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Author Topic: Reclining seats (redux) Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 10-03-2019 06:18 PM                     quote: Gordon McLeod Also in several locations there has been noise about wanting the firealarm to bring all seats to the upright position There have been at least two separate incidents where the automatic uprighting feature of such chairs have resulted in actual deaths, where people became stuck under the seat, while trying to get their wallet, mobile phone or other stuff from underneath. Also, if the power goes out, those things will most likely just keep in their reclined position anyway, since they're almost all directly electrically driven. Stuff like (emergency) exit lightning is required to have batteries that last a minimum number of minutes/hours. You don't want to fit those recliners with batteries too.  |  IP: Logged Martin Brooks Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 900 From: Forest Hills, NY, USA Registered: May 2002 posted 10-04-2019 10:57 PM                        One of the problems with recliner seating is the massive reduction in seat count. If a theater is not selling out anyway, I suppose it doesn't make much difference, but if you're turning people away on weekends, then the theater is leaving money on the table. It's incredible to me that thousand seat theaters would probably be 60-70% filled on a Friday and Saturday night and now we have a lot of 75 seat theaters. The other problem with recliner seats is that in many instances, a small theater can wind up with only 2-3 ideal seating positions. I don't bother with those theaters anymore. There's a local independent theater in my neighborhood that was pretty good before they renovated for digital (they did so very late in the game). They put in lounge seating and reconfigured the place and ruined it. They don't get my business anymore. In NYC, the Regal E-Walk once had 3276 seats over 13 screens. It now has just 1344. The AMC 84th Street 6 once had 2980, but later reduced to 2385. With reclining seats, it now has just 883. In Queens, NY, the AMC Fresh Meadows 7 was originally a single-screen house with 2184 seats. It was multiplexed into 1950 seats. With lounge seating, it has just 636 across 7 screens. Lounge seating reminds me of WALL-E. We can't go 2 1/2 hours without eating crap and we can't go 2 1/2 hours without lying down. And lately, I've found a lot of them to be broken anyway. A comfortable seat is a good idea. But I really don't see why we have to lie down. Especially when it sacrifices the ability to get a good seat at a movie theater. I really don't see how theaters can survive for very long with so few seats. I know that AMC has claimed that revenues increased at lounge seat theaters, but I don't see how being forced to turn people away helps revenues.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 10-07-2019 10:13 AM                        I know that AMC has claimed that revenues increased at lounge seat theaters Martin, top executives who make the decisions that turn out to be major, costly mistakes usually pick and choose stats that don't make it look like those multimillion dollar decision were a massive FAIL. And as we all know, anyone can spin stats to show anything they want wants. Has management who made the decision to replace solid, proven seats that have known reliability, relatively few moving parts and a given cost factor over time, have they actually figured in the need for the additional maintenance that these recliners will incur? The cost of stocking replacement parts? I'll bet not. And then there's the main reason that I won't go near them and it's not because I am afraid it will crush my head...I have a firm rule that I don't stick my head into anything that has moving parts and a powerful motor. It's because of humanity. Oh, I like people alright, just not the lipid fats and hair grease and...dare I say it?...LICE...that they can leave behind, especially when they are laying down. Bet the additional cost of CLEANING hasn't been figured in for these recliners -- have they Mr. Exhibitor?! Additional cleaning and disinfecting staff? I think not. And while another problem that I just thought of may not be any more prevalent than with ordinary seats, intuitively I feel it actually might be, so I'll just throw it out there because, no question, it's a terror and it only has to occur once to hit a theatre's business like an H-bomb; just ask the management of Regal E-Walk in Manhattan. Let me whisper the word: bedbugs. No more need be said.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-07-2019 10:48 PM                        Well our existing seats have cloth covers, and all the recliner "samples" I saw at the convention had leather (or faux-leather) upholstery, so that will mostly take care of the lice/bedbug/sanitation issues. You can wipe down a leather chair with a disinfectant cloth, but with cloth upholstery you're kinda stuck with what's in there between deep cleans. I'm not sure about the maintenance thing. Our current Greystone seats are nice and durable, but they are impossible to disassemble without using a blowtorch (as far as I can tell, anyway) so they're starting to get a little shopworn here and there, and thus, my pondering on what direction we'll go with our next batch of seats. But yeah, anything with motors and moving parts is going to need maintenance. Anybody who puts them in without taking that into consideration would be nuts. quote: Martin Brooks I know that AMC has claimed that revenues increased at lounge seat theaters, but I don't see how being forced to turn people away helps revenues. I talked to several owners at the convention (individual guys, not AMC-ers) who said their business is up substantially since they put in recliners, even though they reduced their seat count. The rationalization (as I noted in my post at the top of the thread) is to focus on the average usage, rather than the sellout count. If you're selling out 200 seats every weekend, fine...keep 200 seats. But if you only sell out a few times a year and on a typical night you have 30 to 50 people, then you're probably just as well off with 70 more-comfortable seats and adding a few more shows when you're expecting big crowds. The theory being that people will come out more often if they have a more enjoyable experience.  |  IP: Logged Mike Spaeth Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1129 From: Marietta, GA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 10-07-2019 11:21 PM                        The AMC you mentioned in Fresh Meadows has DOUBLED their gross revenue since cutting their seat count to a third. Certainly that makes up for a couple of extra ushers to maintain the place. Recliners are the new stadium seating. They will be expected by the customers, so either get on the bus now and get increased revenue or be forced to do it. Or, you could be like General Cinema did with stadium seating, dismiss it as a "fad" and watch your business fade away if you are in a competitive market. For a situation like Mike's it's probably not that important, but if he's planning to replace his seats, why not spend 3x per seat and buy 1/3 of them. Same bottom line (yes, there are electrical costs involved in addition), but why not give your customers a better experience if you can?  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 10-08-2019 05:34 AM                     What I'm wondering is, if it's really the reclining feature that attracts people, or is it just the more comfortable seating, even in upright position. I certainly have based my choices on seating comfort in the past, especially when folding seats were still the norm and legroom was often less than your average low-cost airline. I've personally never seen the need for recliners though.  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 10-08-2019 11:59 AM                     At first glance one would think overall ticket sales numbers would plummet big time with recliners eating a big chunk of a theater's seat count. But, I have seen theaters play games with their movie scheduling across various screens in the complex to maximize ticket sales. Case in point: back when my girlfriend and I watched the first Kingsmen movie at Harkins Bricktown 16 in downtown Oklahoma City we intended to watch it in the big Atmos-equipped Cine Capri house. We bought tickets for that screen and paid a modest $1 premium per ticket. Well, fucking Fifty Shades of Gray was also playing that weekend. Due to all the unjustified hype for that tame, lame, wannabe soft-core POS movie it got pushed onto the Cine Capri screen at the last minute. The movie already was playing on 2 or 3 other screens, but theater management decided it needed to go in the big house too. We ended up watching Kingsmen in a smaller non-Atmos house, with a smaller screen, vertically masked picture and audio with dynamics along the lines of quiet TV speakers volume. The theater gave us a pair of comp passes, but I was still pretty pissed about the situation. With everything being digital, it's not difficult to "move a print" to a different screen or have it playing on as many screens as one desires in the complex. Theaters can double or triple up movies past their prime onto a single screen without too much trouble in order to free up showtimes for a movie with higher than expected demand. The downside is customers have to be careful about making plans to see a movie that's already been out for a month. They may arrive at the theater to find the show has been scrubbed to make room for other shows that are selling better. Sidebar: this is also why "analog" changeable copy signs with flat or slotted letters don't work so well for modern movie theater marquees or street signs anymore. There's just not enough flexibility. It too much of a pain to re-arrange show titles and/or times at the last minute. If the complex has a lot of screens the sign would have to be enormous to show all the necessary details. Electronic variable message signs are far more effective. Highly restrictive sign ordinances in many locations are greatly limiting what movie theaters can install on a building or out near the highway.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 10-09-2019 02:02 AM                     quote: Bobby Henderson At first glance one would think overall ticket sales numbers would plummet big time with recliners eating a big chunk of a theater's seat count. But, I have seen theaters play games with their movie scheduling across various screens in the complex to maximize ticket sales. You've seen those dynamics yourself. The idea is to boost your average ticket sales. If a show actually sells out, they simply sacrifice another, smaller show and start filling that up. Slowly, the low-cost airline dynamics start to creep into the industry.  |  IP: Logged

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