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Topic: When to swap a bulb?

Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 05-17-2018 07:23 PM

Well, thats off this page at Ushio. Its also interesting that Ushio also makes the optical system for those projectors.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted 05-17-2018 07:29 PM

Interesting that the bulbs set for the NEC units can muster more warranty hours than the bulbs made for the BARCO of the same wattage.

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 05-18-2018 07:04 AM

Yes Mark, it is off that page and those numbers were supplied by NEC.

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000

posted 05-18-2018 07:57 AM

So where are we at? Is everyone agreeing that the 1500W digital bulb (no iris) *may* not be sufficient over its full life? Then I might as well buy another 2000W film bulb (Ushio this time). The digital bulb has a longer life but costs more thus operating costs are essentially the same so what would it gain me?

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Carsten Kurz
Film God

Posts: 4340
From: Cologne, NRW, Germany
Registered: Aug 2009

posted 05-18-2018 11:21 AM

In germany, we have Ushio representatives that actually come and visit your cinema with a bulb and install it to show you the benefits and convince you to switch brands. Don't know if Ushio offers the same service in the US.

- Carsten

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 05-18-2018 01:49 PM

quote: Carsten Kurz
In germany, we have Ushio representatives that actually come and visit your cinema with a bulb and install it to show you the benefits and convince you to switch brands. Don't know if Ushio offers the same service in the US.

In previous film years I have had both Osram and Ushio come out to investigate some strange recurring problem Osram did find back in the late 90's that Srong 3KW high reactance rectifiers had way too much inrush current. Other than the salesman or Factory Rep, today you would never see them.

quote: Steve Guttag
Yes Mark, it is off that page and those numbers were supplied by NEC.

It's interesting that neither Barco or Christie bother to supply any specs at all.

Mark

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 05-18-2018 05:33 PM

Christie does indeed supply numbers. They are in the user manuals and in their xenon lamp literature (what the output is in each model).

Barco supplies lumen specs for their projectors but not xenon brand specific. And it is always just the highest wattage lamp available for that model however, since they have 4 lamphouses over three styles of projectors, one can know what the lumen output is on the smaller lamps by just using the smaller projector. But yes, NEC does provide the most comprehensive lumen chart, though the numbers are rather inflated. Furthermore, note they never provide the "HS" style lamp outputs to compare a UXL-20SC to a DXL-20SN3. They leave that as a homework assignment. It is on the order of 20% less but it varies by wattage/lamp style. Some are closer to 15% less while others are more like 30% less. The other factor on film lamps is that their decay is MUCH faster than digital.

One place where the HS lamps work incredibly well are in the Barco "XL" style lamphouse as used in the DP2K-32B. That optical system really works with the HS style lamps. I was blown away at how well it worked. I had to provide a 2D lamphouse as well as 3D lamphouse and to get the light down low enough, I used a UXL-20SC lamp for 2D and it was STILL on the bright side and is all of the way to the warranty hours.

Nowadays (putting aside the decline of 3D in general), I would use the S/M lamphouse in the 32B and probably go down to a 1600-watt (or less) if need be.

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000

posted 05-18-2018 08:02 PM

Is there any difference between an Ushio bulb and a Christie bulb?

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 05-18-2018 08:20 PM

quote: Steve Guttag
Christie does indeed supply numbers. They are in the user manuals and in their xenon lamp literature (what the output is in each model).

Not on the Ushio page....

quote: Steve Kraus
Is there any difference between an Ushio bulb and a Christie bulb?

Only in who you deal with if you have a failure....

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 05-19-2018 11:59 AM

Ushio owns Christie. In a sense, Christie lamps are re-badged Ushio though that is an over-simplification. People like Jim Dukes have a lot of influence over the design of the lamps that go into the Christie product.

JFC Mark, just what is your point? Ushio isn't supposed to sell Ushio branded lamps for Christie Digital Cinema in North America (or possibly all of the Americas). If you go to the US site for Ushio, do they list CDXL lamps at all or are you going to so site out of your market where even the warranty will be different?

If you go to the Christie site:

https://www.christiedigital.com/SupportDocs/Anonymous/Christie-Xenolite-Lamp-Brochure-English.pdf

Here is the Christie brochure with the lumen specs in there. There is some lumen inflation there too. The specs presume "Over drive" (which can void the warranty) so plan on 10% or so less light than they are showing.

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000

posted 06-12-2018 12:45 AM

So since we cannot be certain the 1500W digital bulb, no iris, will be bright enough, I will just stick with the 2000W. And since I don't need the greater brightness or efficiency that a digital bulb provides, I am just going to get a film bulb as I have been using. Just to be sure, if I am going with Ushio that would be the UXL-20SC, right?

I was down to the last couple hundred hours on the existing Osram XBO 2000W/HS (film bulb) when I saw it was hitting 100% current just to make spec on Scope (and I usually like to go an fL or two higher). Then I starting noticing just the barest hint of flicker. So much for that bulb.

Fortunately I still had over 460 warranted (hypothetically) hours left on the prior bulb. I put that in, the light looks good and current could go a good deal back down. (More if I pull the iris.)

Here is the bulb I removed today. Not that I'm likely to ever see it but maybe Osram owes me a couple dollars.

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Carsten Kurz
Film God

Posts: 4340
From: Cologne, NRW, Germany
Registered: Aug 2009

posted 06-13-2018 07:32 AM

Oh Steve, come on, that's such a boring decision after such a long discussion [Big Grin]

- Carsten

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000

posted 06-13-2018 09:55 AM

LOL It just got more interesting as I ordered the Ushio bulb from a vendor with a good price in nearby northwest Indiana only to have them ship some Brand Z equivalent which I'm going to have return when it arrives. They don't even carry Ushio yet have it listed on their site.

BTW is it possible that what I see on that Osram is the result of overcooling?

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Kirk Futrell
Film Handler

Posts: 95
From: Nashville, TN / U.S.A.
Registered: Nov 2008

posted 06-20-2018 10:35 AM

quote: Steve Kraus
I ordered the Ushio bulb from a vendor with a good price in nearby northwest Indiana only to have them ship some Brand Z equivalent which I'm going to have return when it arrives.

Oh no! That sounds like a Brian Vita move...

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-20-2018 10:40 AM

You really should be posting that Vendors name on here so others can avoid them....

I don't think Brian is still in business.

Mark

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