|
|
This topic comprises 5 pages: 1 2 3 4 5
|
|
Author
|
Topic: Letterbox variations
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Frank Angel
Film God
Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999
|
posted 07-02-2006 01:54 AM
Two years ago at the 3D World Expo, an actress who starred in one of the 3D films that was run gave a Q&A after one of the screenings and she stated with much conviction that working in a 3D movie was very difficult because of the 3D, everything had to be shot twice. Jeff Joseph couldn't let that stand and very diplomatically corrected her misinformation.
So sometimes even the people who were involved in a production can have foggy memories. I went to an SMPTE screening of WOODSTOCK and Michael Wadleigh spoke and handed out a full 10 pages of narative that he wrote to explain how they shot the festival and how it was edited and blown up to 35mm. No place was there any mention of 70mm. A misrecollection here and there is understandable, after all, in the case of WOODSTOCK we are talking 30+ years ago. Hell, in my post I said the when the film went to scope in the second reel, the sound went to full stereo with Crosby Stills and Nash belting out the title song, which of course is totally wrong -- it was "A Long Time Coming," not "Woodstock" that played when it went to the full scope.
And having time to think about it, I am pretty sure I was mistaken about when it went to scope. I don't think it was at the reel change; it was more like just a few minutes into the first reel.
Many times memory is a liar.
[ 07-02-2006, 04:16 AM: Message edited by: Frank Angel ]
| IP: Logged
|
|
Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1904
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001
|
posted 07-03-2006 02:40 AM
I agree with the "memory is a liar" thing. I've stressed the unreliability of memory since I started posting here a few years ago. Memory simply should not be used to reconstruct the past. It can, however, be used effectively as a starting point in investigating a subject, but should never be the lone "source" used.
And speaking of bad memory, here are those "Woodstock" quotes I promised. These are from the April 1999 issue of Kodak's incamera magazine.
quote:
The filmmakers decided on 16mm blown up to 70mm.
quote:
A custom-built Technicolor lens would provide single-generation, liquid gate blowups, with opticals done simultaneously. The lens was simply aimed at various parts of the 65mm frame to produce the trademark multiple images.
quote:
The 70mm projection prints afforded six channel stereo sound, as opposed to the more common optical soundtracks that limited previous concert films. The result was a stunning theatical experience that had people dancing in the aisles at theaters across the country.
quote:
"We knew we wanted the six track sound from the beginning," says Wadleigh. "That was a huge advantage. You could just blow people out of the theater."
quote:
"During the day I had an 85 filter on most of the time," [DP Chuck] Levey continues. "That left me with an ASA of 16. We were often pushing the film a stop already [at night] and, remember, this was destined for blowup to 70mm. But it was a pretty fine grain film, and even though it was blown up, with the multiple images on screen, one image is rarely filling the whole frame."
quote:
Wadleigh agrees. "Without question, without Kodak, there wouldn't be a Woodstock movie," he says. "That ECO stock was the beginning, middle and end of it. If we hadn't had that image on that material, we could never have done the 70mm blowup."
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
Carl Martin
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1424
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002
|
posted 07-08-2006 06:39 AM
michael,
i think we all respect your dedication to accuracy and journalistic integrity in a world where those are rare virtues, but the way it's coming across lately is pretty abrasive. in the above comment, it looks like you're the one who has nasty intentions, though at heart i'm sure you don't.
people will have faulty memories, and that's just another thing for you to take into account when you tally up your facts. it's good to correct mistakes, but don't browbeat.
and not everyone reads or retains every scrap of information you make available. you can lead a horse to water....
maybe you're having a bad week and it's coming through in your postings? try reading over your recent posts; a lot of them come off as attacks, against a number of different people. there's a frustrated, world-weary vibe about them. maybe there are legit reasons for that, but it's not good to take it out on everyone. hey, effective communication is a bitch. i'm not the best at it myself.
ok, i'm not a moderator or analyst or anything, just trying to be helpful.
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1904
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001
|
posted 07-25-2006 09:04 PM
quote: Carl Martin
michael,
i think we all respect your dedication to accuracy and journalistic integrity in a world where those are rare virtues, but the way it's coming across lately is pretty abrasive. in the above comment, it looks like you're the one who has nasty intentions, though at heart i'm sure you don't.
people will have faulty memories, and that's just another thing for you to take into account when you tally up your facts. it's good to correct mistakes, but don't browbeat.
and not everyone reads or retains every scrap of information you make available. you can lead a horse to water....
maybe you're having a bad week and it's coming through in your postings? try reading over your recent posts; a lot of them come off as attacks, against a number of different people. there's a frustrated, world-weary vibe about them. maybe there are legit reasons for that, but it's not good to take it out on everyone. hey, effective communication is a bitch. i'm not the best at it myself.
ok, i'm not a moderator or analyst or anything, just trying to be helpful.
With the exception of a couple of recent postings, I've been on a self-imposed two-week vacation from film-tech in an attempt to calm down. Did you miss me. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Carl...thank you for your concerns and effort to help me identify the tone and probable interpretation by others of my recent postings. Upon reflection I agree with most of what you identified. I do, however, think you're letting others off the hook way too easily. After all, none of us are posting in a vacuum. But I'm just going to have to bite the bullet and let it go. Since I am a fan of effective communication, as challenging as it may be to pull off, I'll take this opportunity to apologize for lashing out at everyone.
| IP: Logged
|
|
Martin Brooks
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 900
From: Forest Hills, NY, USA
Registered: May 2002
|
posted 07-29-2006 08:30 PM
quote: Michael Coate
Some sources suggest there were 70mm six-track prints too. I've never been able to confirm, though. I've never seen a 70mm print of "Woodstock"... never handled a 70mm print... never read about a 70 at a retrospective fest... never seen any newspaper ads promoting a 70mm showing... but have heard endless hearsay and memories from folks.
I'm one of those "memories." Michael and I have had some off-line discussion about this, but in this particular case, even though my memory does sometimes prove faulty, I'm going to stick by my memory.
I saw Woodstock in 70mm at the Trans-Lux West on Broadway and 49th St. It was a special engagement because the Trans-Lux West was normally a newsreel theatre. I remember that I specifically chose the Trans-Lux West because it was the only Manhattan theatre playing in 70mm 6-track discrete. If it had been playing anywhere else, I would have gone to the other theatre because I would not have expected the Trans-Lux to be well equipped. (Michael says he can find absolutely no proof that it played there.)
It was also playing at the Trans-Lux East, but in 4-track.
One of the things I remember about this showing is that all of the announcements from Chip Monck and Wavy Gravy came through the surrounds. And for this engagement, the surrounds weren't tiny speakers mounted on the walls -- they were large Altecs sitting in the outer aisles.
[My recollection is clear enough that I even remember the girl I took to this show. I remember that she wore a very conservative pink dress that I thought was really un-hip, especially to go see Woodstock and while I tried to play it cool, she could tell that something was wrong and was very pissed with me.]
I saw the film again some years ago (it might have been the director's cut version, probably released concurrently with the 1st DVD version or maybe a VHS release) at the Museum of the Moving Image in Queens, but it must have been remixed because I remember the sound being disappointing. I believe that this was also in 70mm (although I wouldn't stake my life on it), because I don't think I would have bothered had it not been in 70mm.
I've promised Michael that when I have some time (probably not until I retire), I'm going to find proof of this and some other 70mm presentations that we disagree about. I've already done some research in the NY Times microfilm and haven't found much. I think the ads that would have driven me to see this (and other) 70mm films (with notation of the sound format) must have been in the Village Voice. I've got to find a library that has the Village Voice on microfilm.
I don't remember the beginning of the film being in mono, as Frank does, but it's possible. What I do remember is that the beginning of the film had a lot of songs from performers at Woodstock, but the original recorded versions, not the live versions recorded at the event. I do remember A Long Time Coming being in stereo.
I also remember the film width expanding in the first big shot of the audience. Because the film was shot in 16mm, the 70mm frame was often used to capture multiple shots concurrently.
If someone can prove that the film never played at the Trans-Lux West, I will check into a hospital!!
| IP: Logged
|
|
Frank Angel
Film God
Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999
|
posted 07-30-2006 07:01 AM
Martin, there was a Trans-Lux Travelog theatre at 49th & Broadway? I was only aware of the one in Grand Central Station only because I would take the train on the way to school and when I just couldn't stand the thought of going to class, I would get off the subway at Grand Central and slip in there to kill time. It was almost as painful as going to class -- they played some pretty gawdawful stuff. Even as a kid I couldn't fingure out how a theatre could stay opened only playing schlock travelogs much less get audiences to actually pay money to see this horrific stuff. I am stunned that they had TWO travelog theatres operating in the same town!
The Trans-Lux at Grand Central only had an Academy ratio screen. In fact, they might only have been playing 16mm. I don't think they could have played a scope picture even if they wanted to. At some point the company morphed into a company that makes LED display signs for outdoor marquees and stadiums and such; they still call themselves Trans-Lux, but they are not in the theatre business, at least not that I know of.
Well, I just did a search and seems they were very active in the movie business. They have a very informative history on their website.
Clicky
" History
The paths that Trans-Lux followed since the early 1920s laid the foundation for the company we are today. Following is a brief summary of the journey we’ve taken to get here.
History of Innovation
With the development of rear-projection technology in the early 1920s, Trans-Lux Daylight Picture Screen Corporation, the fledgling company that later became Trans-Lux Corporation, was founded by Percy Norman Furber. In the early years, rear projection technology was used in a lecture series as a visual aid that eliminated dimming of overhead lights. In 1923, this technology was installed at the New York Stock Exchange as a ticker tape projection system that changed the complexion of stock trading forever.
Movies and Television
Advancements in rear projection technology led Trans-Lux Daylight Picture Screen Corporation to development of a total screen, projector and lens system, which made its debut at New York City’s Roxy Theater in 1927. Trans-Lux Movies Corporation was born with the introduction of the company’s first newsreel theater in the 1930s. By 1950 Trans-Lux had expanded its “art” theatre operations to 14 locations and by 1955, Trans-Lux began distribution of European films, including a hard-won battle to run A Stranger Knocks to American audiences, paving the way for running of controversial films the likes of Deep Throat .
In 1956 Trans-Lux formed a television subsidiary to syndicate the Encyclopedia Britannica Films library to bring educational films to children. Expansion in children's programming is evidenced by successful syndicated cartoons including Felix the Cat, Gigantor and Speed Racer .
In keeping with its expansion plans, Trans-Lux followed the suburban theater trend and built its first shopping center theater in 1964. Changes in theater economics led the “twinning” of theater auditoriums to reduce operating costs and later area localization to screens in the Northeast brought Trans-Lux through the slump of the 1970s.
In September 1973 Trans-Lux debuted the longest running multimedia program in history, “The New York Experience .” This major tourist attraction ran for more than 16 years in Manhattan's Rockefeller Center before closing in 1989.
Trans-Lux sold its northeast-based movie theatre chain to Paramount in 1986, and in 1988 began rebuilding its theater chain in select markets in the western Mountain States.
Electronic Displays
In 1940 Trans-Lux launched another venture, purchasing a patent for a remote-control signaling system used in the famous Boston “Pill” sign, the first of the so-called “spectacular “ traveling message signs that would light up Broadway with messages circling the tops of the tallest buildings. By 1948 Trans-Lux News Sign Corporation was supplying electrical traveling signs to advertisers, publishers and radio stations throughout the U.S. In 1959, the Electronics Division was formed.
The tremendous boom in stock market activity in the early 1960s hastened the need for a ticker with a higher transmission speed. The industry’s first real-time stock ticker was introduced in 1965 as the Trans-Lux Jet, named for the jets of air that controlled character formation, becoming an industry staple.
The early 1970s brought an unexpected slump to the stock market and left Trans-Lux with many unrented Jets in storage. Diversification was the answer and Trans-Lux began seeking new customers in the commodities field, where a modified version of the Trans-Lux Personal Ticker (a selective tape read-out device) replaced the Western Union ticker network at the Chicago Board of Trade. The 1974 introduction of the TLT Telex Teleprinter represented a complete breakthrough for the company into the general data communications field and the TLT is awarded a place in the Smithsonian Institution.
In 1981, Trans-Lux temporarily installed an experimental prototype of an LED stock market display on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange. The first entirely solid state, microprocessor wall ticker display, the LED Jet ® , was installed at the New York Stock exchange in 1982. The introduction of DataWall ® in 1984 allowed Trans-Lux to provide a new type of service and expand into new market areas.
Expansion through acquisition began in 1985 with the purchase of SignLine (Cedar Rapids, IA), a firm that was a pioneer in designing and manufacturing LED signage for gaming venues, airports and other public gathering places. In 1986 Trans-Lux installed the mammoth “race book” at Circus Circus casino in Las Vegas, the first major display installation outside of the brokerage market.
Expansion into the outdoor market occurred in 1990 with the purchase of AS&I’s (American Sign & Indicator) contract portfolio of installed, leased signage. In 1993 Trans-Lux purchased a portfolio of service and maintenance contracts for installed, customer owned signage from Winkomatic, the successor of AS&I.
In 1995, Trans-Lux acquired Integrated Systems Engineering, Inc. (ISE, Logan, UT) to round out the Trans-Lux product line to include high quality, cost-effective outdoor LED display systems for the custom commercial and sports markets. In 1997, Fairtron/Fair-Play of Des Moines, IA joined our corporate family and expanded our product line to include catalog scoreboards. In 2003, Trans-Lux sold the custom scoreboard division, which operated as Trans-Lux Sports, and consolidated the remaining custom commercial business into our Des Moines manufacturing facilities.
Trans-Lux Firsts
As an acknowledged industry leader in information display systems, the company has numerous “firsts” to its credit:
The first large-scale moving display in the world.
Installed in 1923 at the New York Stock Exchange, this Trans-Lux innovation provided simultaneous access to trading information.
The first rear-projection system.
Trans-Lux first presented this technology at the 1927 opening of New York's Roxy Theatre.
The first electronic, continuous-flow wall display.
Developed by Trans-Lux, this device was installed in 1965 to provide real-time stock information.
The first electronic memory teleprinter.
Trans-Lux introduced the TLT I teleprinter for the TELEX network in 1974. TLT I recorded the first message from Westar I (one of the nation's earliest communications satellites), and was later awarded placement in the Smithsonian Institution.
The first LED large-scale scrolling multi-line news display.
Trans-Lux developed the LED News Jet technology in 1983.
The first commercially viable low voltage wedgebase incandescent technology.
In 1989, Integrated Systems Engineering (ISE), a division of Trans-Lux, made lower power consumption and brighter displays a reality.
The first software application providing full news service.
Developed by Trans-Lux in 1993 for use with Dow Jones Financial News Services providing options for full news stories, first paragraphs, headlines only, and hot news interrupt.
The first digital full matrix LED display with an alarm system.
Developed for the financial industry in 1996, the large-scale tricolor PictureWall with digital signal emulates data from a PC window while an alarm system polls for problematic anomalies.
The first compact .7-inch tricolor LED display to show alpha/numeric characters.
Installed in 1997, the .7-inch DataWall display is the smallest size LED character to be developed for the financial and other industries.
The first of its type "Spread Spectrum" wireless scoreboard controller.
Introduced by Trans-Lux’s Fair-Play division in 1999, the new controller enables event managers to manage content displayed on Trans-Lux Fair-Play’s new generation of scoreboards from anywhere in their facility.
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All times are Central (GMT -6:00)
|
This topic comprises 5 pages: 1 2 3 4 5
|
Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM
6.3.1.2
The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion
and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.
|
Home
![[fu]](graemlins/fu.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic