70mm film handling done (sorta) wrong!

[Andrew Walker]

The Loader is a MakeUpTable (MUT). It's just not a free-standing MUT with wheels. The Loader simply converts an empty deck into the reel shaft found on a MUT, otherwise it's the same. There are 2 limitations of it vs. a conventional MUT. First, loading speed is the same as from a free-standing MUT, but the breakdown speed is based upon the platter's physical ability to spin a deck at it's fastest vs. a separate motor housed in a free-standing MUT which could spin the reel the film is being broken down onto at a much higher speed. So the end result is breakdown takes a bit longer, of which happens once on these special engagements. To the studios, spending an extra hour of contracted payroll labor time for a slower breakdown and not having to incur all of the absurd costs involved in delivering the print fully assembled on one of those oversized split reels is a no-brainer. Also the big Show Shipper reels always caused film damage during return shipping whereas the breakdown wind from a Loader is absolutely flawless. Perfectly tight, perfectly smooth and flat. It does a far superior job than any MUT can, which protects the film from shipping damage during return-transit.

The second limitation of the Loader is you have to have an adjacent empty deck, meaning you can't have a print on the top and middle platter, but break the print that is resting on the top platter down to the bottom (the print on the middle platter would be in the way). Since there are 70-80 of these MUT-less 70mm projection systems out in the field, and factoring in the incredibly rare incidents of having 2 different prints on the platter at the same time, this solution was better for a long list of reasons, these two points I just explained being the only negatives.

Andrew was CLEARLY afraid of the Loader in his first video, but I consider that a good thing. It got him to start slow and make sure he got a feel for how it worked during the loading of the leader and then in the next shot it was clear he got comfortable in seeing how it worked in person and he had cranked up the speed to a normal setting for loading. However during that dramatic sequence (likely designed for YouTube engagement) he seems to have scared people into thinking it was dangerous.

I stated previously that Andrew's Oppenheimer print came back in nice condition, so that proves he knows (at minimum) the basics needed to run a print via platter (at least until the point something went wrong). That doesn't change the fact that the procedure he showed in this video is the absolute dead wrong way to go about resetting the print and put it at high risk of damage. The bulk of his experience is with reel to reel, which is fine, but regardless the biggest failure is he did not reach out to us to report the print dilemma and get official direction on the proper way to handle this scenario. Universal hired Film-Tech specifically to handle all aspects of the prints from positive assembly to shipping, projectionist support in the field for anything print related (or which can cause print related issues) as well as return inspections, ultrasonic cleaning, etc. Similarly Universal also hired BLS to handle all preventive maintenance service call checks, emergency equipment field repairs and projectionist hiring. There might be a tiny bit of crossover between BLS and Film-Tech in the instance a piece of equipment is causing print scratches or damage, but this scenario clearly required both. BLS was obviously called to provide the initial consultation and confirm the diagnosis on the noise he heard and then to dispatch a field technician (most likely with replacement parts), as we saw the field tech and the machine back up and running. However Andrew failed to call FT regarding how to handle the print dilemma which is a requirement of the job and his comments here and on youtube seems to indicate he is incapable of acknowledging that.

Yes there is often more than one acceptable way to resolve a problem, but that doesn't mean every method is acceptable when the risk factors (especially cinch scratching) are added into the equation. We would never have approved his solution. The proper solution is so simple he would not have even needed to cut the film. I don't fault Andrew or anyone for having ignorance on some aspect of a job. There are indeed many very good projectionists who have actually never had a failure mid-show on a platter. None of us in this world knows everything, but some people have decades of experience and expertise of which could have, and should have been called upon before starting to bs his way through it. (And no "ignorance" does not in any way mean "stupid" or "dumb". Look it up.)

Personally I think Andrew should consider writing and directing some suspenseful thrillers. I know I'm not the only one here who watched his video and found his approach to the dilemma was more tense and stressful than just about any movie I can recall seeing.

Interesting take. But I wasn't "Clearly afraid" of the loader. Its a new piece of equipment that I only new about when I showed up on site. So I proceeded cautiously as most people would. All the other 70mm screenings I have been on have used the one big reel solution, so this was new.

You're totally right...I am incapable of acknowledging that I did anything wrong...because I didn't do anything wrong. I got the print back to the head ready to play once the projector was up and running. Zero damage to the print...except for a splice. I have 30 years of experience in this field and yeah most of it is at the studios doing reel to reel shows. But I always try and make sure the print is in the best possible condition and the show is the best it can be. Given the stories of other operators on these shows over the years I'm about as far away from being irresponsible as I could get.

My solution wasn't about ignorance of the equipment. It was about being able to correctly control the tension of the film and its speed. I wasn't in a rush to get the print back together so I didn't mind taking the long way to get it ready for the show.

Now I'm trying to be as nice as I can be about all this and not ruffle anymore feathers than I already have. But you were being a dick on the YouTube comments. I'm assuming its you with the user name FTDepot on there since the email for that account looks like its yours. Because of your attitude I will only being dealing with BLS on any issue...not you.

[Steve Guttag]

On the YT comments, I didn't say anything other than a snarky comment about the red taillight on the Barco when all was well. However, this is F-T where people should be able to benefit from others to, hopefully, improve the trade.

Drew's solution would not have been mine (presuming I couldn't repair the projector and a mere loose flywheel screw would have been in my wheelhouse). But let's say the intermittent is toast...

How about using the F-T build up thingy to spin the take up platter and let the payout platter feed the film out? You got time and it will be done, no slower than at the speed of running the movie in real time. At most, one would have to slightly adjust a roller for alignment from the top to the bottom of the platter tree. It would be easy and safe to the film with nearly zero extra film handling.

[Brad Miller]

Steve - I and a number of his youtube commenters already pointed out that he could have performed that standard speed wind you described on the platter by unthreading the projector and lower takeup arm roller using the Loader as a driver for the takeup platter. He wouldn't have had to cut the film like he did and the chances of a disaster happening would have been very, very low. Unfortunately the concept of him learning anything at all is clear to me at this point we are all wasting our time. He just twists everything around and dismisses anything that isn't blatant praise. The youtube comments and his replies more than prove this observation.

It reminds me of those drunk drivers that argue they did nothing wrong because they didn't hit anything (or anyone). That's NOT a reason to praise them and no brownie points should be awarded either. Praise would be deserved if they did the right thing and called a friend or uber instead of putting everyone else on the road (or in their vehicle) at unnecessary risk.

Despite any opinion anyone may have on how great or horrible his solution was, it cannot be debated that he violated the studio's instructions...but his narcissism is so far gone he can't even admit to that. Now he has doubled down above and blatantly stated if another issue was to happen involving the print that he will continue with the insubordination all because he can't handle any sort of fact or advice that isn't completely covered in praise. We are all wasting our time because he knows everything and we should be praising his greatness.

World events over the last 18 months alone should be more than enough proof that this world doesn't need any more of that exact kind of behavior. Think about it.

[Marco Giustini]

I will refrain from commenting on how Andrew recovered that film. But I would like to acknowledge his care in doing what he thought was the right thing to do. The care in handling the film and trying to avoid damage. I know plenty of people who would have easily destroyed most of that print.

[Tony Bandiera Jr]

This latest video was brought to my attention by another F-T member. I watched it and decided to hold back on commenting as I knew you guys would end up saying what I was about to say, (especially Brad.)

Andrew, saying you have 30 years experience (is that full time BTW?, as with all of the travel and other videos you do I doubt you worked a booth for most of that 30 years) is nothing to brag about on here as most of the ones you are disagreeing with have more like 40-50 years of full time experience both as projectionists and technicians. I have learned a LOT from most everyone on here, had some of my own bad habits corrected and I have shared some of my greatest fuckups as well. I don't get defensive about it, I LISTEN AND LEARN. It has saved my bacon more times than I can count.

That same edict applied to my later full time career as an electrician. I learned a lot from the "old hands" and never argued or dismissed their advice with an attitude of "I know better than you do." Again, over the years it has saved me from some very dangerous situations and causing very expensive damage. (Some of the industrial switchgear I had to work on cost well into high six figures.)

and this:

Because of your attitude I will only being dealing with BLS on any issue...not you.

Is absolutely the wrong attitude to take with someone who has strong ties with all the major studios and BLS. It would not surprise me to see you removed from their callout lists, so you may be running your last ever 70mm show. Like Brad said, there is a protocol in place for dealing with issues which you not only ignored this time, but NOW you publicly admit you'll refuse to follow it in the future. My years in the projectionist union saw projectionists getting removed for that kind of attitude and sometimes even less.

I'm gonna end this post with a blast from the past on the old forum software, where I shared my worst ever fuckup (that thankfully did not result in my causing film damage, even though the manager did):

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana, Arial]I think my worst mistake ever came during my first year as a projectionist in Tucson at the Air Force Base theatre. We had Simplex XL's with RCA 9030's, 2,000' magazines..and the old Ultra-Panatar "mirror box" 'scope attachments. Feature was "Conan The Barbarian", with a flat trailer/policy reel on the number one machine.

Did my changeover to the feature, BAM! Picture on SIDE WALL of the auditorium!! One "Holy F--in S--t!" heard by everyone in the house,shutdown, manager racing up the stairs ripping the still-turning reel off the machine (he thought I had the film in backwards). Manager winding film like a madman, me pissed and puzzled by why pic's nowhere near the sheet ...finally found I hadn't seated the Ultra Panatar on the top crossbar right. Started the machine, shifted the attachment as the house saw the rectangle of light magically move to the screen. Luckily for me the two-star General movie buff wasn't there that night.!

Same theatre, opened the Peerless Lamphouse with the xenon conversion operating. Still have the burn in my left eye.

Again, same theatre..ran preview (green band) for a movie about a woman's talking privates to a kiddy matinee ..official policy was quickly changed to pre-screen ALL trailers before public showing! [/FONT][/SIZE]

Here's the link to the whole thread: https://www.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ub...c;f=1;t=000997

[Tony Bandiera Jr]

I've had too many splices fail (both ultrasonic and cement) where one corner is starting to give. Twice in as many years, I've seen the results of a break where none should have been too. Was it a factory splice? Dunno but I would have known for sure if the spices were checked.

I check my spices for freshness every year and toss any that have gone stale. As for my SPLICES, any that started to make too much jump or noise were remade as needed.

Attention to details, Steve-O. You are usually better than this.

Oh, and gloves aren't one of my fetishes. Be careful what you wish for before I tell you what mine are!

[Marcel Birgelen]

You can check your splices all you want, with or without gloves...

The problem Steve was mentioning are the lab splices and I've heard from a number of people running film now that they are becoming increasingly problematic, as in weak. Most of those lab splices will be of the ultrasonic kind, you'd expect those to outlast any tape-based splices. Problem is, when you're going to re-splice them, you'll be losing frames.

World events over the last 18 months alone should be more than enough proof that this world doesn't need any more of that exact kind of behavior. Think about it.

I see some politics leaking through here, but I can fully understand where that's coming from.

As for my biggest fuckup... I haven't ranked them yet. I guess running an entire unreversed reel in a close to sold-out changeover show came close, although I wasn't the one on rewind duty, so technically not entirely MY fuckup.

[Ryan Gallagher]

You can check your splices all you want, with or without gloves...

As for my biggest fuckup... I haven't ranked them yet. I guess running an entire unreversed reel in a close to sold-out changeover show came close, although I wasn't the one on rewind duty, so technically not entirely MY fuckup.

Wait a minute... by "unreversed" do you mean it TAIL to HEAD? How does one get through an entire reel without catching the backwards audio? Not throwing shade, just very curious how that actually happens. Our booth is pretty leaky acoustically... even without program feed turned up I'd still probably catch a reversed soundtrack. Plus there is all those people walking backwards? hehe.

I can see how this condition gets set up on accident... a rewinding skip/mishap, poor labels, heads/tails swapped by some previous platter house, distracted inspection of an otherwise good condition print... it's the running that reel more than 5min part I am most curious about! LOL

Good one, thanks for sharing!

[Ryan Gallagher]

I'll throw another one in the mix (and beg forgiveness of my co-projectionist later). Not as audience facing. But like I said we had minimal experience with cans and cores, in fact it was probably the same print where this happened?

I had coached my co-projectionist a little (but apparently not enough) about how to safely do the transfers in and out of can with the split reel halfs etc, carrying film on cores, if you have to without a reel, vertically etc. I left to go to the bathroom or pop downstairs for a minute.

When I came back up he looked entirely perplexed and was staring at a reel on a core on the workbench where the center 1/3 of the reel had lifted out of the wrap on him. He recognized you could not just "put it back" at this stage... but was at a loss as to how to safely proceed.

If there are better methods than this let me know, but I showed him the method shown in that Japanese film handling video shared not too long ago... loosen and outer wind and re-tape it, then work everything before the fault gently to that larger wind size, reseat the displaced core, then reverse the process to shrink the outer wind back down... all on a flat clean bench, ideally while wearing gloves.

Learned pretty quickly that one mis-supported lift of film on a core with unknown wind tension integrity can set you back an hour! And I had to deploy untapped knowledge I only had prior access to because of this forum.

Only other method that comes to mind would be a full size trash can with clean liner... and rotate off and "flake" the film before the fault into it... then put the displaced core (now without outer winds) on a reel and manually tension the film as you wind it back to it out of the bin. Do a full rewind cycle gently increasing tension... cause your first manual one was likely shit. (Equally shit with the flat bench enlarge and shrink method).

[Marcel Birgelen]

Wait a minute... by "unreversed" do you mean it TAIL to HEAD? How does one get through an entire reel without catching the backwards audio? Not throwing shade, just very curious how that actually happens. Our booth is pretty leaky acoustically... even without program feed turned up I'd still probably catch a reversed soundtrack. Plus there is all those people walking backwards? hehe.

I can see how this condition gets set up on accident... a rewinding skip/mishap, poor labels, heads/tails swapped by some previous platter house, distracted inspection of an otherwise good condition print... it's the running that reel more than 5min part I am most curious about! LOL

Good one, thanks for sharing!

TAIL to HEAD... and I let it run, because when it happened, I was close to a mental breakdown... let me try to reconstruct what happened before from memory...

First of all, it wasn't me who threaded the projector either... but a junior colleague, but it was, eventually my responsibility, as the "elderling"... I didn't have the situation under control, but in hindsight, I think, I was thrown an impossible to solve case.

Let's take the Delorean back to 1997... almost 30 years ago, like holy shit, I'm getting old.
The movie where it happened was Con Air... We had 4 screens, in an old building (still standing and showing movies today b.t.w.). Three projection booths and a defective platter system in the biggest room... The platter went off-line the other night, almost causing a shitshow itself, so when we took the movie off of the platter and spun it onto reels, there was barely time to put on leaders and labeling... numbering the reels is essentially all we did, due to complete lack of time... Being the oldest room in the house, it luckily had two projectors: Two Vic5s. I gave a crash-course in running change-overs to my junior and we went with it for the next shows, hoping the service tech would show up soon to fix the broken platter.

That night, we were with a total team of four, officially, but one called in sick and the other one just didn't show up... so, there we were, two "projectionists" now on "full duty": We didn't just have to run the movies, of which one room in change-over, we also had to attend to all the other stuff, including selling tickets, ushering in guests, but ALSO guest service, as this was, even back then, a cinema with seat service... So, I found myself in the kitchen frying "bitterballen" (a very Dutch thing, look it up...) one moment, just to be in time in booth #1, for changeover. The previous change-over was handled by my colleague, because I remember being in Room #2, where the DTS failed to kick in... we ran analog that night I remember...

So, there I was back in Room #1, just in time for the motor cue, as my colleague was attending kitchen service... The first sign of something wrong was the DA20 erroring out... what was the reason for that became apparent soon...

[Ryan Gallagher]

TAIL to HEAD... and I let it run, because when it happened, I was close to a mental breakdown... let me try to reconstruct what happened before from memory...

First of all, it wasn't me who threaded the projector either... but a junior colleague, but it was, eventually my responsibility, as the "elderling"... I didn't have the situation under control, but in hindsight, I think, I was thrown an impossible to solve case.

Let's take the Delorean back to 1997... almost 30 years ago, like holy shit, I'm getting old.
The movie where it happened was Con Air... We had 4 screens, in an old building (still standing and showing movies today b.t.w.). Three projection booths and a defective platter system in the biggest room... The platter went off-line the other night, almost causing a shitshow itself, so when we took the movie off of the platter and spun it onto reels, there was barely time to put on leaders and labeling... numbering the reels is essentially all we did, due to complete lack of time... Being the oldest room in the house, it luckily had two projectors: Two Vic5s. I gave a crash-course in running change-overs to my junior and we went with it for the next shows, hoping the service tech would show up soon to fix the broken platter.

That night, we were with a total team of four, officially, but one called in sick and the other one just didn't show up... so, there we were, two "projectionists" now on "full duty": We didn't just have to run the movies, of which one room in change-over, we also had to attend to all the other stuff, including selling tickets, ushering in guests, but ALSO guest service, as this was, even back then, a cinema with seat service... So, I found myself in the kitchen frying "bitterballen" (a very Dutch thing, look it up...) one moment, just to be in time in booth #1, for changeover. The previous change-over was handled by my colleague, because I remember being in Room #2, where the DTS failed to kick in... we ran analog that night I remember...

So, there I was back in Room #1, just in time for the motor cue, as my colleague was attending kitchen service... The first sign of something wrong was the DA20 erroring out... what was the reason for that became apparent soon...

Good times (not). That many hats situation sounds like the primary culprit. Ticketing, House Manager, Concessions (including kitchen type duties), and finally Projectionist for a lesser known and more hands-on process implemented as the stop gap solution to the failed hands-off one. It's a miracle you even got to the backwards reel at all!!

[Marcel Birgelen]

Well, in hindsight, I should've called the owner (which was very hands-off, as the place, back then was a pretty good cash cow and we apparently ran it "well enough" not to bother us too much) and made clear that this was an unworkable situation, especially given the amount of people we already expected that night. We were always short on personnel, but for me that was more a challenge than anything else and if you planned everything well in advance and made use of the basic automation you had, you could easily run that place with four or five people, even on the busiest nights. But in this case, the best solution would probably have been to prematurely cancel one or two shows. But I still was young and eager back then and in hindsight, this was a great way to learn not to overestimate your capabilities. I mean, nobody got hurt that night, and it's often the unexpected things in life that are the ones most worth remembering.

[David Kornfeld]

Good gravy, what a thread. Theres a lot here that I very much disagree with, & almost as much that I think has it right; but I'm not going to engage in any bomb-throwing, because thats ultimately always counter-productive & I'm just not interested in going down some technical rabbit-hole & arguing a point that someone "knows" is right. As Mr Miller slyly hinted, we all have more than enough of that to go around.

What I will say is that anyone who has been in this craft for any substantial length of time -- & god knows, I can sadly say that about myself -- is eventually going to make a mistake of one kind or another: thats the admission price for being human. We're error-prone. We cant escape it.

However, when I'm training someone, I always tell him/her that mistakes in this craft fall into two basic categories: the mistakes that dont matter, & the mistakes that do.

The mistakes that dont matter are the occasional presentation errors: reels out of order, blown changeover, wrong sound format, miss the curtain cue, out of frame for some reason or other, threading tails out, threading with the soundtrack facing in, forgetting to open the douser or turn on the lamp, changing over from a reel of title A to a reel of title B, running the numbers on the screen, letting a reel tail out in front of everyone, stuff like this -- all these are embarrassing, to be sure (and some more mortifying than others) -- but, in the scheme of things, theyre inevitable & dont make much of a difference in the long run.

The mistakes that DO matter are the film-handling errors. Those make a very big difference. Emulsion scratches, base scratches, cinch scratches, hack scratches, sprocket damage, sprocket run-off, pulled sprockets, pointed sprockets, crushes, mangled footage, oil mottling, dirt build-up, scorching, frame burns, & so on & so forth -- the introduction of these or any others kinds of damage are the lasting, unfixable kind.

Youve blown a changeover? Big deal. Get back on screen & suck it up. Thats just one screw-up on just one reel on just one show. You run bright green & yellow lines down an entire print? That means that every future show of that movie is permanently crappy, & every future audience gets to witness the result of your mistake.

Which of the two would you rather make? I know which side my money is on.

As Mr Guttag mentioned above, "Everyone's a critic," which is true enough. I would point out, though, that well-intentioned criticism is a sometimes needed & necessary thing, as no one can possibly know everything there is to know about this craft, & closing your mind to people with more knowledge & experience & expertise in this strange & dying profession is not exactly what I would call the road to enlightenment.

Just my two cents' worth.

[Phil Ranucci]

I watched the video and had the same reaction as most. One thing that did occur to me is that in many older booths there were conduits(flex) running from the pedestal and/or soundhead to the front wall.
It's possible that the film couldn't be unthreaded and run back to the platter.

[Steve Guttag]

One thing that strikes me, the more I think about it...Andrew, a 30-year veteran of the craft (or so I have read), though carries a magnetically held light in his arsenal, as well as tripod(s)...but when dealing with Century projectors, does not appear to carry a set of allen keys or a couple of straight blade screwdrivers. Those two types of tools pretty much allows an experienced person to tear down a Century and repair it (it's about as simple a machine as it gets). If the problem was a loose intermittent flywheel, a simple allen key would have been able to snug that up, particularly if he was talking with a technician to guide him.

i get it...he was paid to thread up film, not fix projectors...but again, a 30-year vet? No tools? But has all of the video stuff? It tends to indicate where the priority was. I also don't get why someone with 30-years showing film wouldn't, instinctively, not take the safer and easier method in favor over a significantly riskier and more heavy-handed choice. Something just doesn't add up.

The other thing that Andrew doesn't probably get/understand...that print will go back to F-T, like it or not. If his claim of "Zero damage" (except for the splice) doesn't hold, I suspect we'll get to see/hear about that (or maybe not).

Brad and I do not agree on everything and every technique but we do share a mutual respect of trying to put out the best presentation and with the least amount of film damage as possible and, as a result, tend to agree on a lot more than we disagree.

You're totally right...I am incapable of acknowledging that I did anything wrong...because I didn't do anything wrong.

That line right there. That is the one that rubs (and probably literally). Setting aside whatever rules/procedures that may have accompanied the print, that statement displays an arrogance because aside from right/wrong, it does not acknowledge that, just perhaps, the choices you made were not best ones and that in future situations, you would not learn from this incident. This belies the 30-year statement as it may have been the same year repeated 30-times (I've seen that a bunch) rather than gaining 30-years of accumulated knowledge. I think you do care about the film and in the audience experience. However, as an operator, your choices and responses have perplexed me a bit, unless the motives of the primary job, in this situation, (projectionist) and the side-hustle (videographer/vlogger) are transposed.