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Topic: Which is the best/worst projector?

Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 07-14-2000 05:18 PM

I was at the Chinese in February and the "twins" were gone at that time. The main theatre was using a pair of AA-IIs (though the show was being run on a platter that day).

Personally, I think that the Chinese is grossly over-rated. I love the decor, but better picture quality is available down the street at the Egyptian and better sound quality is available not too far away at the Dome.

I have not been to the El Capitan; I'm told that it's great, but it was closed for reasons unknown when I was in LA.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 07-14-2000 06:01 PM

Scott we all know that the best sound in LA area is at the Plitt Century Plaza theatre

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David Kilderry
Master Film Handler

Posts: 355
From: Melbourne Australia
Registered: Sep 1999

posted 07-15-2000 11:56 PM

OK, top of the projector pile is Kinoton FP30 and FP50. FP20 honorable mention. Steady picture, reliable easy to work on. Oil leaks on FP50's are a little disconcerting though, about 30% of ours out of the box are leaking - a little only but its like the old FP20 probs.

The Kinoton Platter is without doubt the best in the 10 brands I have used, rock solid, reliable and they got an Oscar for it! No other plate comes close.

DP70 is up there (best on 70mm) and I like Bauer U3 (best on 35mm).

I cannot think of a projector I have completely disliked, although I would not jump to a Kallee 21 again, I hated having to stop for a ratio change!

Christie are a clever machine, but have the most abrasive gate area known to man and the reliabilty is a shocker. One 20-plex, 12 months, 5 dead ultramittants - fact! Easy to change, they need to be!!!

David

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David Emery
Film Handler

Posts: 25
From: WI
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-16-2000 12:06 PM

Have any of you tryed the M35GP by Christie? We have 10 of them and on all 10 of them, I have never seen a shaky picture on any of them. I do agree about the lenses though even though the M35GP uses a slightly diffrent changeover to move the lenses than the P35GP. It still is easy to knock those lenses out of alignment but the only thing is all you have to do is switch formats and switch back and the problem is fixed. As far as the SLC console ours dont vibrate all that much. It may be bacause all of this equipment is stitting on a 6 inch thick concrete floor. I do agree though there is a lot of maintanence with these projectors no matter what.

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 07-16-2000 12:58 PM

Kinoton platters are fine - a lot more film friendly than Cinemecannicas or Christies - until they go wrong.

The main difference is that the Kinotons have a complex system of relays and transformers for determining the speed of the feed platter. A horizontal tension arm determines the speed of the take-up plate, and the feed plate starts at this speed. There are two microswitches for 'slow down' and 'speed up' in the centre feed unit, and so when the arm hits on or the other the speed of the plate gradually adjusts. This is instead of the variable resistor found in most other platters.

As I say, when it works it's fine, and one thing I will say for Kinotons is that they feed a lot more smoothly at slower speeds (e.g. during the last reel of TITANIC). But if one of these relays, gears or inverters goes wrong, it's hell to fix compared to simply changing a resistor. The service manual is inaccurate, inconsistently labelled and written in bad German. And the price of spares for Kinoton/Philips stuff defies belief. I once had to pay £246 (well over US$300) for an intermittent shaft for an FP-20. That's right - £246 for a bit of aluminium about the size of a pencil.

Favourite projectors - Philips/Kinoton DP-70 (the only 35/70mm convertible I know which gives a rock-steady picture in both gauges), Gaumont-Kalee GK-37. Worst - Cinemecannica Victoria 5 (the rubber band machine), Westar 7000.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 07-16-2000 03:11 PM

I really want to try out the Kinoton and Big Sky platters. Big Sky claims to be unwrappable. I sure would like to put that to the test. The cool thing about the Big Sky appears to be the programmable EPROM. They must take lessons from Pennywise.

I am wondering why I am not seeing more Kinoton projector installations here in the US. From what I have heard second hand, they are cheaper than the Christie P35GPS. Since cheaper is always better in the eyes of the corporate people, you'd think the big chains would gobble them up! Does anyone have a good comparison chart for the average prices on various projectors?

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Paul Linfesty
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1383
From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 07-17-2000 09:37 AM

The Chinese II and III were closed in November 1998 to make room for the new retail-entertainment complex next door (which includes a subway stop and the new Kodak Academy Theatre. Last I heard, it will now include 4 movie screens (per the sign on the construction site).

I would have to disagree that this theatre is highly overrated. I've seen many excellent projected images at this theatre. The only bad experience I've had lately was for Bringing out the dead last October(dim, out of focus), but The Perfect Storm looked great.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-17-2000 11:14 AM

I saw a superb presentation of a 70mm DTS print of "Titanic" at the Mann Chinese on Hollywood Boulevard on January 15, 1998. Meredith Rhule was the operator that day. I wrote about it:
http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/newsletters/reel/december98/pppp.shtml

A month later, the experience was equaled in Dallas at the GCC North Park with Ron Beardmore as the projectionist.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com

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John Gordon
Film Handler

Posts: 62
From: Earth
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 07-17-2000 11:48 AM

Being the Chinese Theatre has come in this thread, it should be noted that it is a theatre that should be visited if you have never been there. It's big, grand, and has the old feel of a reel movie theatre. But if you want a better presentation, go to the Mann's Village in Westwood. Far superior picture and sound.
The problem with the Chinese is accoustics--dialogue has difficulty in accurate reproduction. Scope pictures are fine, but 1.85 gets swallowed up by the sheer size of the auditorium.
And as Gordon menitoned, the Odean (the old Plitt) theatre in Century, aud. #1, is one of the best. But not the best in L.A.

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Paul Linfesty
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1383
From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 07-17-2000 12:08 PM

Well, I THINK that Gordon wasn't being serious about the Plitt, since he used the smiley face. He was probably refering to the auditorium #2, which has the "extroadinary" HPS-4000 system (but only if John Allen's EQ cards are in place...whenever that is). The slightly larger house #1, however, does feature one of the best THX-certified houses in L.A., although the projection on most screenings are below the standard (this may have changed in recent years, I don't know).

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Scott Morrison
Film Handler

Posts: 9
From: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Registered: Sep 1999

posted 07-17-2000 05:26 PM

Yes the Chinese has the feel of a grand old movie palace (not to mention the smell!)

Accoustics are better at the Village, Picture is better too, but smaller.
Loews Cineplex Century Plaza (aka Cineplex Odeon, aka the Plitt) Has great sound, but is weak on subwoofer, add a few sub cabinets (as I did for a press screening of "Enemy of the State") and It sounds great. Tony Scott (the director) told me so himself.
Whomever said the accoustics were good at the Cinerama Dome was joking, right?
When Disney premiered 'Evita' there they went to the trouble of putting in a flat screen and a drop ceiling to make it look and sound like a real theater, and not an accoustics experiment.

Speaking of Norelco AAIIs The Egyptian in Hollywood has a pair of the cleanest nicest you will ever see. They were removed from a theater in New Orleans, I believe, and completely refurbished (down to the bare casing) by Boston Light and Sound. They literally look brand new. The booth also has a Kinoton FP38 35/16mm electronic movement projector.

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John Gordon
Film Handler

Posts: 62
From: Earth
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 07-17-2000 06:47 PM

Scott,
You forgot to mention the Video projector (NO, not video, aaahhhhh!) in the booth. Yes it is there, but it is very well hidden, or I should say it blends well into the ceiling. I did not notice it the first time. Not until it was pointed out to me.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 07-18-2000 09:46 AM

You had to add subs to the century plitt HPS system Wow we thought that reference system only sounded good with its designers touch and no one else could tune it properly
congrats that a director liked you work better

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Scott Morrison
Film Handler

Posts: 9
From: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Registered: Sep 1999

posted 07-19-2000 01:16 PM

No, I didn't forget, just left it out on purpose. Its a JVC Hughes 3XX series.
It was state of the art, pre DLP. They are a huge pain in the butt to set up, and aren't very stable after you do get them tweaked.
Accoustically the Egyptian has movable accoustic panels that slide out along the walls to cut the reverberation to an acceptable level. I love the sound in that house; When Nick Cage starts that Shelby in 'Gone in 60 seconds' the subwoofer vibrated my pant legs, Very cool. It was the best 5seconds of that movie.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 07-19-2000 01:31 PM

Is Paul Rayton still the chief operator at the American Cinemateque Egyptian on Hollywood Boulevard? Now, there was a true supporter of the 70 mm film format! I first met Paul during a screening of the 70 mm restoration of "Vertigo" at the GCC Galaxy in Hollywood.

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