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Topic: D Cinema in trouble?

Dustin Mitchell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1865
From: Mondovi, WI, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 03-09-2007 09:18 AM

Frank makes a very good point (even if he didn't intend to [Wink]

). DCinema will ultimately, in my opinion, not be the determining factor if a theatre chain succedes or fails. Sure, if they make a huge financial outlay and that pulls them under you could say DCinema was the cause, but so far that hasn't been the case. No, theatres will survive or fail based on their operations. If a theatre chain that embraces digital technology runs into trouble I would not be so quick to blame the digital projectors as I would to blame poor operations.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 03-15-2007 08:03 PM

After coming back from Showest, it looks like D-Cinema is on the strong uphill climb and never will stop. Good luck to all of the manufacturers who make this device.

AND,it looks like that the format that will stick around as a standard will be the 2k resolution.

(the Sony 4k 3D 1080i presentation was excellent, yet it's going to be a long time for that to be a standard in the market..and prob just for large screen venues...)

-Monte

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 03-16-2007 11:48 AM

4K projection is a complete waste of time unless it is being fed real 4K material, not stuff blown up from 1080 HD and 2K sources.

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Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1904
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 03-16-2007 07:36 PM

Muvico Entertainment recently announced their intent to equip their entire circuit with the Sony 4K system.

quote:

PARK RIDGE, N.J.-Mar 14, 2007

MUVICO CHOOSES SONY SXRD 4K PROJECTORS FOR CONVERSION TO DIGITAL TECHNOLOGY

Muvico Entertainment will build the world’s first theater complex with Sony’s 4K SXRD™ projectors in all its theaters. The projectors will be installed in Muvico’s new Chicago area entertainment complex, as the initial step in converting the chain’s 12 theaters (228 screens) across the United States to digital technology.

According to Muvico, the new 18-screen facility, scheduled to open this August in the suburb of Rosemont, Ill., will have all of its theaters equipped with SXRD projectors: a combination of the SRX-R210 unit, a 10,000-lumen model, and the SRX-R220 model, an 18,000-lumen unit, as well as Sony’s LMT-100 media block system.

Muvico said it also plans to follow this first installation with SXRD roll-outs in three more of its locations by 2008. The chain is now working with Sony to secure proper services for installation and maintenance of the systems.

“We carefully evaluate anything that we feel can strengthen the final presentation we make to our patrons, and the quality and performance of the SXRD technology really impressed us,” said Mike Whalen, president of Muvico. “Not only is this the highest resolution available, but this type of technology opens up so many new opportunities for displaying alternative content in our theaters such as live concerts and sporting events. It gives us a solid foundation in converting our chain to digital. We believe installing digital projectors with 4K resolution will redefine the movie going and live event experience by providing our guests with picture quality never seen before on the big screen.”

Muvico stated that the new Chicago area venue will feature the company’s “Premier Concept” where guests ages 21 years and older can enjoy an adults-only environment that consists of reserved seating, oversized “love seats,” complimentary valet parking and popcorn, and access to a full-service restaurant and bar for the ultimate entertainment experience.

“Premier guests can enjoy beer, wine or a cocktail as they view the latest blockbuster movie or live event in a truly sophisticated environment on 4K digital projection,” Whalen said. “For parents, the entertainment venue will offer an exclusive on-site children's playroom that will be supervised by teachers and assistants. This in turn will provide spontaneity to movie-going parents who want to relax and enjoy a film or live event hassle-free without a frantic—and often unsuccessful—‘last-minute’ search for an at-home babysitter.”

The playroom will feature a fun, “kid friendly” themed environment that includes such amenities as a computer zone, a reading corner, an arts and crafts space, a science area, and a play spot with assorted play activity areas.

“Muvico’s vision for the movie theater of the future is that exhibitors need to offer more complete services to enrich the theater-going experience,” said Andrew Stucker, director of Sony’s Digital Cinema Systems Group. “These projectors are a perfect fit for that vision.”

Both projector models to be installed by Muvico are designed to DCI-compliance and are Sony’s newest 4K systems designed specifically for movie theater projection.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 03-16-2007 09:45 PM

The Muvico announcement is interesting, and a positive development.

However, I think more 4K installations are going to be needed (as well as more 4K projector models from vendors other than Sony) for the much higher quality standard to gain traction.

Right now Sony seems almost by itself in promoting the 4K standard for digital intermediate and digital presentation. 4K movies like The Da Vinci Code and Spiderman II came from Sony. I don't think any other major studio is doing any serious work in 4K format.

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4021
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 03-16-2007 09:49 PM

This is good news. But I bet it's another sweetheart deal, just like AMC is said to have gotten when it was gifted with - oops - I mean, when AMC "chose" SDDS over DTS and SR•D.

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Tristan Lane
Master Film Handler

Posts: 444
From: Nampa, Idaho
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 03-17-2007 03:56 AM

What were people's impressions of the 3D NBA all-stars presentation that Sony did on Tuesday? (one day late due to them having problems with the equipment on the prior morning)

Was it shot in 4K? Was it presented in 4K? or was it just presented "using Sony SXRD technology"

EDIT: Also, I don't know how anyone could make an educated opinion on 4K by this presentation alone. The screen was very very small.

I do like the idea of alternative content being shown in 3D, but getting it to the theaters in live form will be a huge challenge. They said they broadcast the all-star game to Mandalay Bay over fiber......... Probably ran specifically for that event.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 03-17-2007 04:16 AM

quote: Tristan Lane
The screen was very very small.

... with resolutions of 4096 x 2160 pixels, one can see why the presentation was small emitting from a 1.55 diag inch chip - prob was using stock lenses without zoom options to fill a much larger screen. (cheating here from the SXRD brochere)

..yet, it was impressive, but somebody is gonna pay to help pay for this setup.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 03-17-2007 12:15 PM

Blowing any HD video source up to 4K is a waste of time. You're not going to see any more native detail in the imagery than you would when watching a normal HDTV set with native 1920 X 1080 resolution or from a 2K digital projection setup.

Sony should know better than pulling that crap as well. They have a couple 4K DI sourced movies, such as Spiderman II, that might serve as a better example of demo material. At the very least anything they're using to show off 4K projection should only be film-sourced and natively scanned/DI-ed at true 4K resolution.

This kind of crap reminds of the garbage I have to put up with in my day job where a customer will e-mail a low rez JPEG image and expect that to look good on a 14' X 48' billboard design. Just because some image is "digital" by no way means it has infinite, scalable levels of detail. It's quite the opposite and limited at that.
[Roll Eyes]

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Tristan Lane
Master Film Handler

Posts: 444
From: Nampa, Idaho
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 03-17-2007 02:22 PM

Bobby,

That was my point exactly. Which is why I asked if it was shot in 4K and presented in 4K. I highly doubt that they would be able to shoot, edit, and broadcast the 4K image in real time. Throw in the fact that the whole all-star game was also shot in 3D, It makes it even harder to believe that this was a 4K image.

Comparing this to a standard TI 2K projector, wouldn't SXRD projectors have similar limitations on what size the presentation area [on the chip] can be due to the high frame rate required by 3D presentation?

I personally didn't find the picture quality to be any better than what I see with 2K. I think the focus of the presentation was to demonstrate the 3D capabilities of alternative content, rather than the capabilities of the projector itself. The 3D quality was the same as what is presently being used.

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Lyle Romer
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1400
From: Davie, FL, USA
Registered: May 2002

posted 03-17-2007 07:48 PM

I wonder if any of the manufacturers using DLP chips will ever use a "wobulation" technique to make a 4k DLP projector. Even though it's not true progressive scan if they used a high enough "field" refresh rate like if they showed each 2k block 8 times per frame or something it should appear pretty close to a true 4k progressive scan. I suggest this because it is pretty clear that TI is not going to develop a 4k DLP chip anytime soon and using Sony for cinema products would be crazy.

Notice how Muvico's deal is for one complex with others starting in 2008. That gives them plenty of time to switch to another manufacturer if/when Sony goes away.

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Bernie Anderson Jr
Master Film Handler

Posts: 435
From: Woodbridge, New Jersey
Registered: Apr 2000

posted 03-17-2007 09:40 PM

I still think we're pissing up a flagpole with this DLP crap. The theatre business model is what needs to be changed, not the media of the projector. As it is, most people think these images are digital already, so its a moot issue. Is it totally logical to put so much money into a business where the whole point is to screw the exhibitor? And remember its the studios that are pushing this and NOT the exhibitors. We have DVD windows shrinking on every release and a major push to release day and date video and theatres releases. Bob Igar of Disney has said the windows will continue to shrink. If you add up all the grosses of the top ten films a week and divide it by an average ticket price, you have probably 6-8 million people seeing movies in theatres a week. Just because you change up stairs, its really not changing what is being projected on the screen for $10 a ticket. And that's the bottom line.

BA

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Dominic Espinosa
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1172
From: California, U.S.A.
Registered: Jan 2004

posted 03-18-2007 02:50 AM

quote: Paul Gordon
Content is important and I'd like to see films that can't afford to be printed on 35mm to show up on digital screens. D cinema from the get go was touted as being an in for the art/indpendent low budget filmmaker to get on the big screen but are any being shown in this format?

In my opinion if the film can't make it past the festival circuit and secure the financing it takes to go limited, wide, or beyond it shouldn't be "on the big screen" as they say.

Not that there aren't good small-timers, but if they were great I'd think they would be able to at least go limited...No amount of technology will make them good films.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 03-18-2007 02:19 PM

quote: Dominic Espinosa
In my opinion if the film can't make it past the festival circuit and secure the financing it takes to go limited, wide, or beyond it shouldn't be "on the big screen" as they say.

I wish some kind of standard like that was applied to all the major studio releases. There's a LOT of movies from major studios that aren't worth putting on the big screen.

Unfortunately, it's not a fair, perfect world.

There's a lot of good, independent movies that can't get wide releases due to limited marketing budgets. I've seen some indie movies get booked at theaters here in Lawton only to watch them play for one week with hardly anyone showing up to see them. People aren't familiar with the movies, or just think they might be boring or something. At the same time they'll line up in droves to watch some shitty horror movie remake/sequel.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 03-22-2007 01:58 AM

Like, when I began in this industry many moons ago - I was a projectionist in then what was called a "2nd run house" since discount theatres weren't around then.

The owner gave me a small business lesson when I mentioned to him on a sight upgrade to the equipment in the booth that I thought we could use, but more of a desired item than a needed item.

He mentioned that whatever we do to improve needs to increase his gate sales, but being such a tivial thing,then it's not worth wasting the capital money. It has to be something big to make the exspenditures worth while.

(but, eventually, he went automated, I lost my job due to the automation and the building burnt down due to a coal furnace fire a few years later...and the word buzzed around that it was a possible arson case since the owner fell into bad times...)

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