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Topic: cp50 prob/questions
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Ray Derrick
Master Film Handler

Posts: 310
From: Sydney, Australia
Registered: Sep 2001
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posted 02-14-2002 05:11 AM
Mark said: "(B+ is) a terminal with available electrons.."Gee whiz Mark, I could jump on this nit picking bandwagon and say "no it's not, B- is a terminal with available electrons, B+ is a terminal with a depletion of electrons". But no, I wouldn't be another nit picker and say that!  ------------------ Ray Derrick President/Chief Engineer Panalogic Corporation Sydney, Australia Phone: 61 (0)2 9894 6655 Fax: 61 (0)2 9894 6935
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Ray Derrick
Master Film Handler

Posts: 310
From: Sydney, Australia
Registered: Sep 2001
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posted 02-15-2002 05:45 AM
Sorry Mark, I guess "nit picking" is probably one of those purely Australian expressions. I think it derives from the habit of monkeys etc to pick the nits (small insects) from each other's fur. We regard a person who finds fault over the smallest, most insignificant things as a "nit picker". B+ is fine with me, I know what you are talking about.Also I don't FULLY subscribe to the "it must be played the way the director intended" line... I am getting really sick of hearing that from people who have never been involved on the creative side of sound (or vision) production. The truth is half the directors in Hollywood wouldn't know good sound if it stood up and slapped them in the face! Just ask some of the audio fraternity. So often it is the sound team who create great soundtracks and the director just gives the nod and takes the credit for it (or just says "make it louder"!!). If you can make a mediocre mono soundtrack sound better, then why the hell not? Most sound professionals that I know would be grateful for the assistance. Also with reference to Steve G's comparison about the practice of playing Dolby B encoded cassette tapes back with the NR switched off because it "sounds better".. the problem here was that high speed duplication (which is used for all general release pre-recorded cassettes) completely screws the Dolby B process because it results in lower high frequency levels than the master. So people HAD to turn the NR off to get decent highs. Also because of the considerable variation in record and reproduce levels from one cassette player to another, the only time Dolby B is guaranteed to work correctly is when a cassette is recorded and played back on the same properly aligned deck. ------------------ Ray Derrick President/Chief Engineer Panalogic Corporation Sydney, Australia Phone: 61 (0)2 9894 6655 Fax: 61 (0)2 9894 6935
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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999
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posted 02-15-2002 01:20 PM
DAMN you guys are good! I think I am going to give it a shot -- adding the switch on the rear to disable the Academy filter. Dolby modified our unit -- upgraded caps and put in the cat 113 automation which as Mark points out, has limited the flexibility by only offering preset versions of the formats -- no ablity to choose NR on or off, for example. Steve G, you are right about consumers and Dolby B -- I started out as a audio recording engineer and no matter how much I explained that using the NR to boost high end was counter productive, no one paid any attention. The same with Dolby SVA tracks in the early days when they originally double inventoried Dolby and non-Dolby prints, Dolby quietly backed away from the double inventory concept (bad marketing fly in the Dolby ointment) and seemed to imply that Dolby prints with A type noise reduction were "compatible." Seemed to me, if you have type A noise reduction, there is no way you can play that back without decoding it, unless you like the sound of swooshing high end what sounds like someone constantly turning a treble control up and down. In the recording studio any engineer worth his salt would laugh if anyone suggested a tape recorded with Dolby A was compatable with decks not equipped with an A decoder. How Dolby got away with suggesting that it was possible to play Dolby A prints without decoding was a mystery to me. So I wholeheartedly agree with the negative effects of switching out NR when it should be there, but I disagree with the parallel made to the Academy curve. The steep Academy attenuation was not designed as a compensation for a mirror boost in the optical recorder, but simply as a poor attempt to compensate for the noisy optical tracks of the 30's and 40's. As soundtracks got a lot cleaner and the recording technology improved, the need to roll off the high end as a way to attenuate hiss became unnecessary. I just don't see the need for it with the very well recorded films of the 60's and 70's. I am going to follow all the good advice here and knock the thing right out of the processor -- switchable, of course.
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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000
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posted 02-15-2002 06:37 PM
Mark: The rent wasn't quite that bad but it was substantial and elscalated every year plus the share of expenses went up as well. Three screening rooms was too much which is why #3 later became a large editing suite. Glad I was not a principal of that business.Frank Angel opined: >How Dolby got away with suggesting that it was possible to play >Dolby A prints without decoding was a mystery to me. The Dolby A system works akin to a set of compandors working independently in 4 frequency bands. Encoding with no decoding ought to just have the effect of bringing up the low level sounds. That shouldn't be too deleterious to the sound. With the presumption that the non-Dolby theatres might have poorer listening conditions (background noise, bleed through, etc.) it hypothetically could even help. Of course that's just the theory and we all know how well some theories work out.
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