What would happen if, say, Pirates of the Caribbean 3 were to have been released day-and-date? Same budget, same marketing push, same cast and storyline. For credibility sake, let's assume that it would have been available on both the iTunes Store and Amazon for immediate download on opening day or for purchase on DVD/HD DVD/Blu-ray with delivery guaranteed for opening day.
Bottom line: People that wanted to see the movie on opening day would have it available to them in their homes. People that wanted to see the movie on opening day in a movie theater would be able to do so (assuming that movie theaters would not boycott the release).
What kind of impact do you think that would have on the future of movie theaters as the "engine that pulls the train"? I think it would have a major impact!
It's a perception thing that succeeding generations are more than happy to adjust to. Those of us who grew up on the traditional release schedules will find it very odd, but I'd bet that many teenagers would have no issue whatsoever accepting a movie with a big-name cast and that delivered the entertainment they are expecting no matter what medium it was shown on.
Lest everyone think that I believe that movie theaters are doomed to extinction, I don't. Movie theaters still have the ability to provide an experience that cannot be matched in the home, no matter how much money has been poured into a home theater. There are aspects of going to a movie theater that cannot be replicated, and it's up to movie theaters to leverage those advantages.
The ability to show a 4K (or higher) resolution image is one of those advantages, if the source material is available. However, just as with home theater projection and digital cameras, resolution isn't the only qualitative factor affecting the picture quality of the movie. There are lots of factors involved.
Unfortunately, I think that far too many theaters lean on the exclusive release as a crutch to deliver mediocre presentations. There are excellent theaters out there, I'm sure, but from the feedback that I see on a regular basis, those excellent theaters are the exception, not the norm.
Home video is training people to become accustomed to no jump or weave at all. There are no such things as audio dropouts, bad film splices, or dust, dirt, and scratches. If someone comes to my home and pulls out a cell phone and starts talking, they would be shown the door pretty quickly as such behavior would be unacceptable.
People who are used to film have become so used to jump and weave and other film-related issues that such issues have become part of the experience. The same is true for people that haven't given up their vinyl LP's because they like the sound; pops, crackles, hiss, and all.
I was in a high-end audio shop the other day, and this guy was playing some music on a $1,000 turntable and comparing it to a CD that was in a very expensive CD transport. To him, the LP sounded better. To me, the LP had a chestiness to the sound that also had rolled-off highs. In comparison, the CD might have been a little bright, but it sounded much more pleasing to me. He was ready to plunk down the cash for the turntable, though.
While I do believe that it is possible for high quality LP's to sound better than the standard run-of-the-mill CD production, I think that this guy was much more affected by his sentimental attachment to the character of the LP than to the pure audio quality of the product. I think a parallel can be drawn to film and digital cinema.
Anyone getting angst-ridden about the fact that technology marches on and refusing to make the jump to digital cinema is ignoring the possible benefits that doing so can provide to their business.
Companies deal with technology obsolescence all the time, and you don't see office buildings tossing hundreds of PC's out the door just because some new Intel processor has been released. The oldest boxes get replaced as they need to be, and they bring new boxes in to serve their needs. (I have a client whose file server is 8 years old, ancient by technology standards!)
I think I might have lost my point along the line here, but I see digital cinema being a boon for theaters to streamline their operations and opening up new possibilities for content and revenue. There seems to be financial assistance available to do so, depending on the situation, so the cost impact might be able to be addressed as well.
Digital Cinema is the inevitable future. I think even its most ardent opponents will begrudgingly admit that fact. If I owned a theater, I'd be taking the classes that Mark has mentioned, and getting to know as much as possible about the products and what deals are available so that I could make an informed decision about when to take the plunge.
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Scott Norwood
Film God
Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 06-19-2007 02:48 PM
quote: Scott Jentsch
All it will take is a successful launch by a studio of a movie that has a day-and-date release on home video, or a home-video-only release (no theatrical release at all). That will be the first fissure in the dam that will gradually widen and allow the floodwaters to rush through, quite possibly leveling many/most movie theaters in the process.
I don't see a problem with this. Most theatres suck. Let the generic multiplexes die--they don't deserve to continue to exist. I agree with the previous poster that theatres need to provide something more than just seats, a screen, and exclusive rights to product.
I've been of two minds on the simultaneous-release thing for a while, but have since come to the conclusion that, yes, it would kill many theatres and that, assuming that it kills the dumpy ones that survive only because of the "theatrical window" and not because they are actually providing a quality "entertainment experience," the industry will ultimately be better off with fewer screens that are of higher quality than what is typically found today.
Does "Pirates" really need to open on thousands of screens? I don't think so. I'd rather see something like that open on one or two screens in a given market, and see those houses really put on a show, complete with 70mm prints, short films before the main feature, and first-rate presentation and customer service throughout. Installing big-screen TV sets doesn't help here, but 70mm does. The theatres that would benefit most from ![[dlp]](graemlins/dlp.gif) are the ones that can't handle film properly and which should just go away.
Having said that, I'd also love to see a big-name film and/or director release a feature only to the theatrical market, never to be avaialble on VHS/DVD/TV/HD/etc. Don't any big-name directors truly believe that films should be experienced in good theatres? If so, then why won't they put their money where their mouths are?
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