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Author Topic: Sound leaking from behind screen Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-06-2010 12:46 AM                        That would only be effective for airborne sound. A goodly portion of the sound, especially bass frequencies, is transmitted by conduction -- this solid (let's say a wall) touches that solid (let's say the beam it's attached to) and excites it, then the beam touches another solid (let's say the adjacent wall) and so on. There is a path for the sound energy to travel that stopping only the air transmission will not affect. This is why recording studios are built as boxes within boxes and float the inner box on single points that rest on springs. It's not easy to really isolate sound and what's not easy is expensive. Besides, on the one hand your system is TRYING to produce the proper sound level for the entire frequence bandwidth and a goodly amount of money has been spent to make sure the lower frequencies are robust enough to meet a reference standard, so on the other hand the owner is trying to undue the entire system to accomodate one lunatic; it's absurd. This this woman is basically saying screw the operation, screw the patrons, screw everyone except her. I'd find out what the law says exactly. What is the penalty for repetitive tickets. I say, play it louder than usual, let the cops come each and every time and give the owner a ticket -- what are the tickets for a noise complaint -- $100? I would pay it every time and chalk it up as the cost of doing business like the hot dog street vendors bet on the cops checking their licenses only a limited time through the course of the month and they just pay the fine and return. Hookers do the same thing. If every other night you play 30 seconds of, say, the EARTHQUAKE rumble and the next night 30 seconds of the gun battle in the last reel of AVATAR, what is she going to do? Call the cops every night? When they come, IF they come....dead silence. It will be over. No ticket. I say just keep it up until she gets tired and just gives up and realizes the noise during the day is worth putting up with if it stops the noise that mysteriously wakes her up every night. Or she moves that'll work. Or of course my favorite...she goes CRAZY. It's easy to send these high-strung loons to the mad house; they are half-way there to start with.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 03-06-2010 08:49 PM                        I like your style!! Louis  |  IP: Logged Brendan Penny Expert Film Handler Posts: 121 From: Bundoora, Australia Registered: Dec 2008 posted 03-07-2010 04:45 AM                     Not really related to the topic as I think we all agree the only solution is move!! But out of curiosity, what type of sound insulation are people using these days on new builds?  |  IP: Logged John Wilson Film God Posts: 5438 From: Sydney, Australia. Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-07-2010 09:08 PM                     quote: Phil Hill Tell the whiny tenant to fuck off or move. Phil, you are my hero.  |  IP: Logged Mitchell Dvoskin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1869 From: West Milford, NJ, USA Registered: Jan 2001 posted 03-08-2010 01:04 PM                     > This this woman is basically saying screw the operation, screw the patrons, screw everyone except her. No Frank, she is saying keep your noise pollution out of my home, and she is right. Nobody should have to listen to a businesses noise inside their home, whether it be a bar/theatre/nightclub. I also believe that is the law in New York City. If the theatre can not contain it's noise, then the theatre should move to an all commercial building. I have worked in and around movie theatres my entire adult life, and if I were looking for an apartment, it would not have occurred to me that movie sound could leak into surrounding spaces. Either this venue is very old and dates to mono sound with no deep base, or the venue was poorly designed and/or constructed. In either case, it is the theatres responsibility, not the tenants.  |  IP: Logged Richard May Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1057 From: Floral Park, NY USA Registered: Aug 2004 posted 03-09-2010 08:21 PM                     This theater has been there for over 40 years. In that time, there have been no complaints. We have obtained a copy of the law on this situation. It states that during the hours of 10PM and 6 AM, noise level more than 10DB above ambient noise is illegal. We only have to worry about the 2 hours from 10PM till midnight. She can can go screw herself during the day now. Also, the sound engineer measured 7DB above and that was with the fader at 9. Also remember that she has no carpeting down, which is required by the lease. We can now say "go fuck yourself" if we wanted to. The theater owner won't do that though. He is trying to take steps to lower the noise. As far as what was said about it being the theaters responsibility to control it and basically saying she is the victim here. If you look at an apartment directly above a four screen theater and you assume that NOTHING is going to come through, than you're an IDIOT.  |  IP: Logged John Wilson Film God Posts: 5438 From: Sydney, Australia. Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-09-2010 08:38 PM                     Which she blatantly is. AND..she can't act.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 03-10-2010 05:29 AM                        Ahh Mitchell....you are not an apartment dweller. All apartment dewllers know that there is NO way you can have the luxury of a unit that doesn't have at least some amount of noise leak from units above, below and around you. It's just a fact of life. And unless this woman viewed the apartment in that small window in the morning hours or after midnight, she knew how much noise leak she was going to have to live with. I am an apartment dweller and you just have to put up with some noise leak. Lord knows the people who live in apartments adjacent to mine live with some noise from my system. But even if you buy a house, unless it's in the woods or the desert, or on a deserted island, there is always the possibility of noise polution. My aunt lives a half a block from the F Train (for you non-New Yorkers, it's the elevated section of the subway system in Brooklyn....we still call it the subway). Every time we visited, you would hear the screeching and rumble of the train every 15 minutes. During the summer when you had to keep the windows open, you actually had to stop talking to wait until the train passed - a good 60 seconds. My aunt & uncle certainly knew that fact when they bought the house -- you can't miss an elevated train next to your house. What was my aunt to do after she bought the house -- call the cops on the MTA....tell them to stop the train noise? What did this diva think she was going to move into....an anechoic chamber? There's a THEATRE below your apartment unit, lady; wake up and smell the popcorn....and listen to the Sensurround! Obviously she's a typical divia (translate, spoiled brat) who thinks the world revolves around her. We've all delt with them in this business. Well, maybe a director has to put up with her crap because he's got a half finished movie that millions are riding on, but she's on the wrong end of the industry's food chain; she's now dealing with the exhibitor where the "diva" title won't even get her a free popcorn; he doesn't have to put up with any of her sheet. So echoing Richard -- she's an idiot. BTW, the owner seems to be going more than half way to try to accomdate her, asking about putting in insulation and such. Yet she's not putting in carpet or getting one of those little machines that makes noise-masking sound. Or hey, how bout this --stuffing her ears with EAR PLUGS?  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 03-10-2010 06:45 AM                     ...and her mouth with orthodontic plaster.  |  IP: Logged Cameron Glendinning Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 845 From: West Ryde, Sydney, NSW Australia Registered: Dec 2005 posted 03-10-2010 06:49 PM                     quote: Richard May Also remember that she has no carpeting down, which is required by the lease. OK this one needs more details, has she got an unfinished concrete floor? or is it a new timber type flooring? quote: Richard May Also, the sound engineer measured 7DB above and that was with the fader at 9. This I don't follow, was it pink noise or a movie soundtrack? If its a movie soundtrack due to the typical dynamic range this figure will vary due to the individual soundtrack played and the way it was mixed. ie Transformers would leek a lot more than a typical arthouse film. Was the sub still switched off? quote: Richard May noise level more than 10DB above ambient noise is illegal. We only have to worry about the 2 hours from 10PM till midnight. Yes but this is quite a worry as the ambient noise levels are generally dramatically lower in the late evenings . quote: Richard May This theater has been there for over 40 years. In that time, there have been no complaints. Ok so your theater was designed for mono playback then, when did you put in the dolby digital or sr in that screen? However this does imply that it is probably something that she has done to the apartment, so the answer to question one is of interest to me! To be perfectly honest the easiest and possibly cheapest way of soundproofing could possibly be in and involve her apartment only  |  IP: Logged Richard May Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1057 From: Floral Park, NY USA Registered: Aug 2004 posted 03-10-2010 09:31 PM                     The building is a very old wood structure building. I don't think there is any concrete in the floors on any level. She has hardwood flooring down. She ripped out the REQUIRED carpeting upon moving in. The 7DB above level was with the sub on during movie playback. It flucuated up to 7DB above while he was up there. We are an arthouse so rarely do we get any "loud" movies. In NYC noise levels are loud 24 hours but during those 2 hours we can just lower the fader. Stereo was put in in 1990. Now we have 4 CP 65's and no digital. Nobody ever complained before because the sound levels really are not that bad in that apartment. Also, they had carpeting down so it was even less. Another reason is because the people that lived there before knew they were living ON TOP OF A FREAKIN MOVIE THEATER!!!! The way I see it now is that we were borderline on the 7DB above level and that was with the fader at a level we would never run it at. Combine that with the FACT that she has no carpeting, which she is required to have. Throw in for the fun of it that she is fucking crazy. She will never be happy no matter what we do. That being said, at least we are trying to help her out.  |  IP: Logged Cameron Glendinning Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 845 From: West Ryde, Sydney, NSW Australia Registered: Dec 2005 posted 03-10-2010 09:51 PM                     So did she put in new flooring or did she simply sand and polish the existing flooring? The reason I ask is because if its new flooring it could be making things worse, ie amplifying the tin can on a string effect. Ironically if she did go this way for a few dollars more she could have got a floating floor which would have made it much much quieter!  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-10-2010 11:05 PM                     You should fuck with her brain. Have a "Patricia Clarkson Film Festival" and get her to come down and sign autographs but have a dozen or so shills come in and say, "Patricia Clarkson? Who the fuck is that?"  |  IP: Logged Richard May Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1057 From: Floral Park, NY USA Registered: Aug 2004 posted 04-18-2010 10:52 AM                     So here is the update to all this. The sound engineer installed a compressor/limiter into the system. It compresses the signals on the input side and limits the signals on the output side. We also disconnected the sub for good. He said we don't really need it. I flattened out all of the cat 64 cards so he could EQ from his new unit. He did the EQ and then targeted the "problem" frequencies. He then set the compression level and limiting level. We set final SPL's and ran The Hurt Locker. Obviously, the dialouge scenes sounded fine, unless there was yelling, but the explosions sounded like shit. All the bass is gone and the range has been completely compressed. Luckily, we are an arthouse and rarely run movies like The Hurt Locker. After we were done, he said that he actually improved the sound in the theater. Let's see.....removed sub.....compressed the range....limited the peaks.......removed the problem frequencies......yep sounds like an improvement to me........I guess the bitch wins. I'll bet you she STILL complains  |  IP: Logged Sean McKinnon Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1712 From: Peabody Massachusetts Registered: Sep 2000 posted 04-18-2010 12:01 PM                        um... was this sound engineer a cinema engineer? Cinema sound is a very specific and unique animal. It is nothing like live or PA sound. Adding compressors and limiters to a cinema system is a very bad idea, as is disconnecting your sub. How did he EQ this room? Did he usa an RTA with pink noise and eq to the "x" curve?  |  IP: Logged

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