Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Century 21-22-23 (San Jose, CA) lease ending in 2012???

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Topic: Century 21-22-23 (San Jose, CA) lease ending in 2012???

Geoff Jones
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 579
From: Broomfield, CO, USA
Registered: Feb 2006

posted 03-16-2014 10:08 AM

quote: Sam D. Chavez
Century 21 and to a slightly lesser extent, 22(s) in SJ were destination theatres and drew audiences from all over the Bay Area.

When I lived in Northern Marin, I made the trip down a couple of times. I saw Titanic in 70MM there. (One of the ~16 prints in existence). The Century 21 was a fantastic theater. Because of Bay area traffic, the trip down and back would take several days.

It's a shame there isn't anyone in the Bay area who would like to preserve the theater the way Paul Allen has taken care of the Seattle Cinerama. Do Larry or Sergey ever read Film-Tech?

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Jesse Skeen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1517
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 03-16-2014 01:56 PM

quote: Geoff Jones
It's a shame there isn't anyone in the Bay area who would like to preserve the theater the way Paul Allen has taken care of the Seattle Cinerama.

Give me the money and I'll do it! [Smile]

To those who know more about these than I do, what was the public's initial reaction to the domes being cut in half? I hadn't seen a divided dome until "Top Gun" in 1986- I remember walking in expecting to see the big theater and then running smack into the wall- it looked like they had just set it up that way temporarily blocking off the other half for maintenance or something. I've been tempted to go there now and pay just for half the ticket price, since I'm only getting half the theater. Again, it's a damn shame the unruined San Jose domes are closing while the cut-up Sacramento ones remain in business, with people apparently still going to them.

Just had another flashback from my time working there BTW- a number of times I saw the half-dome theaters sold out, such as opening night of "A Few Good Men", where many people left because they couldn't find seats where they could see the screen, and "Aladdin" where I once took my lunch break and chuckled at some woman coming in late with her kids and looking for seats in the lopsided theater. They could've easily sold at least the majority of the seats in the full theater if they had kept it that way. The 21 dome, which is separate from the other 12 screens, often shows the SAME movie in both halves!

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-16-2014 03:41 PM

quote: Jesse Skeen
To those who know more about these than I do, what was the public's initial reaction to the domes being cut in half?

They lined up like a flock of sheep. Syufy always got the hot films back then except for certain studios, Disney I think. So, if you wanted to see a WB or most other big title, Century 23A or B or the like was often your only option. Brings up the question of how sophisticated the audience was or is.

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Sean Weitzel
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall)
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 03-17-2014 12:50 PM

Given the fact that the demolition permits have been filed and the fact that Mayor Chuck Reed went on record this morning stating he doesn't see a reason for preserving them, I think it will be a long shot to get 21 Landmark status. Even if 21 is preserved I do not see it ever being operated as a cinema again. I'm going to make an attempt to attend the city council meeting tomorrow night where the fate of the domes will be determined.

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-17-2014 01:15 PM

My favorite dome and I did a lot of work on the audio there but it does not lend itself to any other purpose so it sure does not seem likely to get saved.

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Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1904
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 03-17-2014 03:47 PM

quote: Sam D. Chavez
...Syufy did have ["Hello, Dolly!"] heavily booked all over the circuit and it bombed leaving a lot of empty seats. I'm sure if you dig out the records of lesser locations my memory will be confirmed.

How are you defining "bombed" and "lesser locations"?

In checking my roadshow research, I show when HELLO, DOLLY! opened as a roadshow in December 1969 it played only four Syufy venues: the Cinema 21 in San Francisco, the Century 21 in Oakland, the Century 21 in Sacramento, and the Century 21 in San Jose. Several months into release, in spring '70, the film opened with a roadshow policy in two more Syufy houses: the Century 21 in Reno and the Cinedome 21 in Orange. All of the runs, except for Reno, played in the five-to-seven-month range, which was similar to the nationwide average for that film. (I have no data for any general-release bookings that came after the roadshow release.)

quote: Sam D. Chavez
28 weeks was a short run for SJ domes back then.

Let's put that to the test...

I’ve gone through my roadshow data and have put together a longest-run breakdown for Syufy’s Century Domes. This is for the period of 1964, when the first dome opened, through 1973. Turns out I have no details for the final two roadshow releases, MAN OF LA MANCHA and LAST TANGO IN PARIS, so they’re not included. As well, a few roadshow films have been excluded (THE LION IN WINTER, HAWAII, THE BLUE MAX, etc.) because they played San Jose at a non-Syufy-operated theater (Town & Country, etc.) or because they played San Jose only as a general release.

It should also be noted in some cases, even though I accounted for the entire uninterrupted engagement, that the roadshow policy was relaxed or dropped altogether during the latter weeks of an engagement.

Hopefully, those of you who have lived or worked in the Bay Area will appreciate this information and that it won’t get dismissed as worthless trivia or minutiae.

CENTURY 21
87 weeks … 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY
58 weeks … DOCTOR ZHIVAGO
43 weeks … GRAND PRIX
36 weeks … FIDDLER ON THE ROOF
33 weeks … MY FAIR LADY
26 weeks … RYAN’S DAUGHTER
19 weeks … IT’S A MAD MAD MAD MAD WORLD
17 weeks … SONG OF NORWAY
15 weeks … THOSE MAGNIFICENT MEN IN THEIR FLYING MACHINES (+ 10-week m/o to Century 22)
14 weeks … THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD
11 weeks … ICE STATION ZEBRA
09 weeks … BATTLE OF THE BULGE

CENTURY 22
67 weeks … THE SOUND OF MUSIC
59 weeks … PATTON
47 weeks … FUNNY GIRL
28 weeks … DOCTOR DOLITTLE
23 weeks … THE BIBLE
22 weeks … THE SHOES OF THE FISHERMAN
10 weeks … THOSE MAGNIFICENT MEN IN THEIR FLYING MACHINES (m/o from Century 21)
09 weeks … FAR FROM THE MADDING CROWD
08 weeks … THE AGONY AND THE ECSTASY
05 weeks … STAR!

CENTURY 23
56 weeks … PAINT YOUR WAGON
34 weeks … CAMELOT
34 weeks … OLIVER!
34 weeks … THE SAND PEBBLES
29 weeks … THOROUGHLY MODERN MILLIE
17 weeks … FINIAN’S RAINBOW

CENTURY 24
44 weeks … GONE WITH THE WIND (1967 re-issue)
28 weeks … HELLO, DOLLY!
16 weeks … ON A CLEAR DAY YOU CAN SEE FOREVER
11 weeks … CHITTY CHITTY BANG BANG
09 weeks … DARLING LILI
08 weeks … BEN-HUR (1969 re-issue)

CENTURY 25
23 weeks … TORA! TORA! TORA!
11 weeks … SWEET CHARITY
03 weeks … GOODBYE, MR. CHIPS

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-17-2014 07:03 PM

In general I don't challenge the numbers. "Sand Pebbles" opened in Century 22 and I saw it there. I suppose I could be wrong as all domes look somewhat alike but don't think so. They did move films to lesser domes if there was a need to do so to make room so Michael's numbers may be shorter than the total run.

Hello Dolly played in Syufy Burlingame location as well. Even from Michael's data it played a lot their screens so I'm not off base here.

The length of a Dome run was governed back then in part on when the next big film was released. There was not nearly the quantity of films being released back then so there was not much choice. Thus, it was not unusual for a film to play long weeks with little attendance waiting for the next big title as Syufy tended not to play smaller or foreign/art film. These went mostly to Festival back then.

As to bombing, there is critical and financial failure. Both apply here. It's no "Star" or pick your stinker here but still a disapointment.

Mind you, I was a fan of the play, seeing it in the first week in SF (Curran or Geary) with Carol Channing and I believe the NYC road company.

Will we be debating about Cleopatra or Right Stuff next? One of these was a great film but both lost money, one more than the other of course.

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Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1904
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 03-18-2014 01:10 AM

quote: Sam D. Chavez
"Sand Pebbles" opened in Century 22 and I saw it there. I suppose I could be wrong as all domes look somewhat alike but don't think so.

My research revealed "The Sand Pebbles" was the debut booking at the Century 23 when that theater opened in March 1967. ("The Sound of Music" was at the 22, playing there from July '66 through October '67 and being replaced with "The Bible.") Maybe there was a single test/trade/exhibitor/private screening held at the 22 at some point, and that's what you're recalling? Otherwise, all the published and documented data indicates the commercial run of "The Sand Pebbles" was at the 23.

quote: Sam D. Chavez
Hello Dolly played in Syufy Burlingame location as well.

True, but that run came much later as a general-release booking. One Syufy roadshow booking I did overlook in my previous comment was at the Century 21 in Salt Lake City.

quote: Sam D. Chavez
As to bombing, there is critical and financial failure. Both apply here.

"Hello, Dolly!" was a financial failure only in relation to its cost. As far as box-office gross is concerned, it was one of the highest-grossing movies of its year of release.

quote: Sam D. Chavez
Will we be debating about Cleopatra or Right Stuff next? One of these was a great film but both lost money, one more than the other of course

Like "Hello, Dolly!," "Cleopatra" was a failure only in relation to its cost. It was the highest-grossing film of its year of release. Eventually, with its sale to network TV, it broke even.

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-18-2014 01:41 AM

quote: Michael Coate
"Hello, Dolly!" was a financial failure only in relation to its cost.

Other notable staements;

"The operation was a success but the patient died."

Henry Kissinger; the US did not lose the Vietnam war; it simply did not fulfill some of its goals.

This is great fun and I would never dispute Michael's stats as he's completely honest and a very good film scholar and I do admire what he does.

I do get a lot of people saw "Hello Dolly" but not nearly enough to make it a commercial success and nothing could make it a critical success.

There are a lot of very enjoyable and hilarious flops. "Paint Your Wagon" was one although the humor was at least partially unintentional. That is only my opinion of course.

Serious question, what caused Fox to to sell all that land n Century City? That used to be part of its back lot, no?

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Adam Martin
I'm not even gonna point out the irony.

Posts: 3686
From: Dallas, TX
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 03-18-2014 10:43 AM

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-18-2014 11:04 AM

Nice shot. I remember it like it was yesterday. Glory days for Syufy, the top notch projectionists who worked there and whose presentations had to be perfect or immediately apparent to all, and lucky moviegoers.

Hard to accept what later happened to Century 23.

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Edward Havens
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 614
From: Los Angeles, CA
Registered: Mar 2008

posted 03-18-2014 11:20 AM

quote: Sam D. Chavez
I do get a lot of people saw "Hello Dolly" but not nearly enough to make it a commercial success and nothing could make it a critical success.

No snark intended, but if Hello Dolly earned Fox $26m in rentals from theatrical exhibition on a $25m budget, doesn't that make it a "success?"

quote:
Serious question, what caused Fox to to sell all that land in Century City? That used to be part of its back lot, no?

The selling of the Fox backlot to finance the production of Cleopatra is immaterial to the discussion about how much money Cleopatra may or may not have lost for Fox once it was released, no? The two events are years apart.

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Sean Weitzel
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall)
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 03-18-2014 01:33 PM

Since 21 has been nominated for Historical places landmark status and is on the City Council agenda for discussion tonight, I went into the agenda and pulled out all of the documents/paperwork related to 21-23. Its got some historical photos and documents attached. It also contains the poo poo letter from the current property owners. I put the PDF's here if anyone is interested: http://www.lffltd.dreamhosters.com/syufy

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-18-2014 01:53 PM

quote: Edward Havens
No snark intended, but if Hello Dolly earned Fox $26m in rentals from theatrical exhibition on a $25m budget, doesn't that make it a "success?"

No snark or disrespect intended here either but I am dubious of the 25M "budget" figure as it may not include distribution, advertising, etc., which typically doubles the actual production cost. If 25M is the cost and 26M was the take and the exhibitor took say 25 to 50% of this, where is the profit?.

My reference to "Cleopatra" was to have us remember that this was the era of bloated epics making it all but impossible for any of these films to to make any money for the studio. The sale of the Fox property was a direct result of this trend. I believe "Towering Inferno" was a co-op of a couple of studios to split the downside risk.

For me the overall context is the interesting part of this thread, otherwise it simply becomes a dry recitation of bookings and grosses and various and sometimes conflicting facts with nothing interesting to tie them together.

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Rick Green
Film Handler

Posts: 12
From: Sacramento, CA, USA
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 03-18-2014 03:33 PM

Hello all,
I'm one of the guys that hardly ever posts, although I check out FT daily! This thread sure touches a nerve with me- I worked "extra" at the 21 dome in Sacramento before they tore it up, from `76 until the walkout in`78. (mrmber of IATSE 252) I loved that booth, and I fell in love with the Century JJ-2's!

Sam & John's memories of the projection walkout are spot-on. I was walking in front of the 21/22 in Sac during the first few weeks. A car rolled by me and the kids in it said "We're the new projectionists now!"

And, yeah, people would come out & tell us how screwed up it was inside, and their show was down, doesn't this stink, etc. And then they'd turn around & go back inside to watch a different show on a different screen. [Frown]

They truly were sheep...

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