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Topic: Deadbeats in the industry (see page 7 for current info on Ron Purtee)

Timothy Eiler
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 126
From: Litchfield , Minnesota, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 02-25-2006 08:16 AM

quote: Gordon McLeod
If one doesn't take delivery in a prompt fashion then the blame rides on them
one must complete all the arrangements

At No time did I Blame that on John In fact I took responsibility for my actions In my post I said

quote: Timothy Eiler
I took approx a year to do anything as far as shipping goes in getting the Equipment.

There is not even an implication that John had any Fault on the Shipping aspect.

quote: Gordon McLeod
If someone buys something from me but doesn't get it out the door I do expect reasonable storage charges

John was keeping 1/2 of the Money I paid for the Lamphouse's that I did not recieve, as they were resold them to another party.

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John Eickhof
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 588
From: Wendell, ID USA
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 02-27-2006 05:16 PM

Hi Tim, I'm glad you brought this up. I have no problem with what you have said, in fact the only problem I have had is on my end! It has been so long sinnce the original deal that I have gone through one hard drive failure and since then it appears my 'fresh' compuker has failed too, thus I have been hunting through all the old paperwork I keep in order to find the original documents so I can figure out how much I said I would refund you. This has been compounded by the recent months of moving out of my theatre / home and business! Thus I am in utter chaos! My Email account got slammed about 4 weeks ago with some bad spam and my server had to delete all correspondence thus I believe that is where the recent emails went? Anyway, I have found some of the paperwork on the original deal, but still am unclear about the amount I was going to send... also, I received your email 2-27 and await your return home so lets get the thing done!! Thanks! John

[ 02-28-2006, 02:13 PM: Message edited by: John Eickhof ]

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 02-28-2006 11:18 PM

quote: Louis Bornwasser
Prepayment may well be our common future. I looked at credit cards, but in a non retail environment, there is insufficient markup to allow the fees. Louis

We get one or two bad smallish accounts a year which out of the thousands of buisness transactions we do yearly is a really tiny amount. I may be posting one Southern California Theatre Chain on this thread before the week is out, unfortunately this account also involves a Film-Techer.

We have had good luck with using collection agencies although there is a cost for that. If the collection agency can't collect then the client's poor payment record goes onto their credit history.... a bad thing indeed!

Cash prepayment or Credit Card is a wise move on any new customer for the first year or so..... until they get established with you and proper credit history checks can be made. We take alot of credit card payments at CLACO and the items are marked up to reflect the extra charge we get nabbed, about 18% when customers use them. Customers are aware of this before hand and generally have no problem with it. Many are just starting out in buisness anyway and have yet to develope any credit history for their buisness.

quote: Gordon McLeod
If someone buys something from me but doesn't get it out the door I do expect reasonable storage charges

We generally don't do this on cinema equipment but we do on used seats. We will let any of our customers take as long as they need to pay off a lay away item, some have gone on as long as a year. They can also pick it up at their convenience. Storage is not a problem. We are in buisness to accomodate and serve our customers... not ourselves.

On personal dealings I can be VERY slow to ship stuff out but ALWAYS eventually do. If a customer wants his payment back due to my slowness I am always glad to refund in full(not 1/2) when asked...something thats never happened. I also never sell something twice! On a personal level I will also sell equipment that has been apparently abandoned if its sits for more than several years on my property...something I have done twice over the years. I did both of those in a fashion so that the owner knew about it and was in a fair and equal position to buy the equipment back for what would be resonable storage fees.

Mark

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 03-01-2006 08:58 AM

Mark said "the extra charge we get nabbed, about 18% when customers use them"
The normal transaction fee is at most up here 3.5% nd that is on AMEX and then the monthly terminal fee
At the antique market the better half and I own the net average of all fees and differnt card for a year was 4.2%
Also most card and bank agreements specifically disallow any costs being added for card use or incentives to use cash

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 03-01-2006 07:06 PM

quote: Gordon McLeod
Also most card and bank agreements specifically disallow any costs being added for card use or incentives to use cash

Well I guess thats how it is in a socialist country but in a democracy its alot different. Down here I don't know if they disallow tacking on the fees... all of which are alot higher than yours. I could really care less in fact and so could our customers that use the cards. Amex down here is even higher than VISA/Master card and very inflexible. Not being a line item how would the Credit Card Company ever know that you tacked something onto the price to cover their gouging expenses.....? Rediclous.

Mark

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4021
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 03-01-2006 09:11 PM

Source: USA Today

Extracted from that article:

quote:
David Robertson, publisher of The Nilson Report, a newsletter about credit and debit cards, disputes American Express' claim that its customers will go to other stores rather than shop at Walgreens so that they can use their cards.

"Everybody who has an American Express card has a Visa or a MasterCard card or a debit card," Robertson says. "Walgreens is not going to lose business. The losers are American Express card holders."

American Express charges merchants an average 2.05% of sales made on the card, vs. 1.55% for Visa and MasterCard, Robertson says. Those averages are for both debit and credit cards and all types of cards offered by the companies, including corporate and consumer. That means that for every $100 in credit card sales, retailers pay American Express $2.05 and Visa and MasterCard $1.55.

While that may seem like a small amount, the dollars add up, merchants say. Many say the spread in the fees, which are negotiated by each retailer, is wider, with some merchants reporting American Express fees above 3%. Robertson, however, says American Express has been reducing its fees in recent years to be more competitive.

From what I understand, cash discounts are legal. But surcharges for credit card transactions are not legal in some states (Texas for example).

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 03-01-2006 09:32 PM

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
We take alot of credit card payments at CLACO and the items are marked up to reflect the extra charge we get nabbed, about 18% when customers use them

Mark - If you guys are really getting charged 18% on your credit card sales, you're getting the largest ripoff in American history. We do a couple of thousand $ worth of card sales a month at my day job at most and we only pay 2.8%.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 03-01-2006 09:54 PM

I think it has more to do with the quantity of transactions as we do just a few a month.

Mark

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Mike Spaeth
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1129
From: Marietta, GA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 03-01-2006 10:05 PM

It doesn't matter ... we pay $10 flat/month + $.10 per transaction + about 1.75%/transaction

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000

posted 03-01-2006 10:30 PM

http://www.gofso.com/Premium/LE/06_le_ic/fg/fg-merchants.html#C

quote:
EXTRA CHARGE FOR USING A CREDIT CARD

Some merchants seek to impose a service fee for all credit card purchases.

When a merchant gives a credit card slip to the credit card company or bank for processing, a percentage of each purchase—usually 1.5% to 5% of the purchase amount—is deducted. This "merchant discount fee" helps pay for the bank's services and for the credit card system. By charging extra for credit card use, the merchant passes the discount fee on to customers.

MORE: Since 1984, when a Truth in Lending law ban on surcharges expired, some states have enacted laws prohibiting surcharges.

States That Prohibit Credit Card Surcharges:

* California
* Colorado
* Connecticut
* Florida
* Kansas
* Maine
* Massachusetts
* New York
* Oklahoma
* Texas

Visa and MasterCard prohibit surcharges, and American Express discourages them. Amex does prohibit "discrimination" against the Amex card, however, so if a merchant accepts Visa and MasterCard (and cannot impose a surcharge under those companies' rules), the merchant may not discriminate against Amex by imposing a surcharge.

TIP: Any merchant that accepts American Express cards and also accepts Visa and/or MasterCard may not charge consumers a surcharge on Amex purchases.

Surcharges invite numerous abuses by retailers, including bait-and-switch tactics. There are no laws on how and when surcharges must be disclosed, making it difficult to figure out the total price of an item. Travelers often find it difficult to get out-of-state checks accepted, and should not be penalized for using credit cards. Further, credit card acceptance usually produces higher sales for merchants, offsetting the cost of processing credit card transactions.

Note that a cash discount is legal and permitted under all credit card companies rules. A cash discount offers a lower price for cash than credit; for example, many gasoline stations offer cash discounts. While this may merely be a loophole, it is permitted. In addition, there are a few state governmental agencies, including state tax offices and motor vehicle departments, that are permitted to charge surcharges due to state laws that do not permit them to pay discount fees. However, retail merchants may not impose surcharges.

Lots of other good info at that link.

Table of Contents:

Personal Information
Minimum Charge Requirements
Extra Charge For Using A Credit Card
ID When Paying By Check
Cards Other Than The "Big Three"
How To Complain
INFOSOURCES

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Steven J Hart
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: WALES, ND, USA
Registered: Mar 2004

posted 03-02-2006 07:18 AM

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Well I guess thats how it is in a socialist country but in a democracy its alot different.

According to the CIA's The World Factbook - Canada Canada's Government is:
a constitutional monarchy that is also a parliamentary democracy and a federation.

Canada does have socialized health care, but their government is curently controlled by the Liberal party which could be loosely compared to the U.S's Democrat party.

Steve

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 03-02-2006 07:54 AM

I don't know if there is a law banning debit card surcharges or just the way business practice has evolved; but in Britain credit card surcharges are increasing, whereas I've never known them applied to debit card transactions. In fact, a growing number of retailers (not many high street stores, but, for example, council tax and gas bill payments) will only accept debit cards and won't take credit cards at all.

This could be because under British law, a credit card provider must refund the cost of defective goods or services not delivered if the supplier refuses to or goes bust. So basically, you're getting a 'free' insurance policy. For that reason I always buy high cost items (e.g. major electrical appliances) with my credit card, even if it means swallowing a surcharge. By the same token I recently bought an airline ticket on my CC, despite a surcharge: I figured that £3 was a small price to pay for a guaranteed, no arguments refund on a £400 ticket if the airline goes TU between now and when I take the trip (not an insubstantial risk, given that the airline is Northwest and the trip isn't until July).

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 03-02-2006 09:15 AM

Actually in the recent election it is a conservative government (republican) that is in power but as a minority government

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Sam D. Chavez
Film God

Posts: 2153
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 03-02-2006 10:14 AM

Leo,

Does TU mean the same thing on that side of the pond as it does here?

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000

posted 03-02-2006 11:44 AM

I think it does Sam. Of course in aviation we say, "Tango Uniform". [Big Grin]

Leo, Northwest's pilots are so angry and fed up at the proposed cancelling of their contract and retirement package that they are about to vote for a suicide strike (the latest NWA ALPA MEC polls show 90% in favor of such a move). They see themselves as goners anyway and plan to take the company down with them. I think a review of credit card rules regarding airline ticket purchases, especially on NWA and DAL would be a good idea these days.

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