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Topic: Zack and Miri pulled from Utah theatres

Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 11-01-2008 10:59 AM

I honestly didn't know that Elizabeth Banks was so smart. I also must have forgotten that the movie we're discussing is called Zack and Elizabeth Make a Porno. [Wink]

I also must have forgotten the part where I or anyone at the Megaplex theatres said anything about Ted Bundy's connection to this movie. [Confused]

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Robert E. Allen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1078
From: Checotah, Oklahoma
Registered: Jul 2002

posted 11-01-2008 03:42 PM

Why is it that whenever a theatre owner chooses to take a stand for his morals and not book a film there are those on this site who feel it necessary to insult that owner? While illicit sex, nudity and profanity may be the norm in the exhibition field and the personal lives of many in that field it is not the norm for the majority in our society and one should not allow constant exposure to it (and those who enjoy it) to color their thinking. A theatre owner has a right to play or not play anything he/she wants and that does not make him/her a sub-normal human being.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 11-01-2008 05:15 PM

I looked over the thread very carefully. Nowhere does anybody insult Larry Miller.

The part I find funny is that this chain had no problem playing Saw V but can't play a silly little romantic comedy because of the title?!

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 11-01-2008 05:20 PM

Kurt did call Larry Miller an "idiot" in his first post. I think that qualifies as an insult.

quote: Robert E. Allen
Why is it that whenever a theatre owner chooses to take a stand for his morals and not book a film there are those on this site who feel it necessary to insult that owner?

I'll agree insults go to far. And I'll also agree theater operators should be able to book the movies they want and refuse to book others they do not want to show.

However, if the theater operator wants to make public statements that he is banning a certain movie on moral grounds he is going to get hit with criticism if his moral standards are not consistent. Banning one movie for sexual content and then showing gory "survival horror" movies is not consistent at all. I call that fake, salad bar style morality.

quote: Robert E. Allen
While illicit sex, nudity and profanity may be the norm in the exhibition field and the personal lives of many in that field it is not the norm for the majority in our society and one should not allow constant exposure to it (and those who enjoy it) to color their thinking.

Projectionists are sluts?

The vast majority of American adults have had sex, seen their significant other naked during the act and probably talked dirty too. It's a pretty common thing in everyday life -especially among married people. Movies often cover that kind of subject matter since it is a part of everyday life.

On the other hand, I don't know anyone personally who has committed an act or murder. I don't know anyone who has carried out acts of aggravated assault on other people. Movies show that kind of stuff all the time.

What is more immoral? Having sex with another person? Or bashing in that other person's face -or even killing that other person? So many Americans take pleasure in watching violence and seem to think it's perfectly harmless even though violence is a lot more destructive.

Here's an example of something I found very offensive: Todd Bertuzzi breaking Steve Moore's neck during an NHL hockey game. Bertuzzi skated up behind Steve Moore, punched him in the back of the head and drove him head first onto the ice -all on live TV. Bertuzzi was suspended from the NHL a full season for that. However, he was never arrested even though he should have been locked away in prison for a few years on a felony assault and battery conviction. Todd Bertuzzi is lucky he didn't kill or permanently paralyze Steve Moore. Instead Moore simply had his NHL career brought to an abrupt end. Bertuzzi went back to playing in the NHL a year later. That's a real great message to send to young hockey fans watching the game on TV.

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Wayne Keyser
Master Film Handler

Posts: 272
From: Arlington, Virginia, USA
Registered: May 2004

posted 11-01-2008 06:44 PM

Y'all don't be so quick to pile on a theater owner who won't show a title because of moral objections. It's not all the equivalent of censorship.

True, I wouldn't like to see the "now playing" menu reduced to Disney titles, but don't many of us think at least half the releases out there at any given time are mind-numbing embarrassments that never ought to have been filmed?

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 11-01-2008 07:20 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
Todd Bertuzzi breaking Steve Moore's neck during an NHL hockey game.

(..an off-topic question here: Why does hockey HAVE to be a sport with violent moments with horrendous results where the refs do nothing about it, whereas almost all of the other sports that have violent moments, can be quickly contained by the officals? Even boxing-all forms - is a contact sport that is heavilly organized and regulated.)

Called "mixed-morals" and a "pick and choose" atmosphere.

Really ... to be fair with the members of the UTAH society and gone along with the huge movie going entertainment world down in SLC, LHM should have played "Z and M" and let it be done. It would have trashed out and faded quickly anywhos.

But someone in the organization below LHM that is in charge of this decision had to make a point and make it stick, thus being a big target to throw darts at from almost every one else in that Wasatch Valley...and this is what prob happened when DesNews got a hold of this - to throw darts as what the media loves to do.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 11-01-2008 07:42 PM

I think the theater could have gone about things differently in how it refused to book the Zach and Miri movie. A broad "no comment" policy to the press would have been a good start.

When the theater's spokesman publicly states that it's being refused on moral grounds it's very easy to discredit the man's statement with examples of double-standards where the theater fails to live up to that moral high ground.

Carmike Cinemas has a pretty simple, consistent policy. They don't book movies with NC-17 ratings. The movie could be rated NC-17 for very frank sexual content or for graphic violence. The Zach and Miri movie is R-rated, not NC-17. The MPAA is usually much more likely to hand out a NC-17 rating for a movie with lots of sexual content than it is for a movie with extreme levels of violence.

To be honest, I can't think of an R-rated movie that has been refused bookings by theaters because of violent imagery in it. A lot more movies have been refused by theaters for sexual content.

This isn't to say I'm in favor of making movie theaters show all sorts of sexually suggestive movies if they don't want to do so. I'm just saying if a theater is going to characterize itself as one that doesn't show immoral movies the theater operator needs to be consistent about it. And that means refusing a bunch of the blood-thirsty violence-charged movies as well as the ones with illicit sex. That will certainly cost the theater a good amount of money in lower attendance, but it will be living up to a more consistent standard.

quote:
Why does hockey HAVE to be a sport with violent moments with horrendous results where the refs do nothing about it, whereas almost all of the other sports that have violent moments, can be quickly contained by the officials?

The ONLY time I've ever seen a hockey game properly treated due to fighting was at an Oklahoma City Blazers NHL minor league match. A series of fights erupted after one of the opposing players accidentally took the business end of a hockey stick to his face. Deputies of the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Dept. intervened and arrested several of the players on both teams. THAT is what should happen at ANY professional sports game where fights break out. Even if it happens in the freaking World Series or Super Bowl.

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Jack Ondracek
Film God

Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002

posted 11-01-2008 10:26 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
However, if the theater operator wants to make public statements that he is banning a certain movie on moral grounds he is going to get hit with criticism if his moral standards are not consistent. Banning one movie for sexual content and then showing gory "survival horror" movies is not consistent at all. I call that fake, salad bar style morality.

I agree completely with Bobby's take on this. I make these choices every week. Usually, it's because I don't have enough screens to open them all. Sometimes, it's because my booker thinks a film will be a stinker (she's usually right). Sometimes, it's because I think a film will be a stinker (I'm usually wrong).

It would probably be inaccurate for me to say I've never declined a booking because it seemed too gross, or graphic, or stupid, or whatever. I didn't book the "Jackass" pictures. I wish I had declined "Pluto Nash".

On the other hand, I wonder if Miller might have specifically used this to get some attention. Is that smart?.

These are every-day booking decisions that don't need explanation, rationalization or a press release. Just quietly choose what you think will be best for your business, and possibly your conscience, and leave it at that.

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Kurt Zupin
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 989
From: Maricopa, Arizona
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 11-01-2008 10:34 PM

quote: Greg Anderson
I also must have forgotten the part where I or anyone at the Megaplex theatres said anything about Ted Bundy's connection to this movie.

All I'm saying is I think that Saw V. or Hostel is more detrimental to society then Zack and Miri make a Porno. Bundy has nothing to do with this movie, the point I was trying to make is that those movies are more likely to cause people to do horrible things then seeing a naked woman and a guys penis. Not you Greg.

Yes I did call him an Idiot, I called him an Idiot for saying "yeah we regret not booking Brokeback because of how big of a hit it was." They realized damn, we missed out on a cash cow there. That right there shows how there moral compass is screwed up. They only stand there ground half the time, if Zack and Miri were to make 400 mil dollars and they missed out on their cut of the pie are they going to say later how they screwed up? Probably!

Obviously LHM is a smart man, hes made millions and owns a NBA team, his team and him though have a skewed moral compass IMHO.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 11-01-2008 11:06 PM

quote: Jack Ondracek
On the other hand, I wonder if Miller might have specifically used this to get some attention. Is that smart?.

Don't think he'd stoop that low to do something like this. He's got too much going for him to degrade himself to do such a scheme, for if he did, he'd lose so much fan base and into his businesses.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007

posted 11-01-2008 11:43 PM

quote: Monte L Fullmer
Don't think he'd stoop that low to do something like this. He's got too much going for him to degrade himself to do such a scheme, for if he did, he'd lose so much fan base and into his businesses.

On the other hand, consider where his theaters are located. Utah. And I doubt I'm being stereotypical by saying that Utah has a lot of Mormons, who usually tend to be morally conservative. So while you'd say he'd lose fan base, in his area it could easily increase since a lot of people there could easily say "I dislike that kind of material and want to support businesses that stand against it."

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Sam Graham
AKA: "The Evil Sam Graham". Wackiness ensues.

Posts: 1431
From: Waukee, IA
Registered: Dec 2004

posted 11-01-2008 11:48 PM

Miller was not using anything to get attention. Neither Megaplex Theatres nor Larry Miller started this story...The Weinstein Company did.

They saw an opportunity to get some cheap publicity out of creating a controversy. They were capitalizing on the mistakes Megaplex made in backing out of their original booking of Brokeback Mountain. Cal Gunderson was just dumb enough to comment when asked by the Post. The Post then wrote the story in a way that made it look like Megaplex had approached them. The story itself is a completely ridiculous piece of garbage.

Move on...nothing to see here...

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 11-01-2008 11:48 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
Kurt did call Larry Miller an "idiot" in his first post. I think that qualifies as an insult.

You're right. I thought the first post was just the story. My bad.

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James Westbrook
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1133
From: Lubbock, Texas, Usa
Registered: Mar 2006

posted 11-02-2008 01:14 AM

Back to the "Salad Bar Morality" thing...
I forget which Saw it was I observed this scene in...the 3rd one? I recall a woman was naked in a frozen locker-kind-of-room and was getting sprayed with water...
Did this particular chain book this particular Saw movie when it came out?
Did they book Hostel 2 with the nude girl upside down?
I have a hunch they did. My chain booked these, too...

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Mike Schindler
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1039
From: Oak Park, IL, USA
Registered: Jun 2002

posted 11-02-2008 01:18 PM

Does anyone else find it weird that people are freaking out about a movie with the word "porno" in the title, but have absolutely no problem with titles like RIGHTEOUS KILL and PUNISHER: WAR ZONE?

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