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Topic: AMC ETX Digital Review

Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 10-19-2010 10:48 PM

quote: Tom Petrov
Not sure I agree with this, I walked into another theatre that was playing "Hereafter" that was not ETX, it looked very much like standard 35mm. These theatres were fine and looked good, they also sounded good. But once inside the ETX theatre, it was something different, this is where the big events films will be played.

I paid standard price to see Titanic in 70mm DTS at the GCC Northpark #1 in Dallas. There is literally no chance at all the experience you saw at the high priced premium measured up even to half the quality I experienced at that theater. None.

Oh, and that's a "blow up" from 35mm to 70mm presentation. Native 65mm photographed stuff along the lines of Baraka, Lawrence of Arabia, etc. raises the stakes more.

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Tom Petrov
Five Guys Lover

Posts: 1121
From: El Paso, TX
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 10-19-2010 10:52 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
I paid standard price to see Titanic in 70mm DTS at the GCC Northpark #1 in Dallas. There is literally no chance at all the experience you saw at the high priced premium measured up even to half the quality I experienced at that theater. None

Please don't turn this into a 70mm vs ETX debate. I never mention 70mm once in my review.

quote:
Native 65mm photographed stuff along the lines of Baraka, Lawrence of Arabia, etc. raises the stakes more.

I read somewhere that Baraka is single greatest example of Blu-Ray 1080p. I never say it on 70mm but I would like to.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

posted 10-20-2010 01:01 AM

quote: Tom Petrov
Please don't turn this into a 70mm vs ETX debate. I never mention 70mm once in my review.

Do you actually think he was making the post as a comparison of ETX and 70mm? Because from my end, I see you stating that ETX is worth the surcharge for being better than normal 35mm and him saying that he didn't have to pay extra for something that's better than 35mm.

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Lyle Romer
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1400
From: Davie, FL, USA
Registered: May 2002

posted 10-20-2010 01:04 PM

quote:
quote: Tom Petrov
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
8.8 million pixels providing 4X the resolution of HD
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote: Carl Martin

whatever. that's only twice the resolution of hd.

No, it's 4x. HD is 1920x1080 = 2.0736 million pixels

8.8/2.0736 = 4.24

Whether the film was actually produced in 4k in post production I can't answer but the projector can display over 4 times the resolution of HDTV.

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Tony Bandiera Jr
Film God

Posts: 3067
From: Moreland Idaho
Registered: Apr 2004

posted 10-20-2010 02:14 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
Instead of delivering proper quality projection and sound for the standard ticket price the suckers, oh I mean customers, are expected to pay a premium.

Damn. In this down economy I guess it must be nice to be able to charge a luxury tax for a job done satisfactorily. I wish I could earn my standard pay for just getting out of bed and then make twice as much for showing up to work. I guess I picked the wrong freaking profession!

Thank you Bobby, I couldn't have said it better and you saved me a flaming of Tom's position on this topic. [Big Grin]

For the record, when I go to a movie I expect to see (and hear) a movie-like experience.

If I go to a rock concert, I expect to see (and hear) a rock concert experience.

I have worked concerts and live shows and I can tell you that the standards (actually there are NO standards..just "accepted practice") are as far away from cinema sound as you can get..it is all about quantity (volume) and coverage over quality. Believe it or not, most rock artists don't care about clarity of the vocals (dialog in movie-speak) as long as the instruments are loud.

If Tom gets his rocks off on a rock-concert sound while watching movies, that's his thing, but not one that most of the folks here would agree with. And if he runs a theatre to those standards, I feel sorry for his customers.

AMC has been know to try some of the most incredibly stupid things, (Torus screens, SDDS, ceiling surround speaker placement, speakers above and below the screen, etc.) and this smacks of their latest height of stupidity.

The money wasted on ONE of those ETX auditoria could be better spent upgrading the entire complex.

I seriously wonder what drugs AMC's engineering and management are using..or maybe they slipped off their meds again.

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Tom Petrov
Five Guys Lover

Posts: 1121
From: El Paso, TX
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 10-20-2010 04:36 PM

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr
Thank you Bobby, I couldn't have said it better and you saved me a flaming of Tom's position on this topic.

For the record, when I go to a movie I expect to see (and hear) a movie-like experience.

If I go to a rock concert, I expect to see (and hear) a rock concert experience.

I have worked concerts and live shows and I can tell you that the standards (actually there are NO standards..just "accepted practice") are as far away from cinema sound as you can get..it is all about quantity (volume) and coverage over quality. Believe it or not, most rock artists don't care about clarity of the vocals (dialog in movie-speak) as long as the instruments are loud.

If Tom gets his rocks off on a rock-concert sound while watching movies, that's his thing, but not one that most of the folks here would agree with. And if he runs a theatre to those standards, I feel sorry for his customers.

AMC has been know to try some of the most incredibly stupid things, (Torus screens, SDDS, ceiling surround speaker placement, speakers above and below the screen, etc.) and this smacks of their latest height of stupidity.

The money wasted on ONE of those ETX auditoria could be better spent upgrading the entire complex.

I seriously wonder what drugs AMC's engineering and management are using..or maybe they slipped off their meds again.

LMAO. If you feel the need to flame, then flame away. Don't be shy.

All I have to say is that I had an amazing time, I was skeptical on my way as I was trying to hold to see it on film, but I wanted to see the movie so bad, I said what the hell, I will see it on digital.

Originally I was going to see it on non-ETX but I got there early and I didn't feel like waiting another 1hr for the $12.75 show.

Money is no issue with me so I paid the extra bit of cash...but yeah like I said before, flame away if you need...I had an amazing time [Smile]

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4021
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 10-20-2010 06:29 PM

"If it sounds good, then it is good."

-- Joe Meek

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Carl Martin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1424
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-23-2010 04:06 AM

quote: Lyle Romer
No, it's 4x. HD is 1920x1080 = 2.0736 million pixels

8.8/2.0736 = 4.24

Whether the film was actually produced in 4k in post production I can't answer but the projector can display over 4 times the resolution of HDTV.

no, no, no, no, no! it's ~4x the pixels, but not 4x the resolution, which is a linear measure.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-23-2010 09:16 AM

quote:
-$17.80 for lg pop, lg popcorn, MandM peanuts

Holy crap! We sell the same stuff for $7.25. Man, I could be a millionaire if I would just get my head out of my ass and charge AMC prices. ('Course we don't have curved stadium seating and 11 channels of sound. Maybe I could get $15.)

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Manny Montes
Master Film Handler

Posts: 270
From: United States
Registered: Feb 2010

posted 10-23-2010 03:16 PM

RPX, ETX, XD, etc are not to say that the companies are not providing a "perfect" experience to every customer, these are "premium" experiences, they have a better sound system, dual digital projectors, better seating and a larger screen.

Every other auditorium has a good sound system, a single projector doing film done right (hopefully) or digital. You are paying extra for the premium seating, larger screen, more impressive sound system, etc. I don't get any of the arguments in this thread, they are all basically "Why doesn't every screen have that, why are they charging more for that XD, RPX, ETX, etc." Because its a premium experience, just like some theaters have "premium" seating that you pay extra for.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-23-2010 04:58 PM

You know back when Titanic came off first run we ran it for 6 months in 70mm at the Cinesphere and out grossed the highest gross of any toronto first run location and at a discount prices
Audiences still want quality not quantity and will usually go the extra to get it whether it is distance to travel or price
that said the teenbopper night out doesn't care

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Tony Bandiera Jr
Film God

Posts: 3067
From: Moreland Idaho
Registered: Apr 2004

posted 10-23-2010 08:11 PM

Manny, in an ideal world what you said would be true, but at least here in La-La Land, such is not the case. The theatres are allowed to run down, presentation quality goes out the window, staff is either incompetent or uncaring, and going to a movie is in far too many cases a bad/unsatisfying experience.

That's why I said what I did about how the money wasted on one of those "premium" auditoriums would be better spent in improving the others.

In our piss-poor economy, to me it would make far more business sense to give as good as possible experience at REGULAR or better yet discount pricing.

But management/owners rarely if ever see it in common-sense terms.

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Tom Petrov
Five Guys Lover

Posts: 1121
From: El Paso, TX
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 10-23-2010 09:58 PM

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr
going to a movie is in far too many cases a bad/unsatisfying experience.

I 100% agree with you. Usually it is the fault of the poorly caring operator who could care less.

quote: Tony Bandiera Jr
That's why I said what I did about how the money wasted on one of those "premium" auditoriums would be better spent in improving the others

Usually in a film equipped theatre that would result in finding and paying a projectionist well. Rainbow Cinemas in the GTA has the best presentation out of any "film" theatre as they use older, wiser and former Union projectionist. I think the going rate at those theatres are $17/hr for the head projectionist.

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Daniel Schulz
Master Film Handler

Posts: 387
From: Los Angeles, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2003

posted 10-25-2010 11:16 AM

Just throwing in another wrinkle: shouldn't the various standards mitigate the need for a "premium" screen? An ETX theater shouldn't be louder than any other properly calibrated theater: 7.0 on the fader = 85db of reference pink noise, full stop. A THX certified auditorium should theoretically sound identical to the dub stage where the film was mixed. SMPTE calls for 14fl of light on the screen. Etc.

I can see paying extra for premium seating, food service, or other luxuries, but shouldn't the actual film presentation be governed by best industry standards and practices?

Of course that's not how it is, because it's getting harder and harder to find Film Done Right.

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Tony Bandiera Jr
Film God

Posts: 3067
From: Moreland Idaho
Registered: Apr 2004

posted 10-25-2010 12:40 PM

quote: Daniel Schulz
Just throwing in another wrinkle: shouldn't the various standards mitigate the need for a "premium" screen? An ETX theater shouldn't be louder than any other properly calibrated theater: 7.0 on the fader = 85db of reference pink noise, full stop. A THX certified auditorium should theoretically sound identical to the dub stage where the film was mixed. SMPTE calls for 14fl of light on the screen. Etc.

Absolutely.

quote: Daniel Schulz
........ but shouldn't the actual film presentation be governed by best industry standards and practices?

Yes it should be but AMC has NEVER followed the standards from the start. They have always had this attitude of "Knowing better" which brought us such stunning innovations as ceiling mounted surrounds, Torus screens, non-standard speaker placement above and below the screen, and now "ETX" with ear-bleed sound levels and NO MASKING. (And YES, even with D-Cinema you should mask off unused screen area!)

quote: Daniel Schulz
Of course that's not how it is, because it's getting harder and harder to find Film Done Right.

And from the looks of it, even D-Cinema can't be done right by a lot of theatres.

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