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Author Topic: Building Prints Questions. Thomas Procyk Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1842 From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 07-05-2004 11:23 AM                     quote: Ken Lackner Just playing Devil's advocate in trying to explain why people feel the need to use Edgemark even though they already have zebra tape. Ken -- Could you play Devil's advocate to a theater that used opaque yellow splices, about 6" of Edgemark AND shoe polish?? I worked at one, and after painstakingly training the booth staff as to how to find clear splices, they just started filling a reel and chopping. Some people just don't want to learn, no matter what. No offense, Brad, but do you think people who don't want to learn the correct way to do things would actually take the time to mark the splice that way? Nah, it's MUCH EASIER to screw presentation and use opaque white/yellow. Many have said that opaque tape should be discontinued, but even Neumade says "But our customers request it." Hmmm. Some theaters don't feel they have to play F911 even though their customers request it. =TMP=  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-05-2004 01:27 PM                     Thomas, if that trick did not work to get some theaters to stop putting shoe polish and other obnoxious markings on the print, I would not have posted it. I am not saying it is the best way to build a print. I am only saying it is an acceptable way to identify the splice without damaging the film, and a superior way than using zebra tape which leaves residue. Why have I had to clarify everything I've said this last week to you?  |  IP: Logged Steve Scott Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1300 From: Minneapolis, MN Registered: Sep 2000 posted 07-05-2004 02:57 PM                     When tearing down the print, just put a small piece of tape on top of the print near the splice. If you only have to tear it down once, there's no reason to put any marks or flags on the print until you tear it down.  |  IP: Logged Adam Wilbert Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 590 From: Bellingham, WA, USA Registered: Mar 2002 posted 07-05-2004 07:32 PM                        It hasn't been mentioned yet here (though i believe its in the tips section) that marking how full the reels are when building up gives you a very accurate way to help know when you should be nearing the splice. Also, as noted above, a piece of artists tape on top of the film marking the location of the splice (which is usually easier to locate when the platter is stopped) not only helps you find it, it narrows down how often you have to be expecting the splice as you get closer. As that little flag goes around and around, you only *really* have to be feeling once per revolution. What is edgemark? I've never used or seen it. -Adam  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-05-2004 07:34 PM                     Edgemark It's no longer distributed by CPI (nothing of quality is anymore), but the product is still around.  |  IP: Logged Dominic Espinosa Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1172 From: California, U.S.A. Registered: Jan 2004 posted 07-06-2004 10:18 AM                     I know this is obvious but what the hell is so hard about finding a splice? Feel the top of the roll and slow down once you can see the texture of the reel dissappearing. I have a been breaking down prints by doing this and/or feeling the edges as it passes onto the rollers of the MUT ever since I started and I hardly ever miss a splice. And on another note I recieved a shipping reel the other day that had a "fill line" on it. Artists tape with a mark on it. It's nice to see other people out there actually practice these techniques.  |  IP: Logged Ken Lackner Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1907 From: Atlanta, GA, USA Registered: Sep 2001 posted 07-06-2004 11:16 AM                     Brad, Edgemark is still on CPI's website.  |  IP: Logged Thomas Procyk Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1842 From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 07-06-2004 11:32 AM                     quote: Brad Miller Thomas, if that trick did not work to get some theaters to stop putting shoe polish and other obnoxious markings on the print, I would not have posted it. I am not saying it is the best way to build a print. I am only saying it is an acceptable way to identify the splice without damaging the film, and a superior way than using zebra tape which leaves residue. Why have I had to clarify everything I've said this last week to you? Right. SOME theaters. And I was merely suggesting that those theaters will figure out that using opaque tape will be even easier than cutting/placing/splicing over artist's tape. I was not saying that it's a BAD SUGGESTION or that it WILL NOT WORK or that NO ONE will use it. Just that people who didn't care enough not to use shoe polish won't care about the effects of opaque tape on presentation, and may resort to using that, or zebra tape since it does "the same thing" (make the splice easier to find). You didn't HAVE to clarify anything. You CHOSE to do so and then became irritated by your own decision. I knew exactly what you were saying despite what you may have percieved. I just opined on your suggestion. =TMP=  |  IP: Logged Thomas Dieter Expert Film Handler Posts: 234 From: Yakima, WA Registered: Jun 2004 posted 07-06-2004 11:41 AM                     Ken Lackner, to answer your question of "What is this "mowed lawn practice"?". It is just what it sounds like. When you mow a lawn with a push mower, you can tell where you went one way, and where you went another. When you build a print, you can tell, even without using the grease pen/pencil or shoe polish, or what ever you use to mark the end of the reel. It's one of the easiest ways to tear down a print. Now when it comes down to tearing down the print, and feeling for the splice as it goes round on the platter, I can attest to the fact that you can't always feel the splice. Some projectors like the one we use at the Chehalis Theatre, which is now a Simplex with RCA sound head, seems to make the splice disappear to the touch. I think that everyone here has answered my questions very well. This is defiantly a very well put together forum, and the users are very friendly and informative.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-06-2004 11:47 AM                     quote: Ken Lackner Edgemark is still on CPI's website. FilmGuard was on their website for awhile too after I pulled the plug on them, but they did not actually have it. CPI has become a professional group of scam artists. They will say or do ANYTHING to get a buck out of somebody, and they owe quite a lot of money to almost every reputable manufacturer in the industry, most of whom have cut them off. That's why they no longer have any quality products. Everything they sell now is bottom of the barrel crap. Try www.jackroeusa.com instead.  |  IP: Logged Steve Scott Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1300 From: Minneapolis, MN Registered: Sep 2000 posted 07-06-2004 11:51 AM                     Bright Star just started shipping Jacro's film cleaner/lubricant in the spray bottles, instead of C-Lube. It works good on cleaning pad rollers and the gate, but I've noticed it has a different consistency than C-Lube.  |  IP: Logged Ken Lackner Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1907 From: Atlanta, GA, USA Registered: Sep 2001 posted 07-06-2004 12:04 PM                     Thomas D: I get it. You're likening the way a print appears from the top when built on a platter to the way a freshly-mowed lawn looks. Yes, that is exactly how I break down a print.  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 07-06-2004 01:57 PM                        With GOOD light, it is usually easy to see the subtle differences in the gloss of the film edges from reel to reel. The only caution is that different strips of film are also used on each side of a lab splice, so you'll see a gloss difference there too.  |  IP: Logged Peter Mork Expert Film Handler Posts: 181 From: Newton, MA, USA Registered: Jun 2002 posted 07-06-2004 03:45 PM                     Correct - and for that reason relying on the different gloss appearance between reels, while useful, can also be frustrating. If we can all agree that breaking down lots of plattered prints on a Thursday night is one of the less fun tasks we have to do, then anything that makes it easier is worth pursuing. I'm in favor of marking the joins in any obvious, visible way that works for you. As long as you don't make a mess.  |  IP: Logged Josh Kirkhart Expert Film Handler Posts: 165 From: Austin/Houston, TX, USA Registered: Nov 2001 posted 07-07-2004 08:00 AM                     Not to get Brad upset about asking for a clarification but: On the Zebra tape you eluded too and Ken asked about; I assume your talking the yellow striped splice tape that has lines for the frame line and edges, or T-stripe as this is the only yellow/red tape I've seen other than opaque. With this in mind I have never had a residue problem with yellow striped more than clear, they both can leave residue depending on condition. I feel as if I have missed a thread or some such debating residue of tape. If I assumed the wrong type of tape disregard my thoughts, but please address Kens' question and your two posts about 'residue'.  |  IP: Logged

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