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Author Topic: A nice family Christmas...minus one William Hooper Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1879 From: Mobile, AL USA Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-26-2005 01:42 AM                        Pravin's got the best handle on it, it's emotional abuse & likely just the tip of the iceberg as to what's going on in his situation. His family is having a good ol' time making him feel miserable. Aside from taking him out somewhere for a better time, a really good gift for him would be the book The Narcissistic Family by Pressman & Pressman. It's more a clinical case studies book with observations & not a self-help book, but it will likely make him realize those things are done out of selfishness, & may help him get around any certain to disappoint expectations of their ever behaving differently. That, & the regional observation that they're already grown & he can't raise them up again is about the best that can be done, but it's often quite a bit. I also hope that he'll be able to shake loose of that bunch ASAP, but as Phil has pointed out, it's not easy even from just a financial viewpoint. Not to mention that other problems that may be piled up as a result of growing up in that mess. Folks growing up with little emotional support are a little wobbly on their own, & to say the least how they bestow trust after growing up with a bunch like that is not exactly in the 95th percentile. Pretty loathsome people, to use a holiday supposedly marking the importance of compassion & good will to set someone up to kick the pins out from under him. You can tell him something technical no shrink or social worker is allowed to: "Broke, can't be fixed."  |  IP: Logged Brian Michael Weidemann Expert cat molester Posts: 944 From: Costa Mesa, CA United States Registered: Feb 2004 posted 12-26-2005 03:02 AM                        quote: William Hooper ... likely just the tip of the iceberg as to what's going on in his situation. I feel very bad, too. And the family, as others have said, should be ashamed of themselves. However, I don't necessarily think it's fair AUTOMATICALLY to group the "family" together, as if it were a conspiracy against the poor guy. I could interpret the situation, though still a shitty thing to do, as a bunch of individuals who, on their own, may feel uncomfortable or insecure or "mad" at him or just plain confused. It could have been a complete surprise to EVERYONE that, by the time all the gifts were gone, he had NONE. Now, they could have been embarassed and ashamed and decided not to endure having to bring it up, after the fact. Or, indeed, they could have looked at him with a "So there, that's what you get for being gay" look in their eyes. That information wasn't disclosed. Either way, it's no less hard on Brad's friend, and I feel his sadness and isolation.  |  IP: Logged Dave Williams Wet nipple scene Posts: 1836 From: Salt Lake City, UT, USA Registered: Jan 2000 posted 12-26-2005 04:22 AM                        This year I had already purchased a new drum set for a child whose father had just passed away. This is all he wanted and as drummer myself, I just couldn't resist. Now step things up to just yesterday. I was hard at work and when my wife picked me up at 4:30 pm to go home and relax for christmas eve, she told me of a family whose father lost his job just recently, and the six children had no presents for christmas. I was hesitant at first, but when she told me that NO ONE ANYWHERE had stepped up to help... I mean its friggin christmas right? And throw in a very nasty email to the family suggesting to them that they either sell all their personal belongings before asking for anything, or accept thier junk they were throwing away as gifts for thier children.. I had to step in. Who the hell gives trash as a gift anyway? My response is this... If you wouldn't put your name on it, then don't give it.. ASS!!! It's merry friggin christmas, not a junkyard. Times are hard, and our family was blessed this year. With just a short window to shop, just an hour, we headed to the local mall, went on a spree, and made christmas for six kids that otherwise had none. It really was the best christmas I have ever had. Being able to give to people I did not know, and would never know again. Just incredible. To imagine that family members would do what they did to this poor soul, just dispicable. May they rot in eternal grinchness! Merry Christmas to all, and whatever good night... and so on.. Ciao, and thank you my film tech family for allowing me all these years to bore you with my tedium. Ciao  |  IP: Logged Aaron Mehocic Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 804 From: New Castle, PA, USA Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-26-2005 08:48 AM                     I worked with a kid who was the biggest homp-phob I think I'll ever meet, even to the point that he claimed he'd beat the shit out of any of his kids who might be gay. On the other side of the coin he absolutely adored lesbian pornography.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 12-26-2005 09:26 AM                        Returning gay children meet the dictionary definition of "the Prodigal Son." Brad: please print out this thread and mail to the offending "Family." Louis  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 12-26-2005 09:30 AM                        That is seriously sick and vindictive. In the last two weeks, 'civil partnerships' (nicknamed gay weddings, obviously) became legal in Britain, with a load of high-profile ceremonies. They basically accord same-sex couples the same legal status as marriages (in terms of tax, inheritance, the partner's legal status as next of kin, that sort of thing). I have to confess to very quickly becoming thoroughly bored with the whole story: as I'm not gay and don't have any relatives or close friends who are, it just wasn't an issue that was directly relevant to me, and so my reaction was 'so what?'. But hearing of incidents such as the one Brad describes makes me realise why it was such a big deal for the couples involved. Homosexuality itself was illegal in the UK until the mid '60s, as was highlighted in the film Victim (BTW, I found the comparision with Le Corbeau in the IMDB review on this page interesting - my DVD of the latter doesn't have subtitles and I struggled a lot with the French when I first watched it, but am going to have another try now), which is credited with having influenced public opinion in favour of changing the law. Incidentally, religious opponents of civil partnerships in Scotland had the mickey mercilessly taken out of them in this week's Now Show - until this Friday, when it'll be replaced with this week's programme, you can hear it via the link above - the item starts at 08'05".  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 12-26-2005 01:09 PM                        Aaron, I love hypocrisy like that. I've known a few people (mostly online) who will go up and down about how evil being gay is and how it is such an abonation or whatever. I always try to steer the conversation to porn, and they without a doubt say that they LOVE lesbians. HELLO! When I point that out they don't seem to understand. Like lesbians aren't homosexual or something. I guess some people are so thick-headed that they are completely blind to everything but what they want to see.  |  IP: Logged Rick Raskin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1100 From: Manassas Virginia Registered: Jan 2003 posted 12-26-2005 02:18 PM                     I think people take more crap from family than they ever would from others. You can choose your friends. To bad you can't choose your family.  |  IP: Logged William Hooper Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1879 From: Mobile, AL USA Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-27-2005 01:40 AM                        "But they're his family!" The big problem is always that attachment is not via a mechanism that is rational. All the big work here was done by Harry Harlow's primate experiments . Eye-opening, but the experiments themselves were so cold-blooded & cruel that they were the foundation of rules for ethics of psychological experimentation being inclusive of animals. Briefly, Harlow found that attachment had more than just a little to do with propinquity alone. He put infant monkeys in a cage with a chicken wire effigy of a monkey mother with a built-in milk bottle, & a soft, stuffed terrycloth monkey mother mannequin. The infant would feed from the bottle-mannequin, but run over & be attached to the otherwise useless terrycloth mannequin. OK, sez Harlow, what happens if there's no choice? The infant monkeys were put in with just the unresponsive chicken wire mother, & the infant formed an attachment to it. It would exhibit all the usual separation anxiety freakouts if separated from the chicken wire parent. But the monkey wasn't the same reared by a cold, unresponsive parent: it had no social skills, and behaved in a truly psycotic manner when introduced to other monkeys. The last part of Harlow's experiment, which they usually don't relate in 100 or some 200 level college psych courses, was his construction of what is basically an abusive parent: one that shot out spikes or blew the small monkey with compressed air against the sides of the cage at random times when it clung to it. Guess what? The infant monkey still formed an attachment to the "monster mother" & returned to it, was distressed when separated from it, etc. The infant monkeys attached to the chicken-wire wire mothers were able to become "rehabilitated" - basically it was via re-socialization, & the work was done basically by the others in the group of monkeys into which it was introduced after the attachment phase. It was sort of a long process fo being actively engaged by them, & usually the heavy lifting was done by younger monkeys (they're more outgoing & make more mistakes in whom to trust, who would be a good playmate, cared less about social rejection, etc., but they also pull in some winners.) I don't remember reading anywhere about rehabilitation of the infants that formed an attachment to the "monster mothers". They all exhibited lack of trust or poor judgment in what to trust, etc. Attachment isn't rational, & some parents really have nothing that "deserves" attachment. Although anyone can pick a wrong 'un from time to time, it's interesting that your friend picked for a boyfriend a guy who'd out him to his parents (and must have known that they'd go all up over him, otherwise it wouldn't have been worth his time to do the outing). Sure doesn't sound like he's someone worthy of trust. I always thought that "Honor your father & mother" must have had a translation error. There is nothing particularly "honorable" about just becoming a parent; animals do it in the woods all the time. Honor is earned through wilful acts.  |  IP: Logged Phil Hill I love my cootie bug Posts: 7595 From: Hollywood, CA USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 12-27-2005 02:24 AM                  quote: Leo Enticknap Homosexuality itself was illegal in the UK until the mid '60s, as was highlighted in the film Victim... "Victim" was indeed one of the 1st films to publicly deal with the plight of homosexuals in a repressive and hostile society. It is one of my favorite films. I have to give Kudos to Dirk Bogarde for having the balls to play the part of a homosexual in that groundbreaking film especially at a time when it meant suicide for an actor in their film career to do so. He also played in another of my favorite "questionable" films... "A Death in Venice". One of the most beautifully photographed films I ever have seen. While an extremely slow moving film, the storyline, direction, camera angles, and Technicolor print colors are my idea and ideal of a classic film!  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 12-27-2005 08:17 AM                        quote: Phil Hill I have to give Kudos to Dirk Bogarde for having the balls to play the part of a homosexual in that groundbreaking film especially at a time when it meant suicide for an actor in their film career to do so. ..and also to the Rank Organisation for being prepared to risk one of its biggest stars in what was clearly going to be a very controversial film (same with Diana Dors and Yield to the Night, which was shown in Parliament and was said to have swung many MPs in favour of abolishing the death penalty).  |  IP: Logged Mike Olpin Chop Chop! Posts: 1852 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Jan 2002 posted 12-27-2005 11:26 AM                     How very sad that this sort of unkindness was practiced durring the celeration of the birth of a guy who promoted inclusion and good will. Clearly, his family missed the point.  |  IP: Logged Jim Bedford Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 597 From: Telluride, CO, USA (733 mi. WNW of Rockwall, TX but it seems much, much longer) Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-27-2005 11:28 AM                        Since I saw "Brokeback Mountain" in early September I've been hoping this film might help set the stage for a sea-change in attitude in this country. That's because it's not a "gay" film, but a love story, and love is what relationships are all about. It won't change minds by itself, but it will affect mindsets. I'm now waiting for the US Supreme Court to address the issue with the same scrutiny as was devoted to racial discrimination in the 60's. It's inevitable in a country of laws based on the proposition that "all men are created equal" that all people must be treated equally. Respect, Mon! (Sorry if some might think that Civil and Human Rights are "political.")  |  IP: Logged Greg Mueller Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1687 From: Port Gamble, WA Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-27-2005 12:58 PM                        Could there have been other problems in the family, other than the gay issue?  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-27-2005 03:12 PM                     I definately agree that this thread should be printed out and sent to the family. Even if there are other "problems" the family seeing this thread may cause an urge to settle differences. There are some good points in this thread to be taken by all!! Mark  |  IP: Logged

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