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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » My Christmas Wish - A Splicer? (Page 2)

 
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Author Topic: My Christmas Wish - A Splicer?
Don Sneed
Master Film Handler

Posts: 451
From: Texas City, TX, USA
Registered: Aug 2001


 - posted 11-24-2001 04:39 AM      Profile for Don Sneed   Author's Homepage   Email Don Sneed   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
When I was a projectionist (like 15 years ago) I always liked the Guillotyne (sorry Laptop can't spell) splicer, I never had problems with those as I do with the CIR & Neumade, but they were not cheep..I haven't use the strong splicer, but what I been told & saw they are a well built splicer, look like they would last forever !! I only wish I would have thought of the tape splicer years ago, when I first started in this business we use the Neumade wet splicer, whoooaaa weee is that showing my age !!

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Pete Naples
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1565
From: Dunfermline, Scotland
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 11-24-2001 12:47 PM      Profile for Pete Naples   Email Pete Naples   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I prefer the CIR every time. The Neumade comes a close second, and the ones I've seen that can carry two rolls of tape are handy. (splicing and zebra?). The last Strong splicers we saw are best used as door stops. They do not cut the tape accurately to the edge of teh film , leaving a sticky edge that loves nothing better that to cause the film to jump of the rollers on Dolby Cat701 readers. At two sites we ditched the Strong splicers and went to CIR, end of film jumping off SR.D reader problem.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 11-24-2001 01:55 PM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
As I said, I have only used the Neumade once or twice (when I was training someone at another theatrer), but until this thread I have always heard it's the best. So what are some problems people have had with it?

The only problem I have with my CIR, and it probably needs to be cleaned, is sometimes it leaves hanging chads. The "economy splicers" I used to use (no-name knockoffs of the CIR) left hanging chads even after I cleaned them.

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 11-24-2001 10:41 PM      Profile for Paul G. Thompson   Email Paul G. Thompson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Personally, I think the Neumade 35SS is top dog! I personally have one of my own, and if anyone other than me touches it, they get 22 lashes with a bamboo cain!

They are top heavy, but I have not found anything that will make a splice as good as they do. (Atta boy, Bob Maar )

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Dave Macaulay
Film God

Posts: 2321
From: Toronto, Canada
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 11-25-2001 12:42 AM      Profile for Dave Macaulay   Email Dave Macaulay   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The key is having your own splicer and keeping it away from everyone else. I think the usual suspects all do a decent job when properly used and cleaned. If you abuse them they don't work so well. Regardless of the blade type, if it gets dropped the blades will probably start hitting the anvil and damage both. If it gets really properly dropped the punches will start hitting the anvil - and again damage both. Once this happens, you're pretty much done - even after realignment it is likely to leave hanging chads and a strip of tape hanging off the edges - forever. I've had fair luck sharpening (removing blade dents really) the anvil edges with a fine stone so a new blade cuts the edges properly. Damaged punches are tough though, much sharpening and the chads don't totally separate.
I was taught that the anvil must have tape on it (which should be replaced fairly often) to help strip the chads from the punches.
Did anyone know the word "chad" before the last presidential election?
I'm currently waiting for parts to fix about 8 splicers from a multiplex chain. Looks like several people have already "fixed" them so lots of odd things are broken/missing. How do you lose the coil springs and the hinge pins? Why would you remove, let alone lose, all 4 rubber feet? Why would you loosen the posts? Where did you find those screws forced into the holes, and where did the original metric ones go?
If you don't have your own splicer, you may be asking these questions on Thursday night.

We don't need "real" projectionists, any high school kid can learn the job in a half day. The popcorn kid can fill in if the booth kid doesn't show, the half day training he had 2 months ago (the last time he was in the booth) was plenty. And there really is a Santa Claus.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 11-25-2001 02:18 AM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No, I never knew the word "chad" before last election.

What is the anvil?

My tech told me that tape across the splicer bed isn't necessary. How would it reduce the amount of hanging chads?

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Dave Bird
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 777
From: Perth, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Jun 2000


 - posted 11-25-2001 09:28 AM      Profile for Dave Bird   Author's Homepage   Email Dave Bird   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hey, thanks for all the responses guys! The count thus far is:
CIR - 6
Neumade - 4
Strong - 2

Ken, just guessing, but I assume tape across the bed gives a slightly
soft surface for whatever punches the "chads" to sink into and thus,
cleanly through the tape.....

Gee, maybe they need a little zebra-tape behind the cards on those 50-year old voting machines!!

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 11-25-2001 11:37 AM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The two layers of tape across the perforation area has two affects...First, it raises the perforation area of the splice so that it is tightly compressed when the perforator comes down (the film won't buckle from any slop)...second, the tape will form a very tight fit on the perforator with the sticky side down to stop the chads (they would, in affect have to pull up through two layers of tape...still possible and it does happen but substantially reduced.

Steve

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"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

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Ken Layton
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1452
From: Olympia, Wash. USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 11-25-2001 12:24 PM      Profile for Ken Layton   Email Ken Layton   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've always wondered why the CIRO splicer was known by several names like CIR, CIRO, Dr. Leo, etc.

J & R Film Company always called it Ciro and it was part of J&R as Ciro Equipment. Anyway I call as I've always known it: CIRO.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 11-25-2001 12:58 PM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Speaking of rubber feet, there is only one thing I don't like about my CIR splicers. No rubber feet. The "economy splicers" I sued had a cover on the bottom to catch the chads and rubber feet on the bottom of the cover. The CIR is open on the bottom. Anyone have any ideas on how to correct that?

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 11-25-2001 01:15 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
one other thing is don't clean out the holes in the perferator as they are what the next chad adheres to.
It was i believe a Dr Leo Cartozi (spelling unsure of) that invernted the first guilotine splicers that were distributed in the us as guilotine solicers
His manufactureing company is CIRO

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 11-25-2001 02:26 PM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
So what about that mile-long string of chads that hangs out under the holes? Should I just rip them off but leave the chads that are actually in the holes alone?

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 11-25-2001 11:37 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yup

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Philippe Laude
Film Handler

Posts: 79
From: Longueville, Belgium
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 11-26-2001 02:04 AM      Profile for Philippe Laude   Email Philippe Laude   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi gordon. The correct spelling is "CATOZZO".Dr Leo Catozzo is really famous in Italy, his invention has revolutionized the work of film editing. See http://www.noemalab.com/sections/specials/tetcm/cinema_classico_digitale/montaggio/rivoluzione.html

Here in Europe you will find CIR splicers in every booth and everyone is happy with it, I know booths where the splicer is more than 30 years old and still doing its job perfectly.
Joe's point of view is partial and stupid. He must find a perverse pleasure in calling some items "piece of crap".
Unfortunately a lot of people will take his opinion as gospel.

Philippe

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 11-26-2001 02:49 AM      Profile for Paul G. Thompson   Email Paul G. Thompson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
We have some of those $200.00 "Saturday Night Specials" running around in our booths. Some think they are cool. Sure, they will make a splice. But, if you look at the splice, you will see about a .001 inch gap between the bitter ends of the film, and raggy perf holes on the tape.

Also, you might see chads still attached to the perfs. In addition to that, the tape might climb on the registration pins. I never had a splice like this derail itself in the projector, but those splices are annoying if you look at the screen when it passes through the gate.

If you buy a good expensive splicer, they will substantially outlast and out-perform any $200,00 POS available today. My Neumade SS35 I bought was a rebuilt, perfect shape, and makes perfect splices. I paid 275.00 for it, and I would sooner have that one than one of those 200.00 cheapies...

They key is....take care of your equipment. A 200.00 POS will last about 6 months if you take care of it. Then it is worn out. A good quality splicer as many have mentioned above will last 10 years before it wears out if it is taken care of properly.

So, if one elects to spend a dollar to save a nickel, have a ball.

There is an old saying:

"Quality is like buying oats. If you want good clean oats, you have to pay the fair market price. But, if you are satisfied with the oats that have already been through the horse, well, those are a little cheaper."

Paul


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