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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Digital Cinema Forum   » all digital projection theatres (Page 8)

 
This topic comprises 9 pages: 1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9   
Author Topic: all digital projection theatres
Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

- posted 10-31-2007 11:45 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Are all D-Cinema virtual prints distributed only on hard drives delivered to the theater manually? Or are some coming down via FIOS or satellite, which was the wet-dream a few years ago when they were talking about how digital "prints" would get to the theaters?
The vast majority of movies are delivered on hard disc. That's because most DCI-compliant movies in JPEG2000 run in bit rates far too large to transmit via satellite in any sort of cost effective manner. The bit rates for a 2K movie can often run in the range of 250 million bits per second. That's roughly 6.5 times the bandwidth of the best Blu-Ray movie discs.

Most movies are delivered on 300GB portable hard discs with USB 2.0 connections. Although I don't know the details of it, I understand companies like AccessIT and Dolby are working to move beyond the limitations of USB 2.0 and connect to movie servers in better, faster ways. When you connect using USB 2.0 it will often take nearly 2 hours for a 2 hour movie to "ingest" into a movie server. Newer standards like eSATA can move those bits from hard disc to hard disc a lot faster.

quote: Stephen Furley
Something I have noticed is the extreme variation in the validity of the keys we have received.
I have heard that, including a lot of complaints behind it as well. There has been at least a few movies whose keys only become valid within a stupidly short amount of time before the first paid audience screening of the feature. You're basically stuck having to preview the movie that morning right before the first wave of shows hit their start time.
[Roll Eyes]

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Shane Cooper
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 232
From: Little Rock, Arkansas
Registered: Jun 2004

- posted 11-01-2007 12:01 AM      Profile for Shane Cooper   Email Shane Cooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
For the more anticipated releases, we often get keys to screen the day before for a short window, (say 6 am to noon on Thursday, and a seperate key that is good at midnight the night before.

It seems that how long the keys are valid varies by studio, (duh)

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Dustin Mitchell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1865
From: Mondovi, WI, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

- posted 11-01-2007 06:04 AM      Profile for Dustin Mitchell   Email Dustin Mitchell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: David Zylstra
Just think - with DCinema you could end up with 5 satellites on your roof: 1 for AccessIT, 1 for Deluxe, 1 for TDC, 1 for NCM/Screenvision, 1 for alternate content (i.e. Dish, DirectTV, etc).
We're not far from reaching that 'goal' at my theatre.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

- posted 11-01-2007 08:22 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Bobby,

You left out a major thing thing! The Dolby server generally takes a hot pluggable HD to load in the contents, its been this way from day 1. It ALSO accepts a USB hard drive as well. Igestion is about an hour for the typical two hour file... much quicker than USB 2 drives.

Mark

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Brad Allen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 688
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Registered: May 2000

- posted 11-01-2007 01:26 PM      Profile for Brad Allen   Email Brad Allen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The local guy that just converted to all digital is receiving all films via satellite. He use's accessit.

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

- posted 11-01-2007 02:20 PM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Stupid question: do they still send 35mm backup prints for DLP shows? (I'm guessing no, but....)

When files are delivered by satellite, do they send a backup copy on physical media, or is satellite transmission reliable enough that this isn't necessary?

Is there ever any confusion as to what format (35mm, DLP) should be delivered? In other words, have theatres ever expected a feature to play in DLP and gotten (only) a 35mm print, or vice versa?

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David Zylstra
Master Film Handler

Posts: 432
From: Novi, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 11-01-2007 02:41 PM      Profile for David Zylstra   Email David Zylstra   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Only the first few months did we get backup 35mm prints, but that was only because we were the first to convert 100% and the studios did not completely trust the equipment reliability - in the first few months we definitely needed the prints, they stopped sending backup prints in late spring of 2006 . . . . . .

We sometimes get backup HDs after a satellite transfer, but I understand they are only supposed to send them if the TMS fails to ingest the file.

We have had 1 mistake where a digital print was booked but a clerk somewhere tagged us as getting a 35mm - neither a 35mm or digital HD showed up . . . . . studio was alerted late Thursday and a HD arrived AM Friday . . . . . beyond this we have always gotten what was booked.

quote: Brad Allen
The local guy that just converted to all digital is receiving all films via satellite. He use's accessit.
I don't think he can be since Technicolor and Deluxe don't have a deal with AccessIT to use their satellite - AccessIT only distributes for a select few studios.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

- posted 11-01-2007 04:31 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Scott Norwood
Stupid question: do they still send 35mm backup prints for DLP shows? (I'm guessing no, but....)
I don't think they do. I know my friends at our local Carmike only get the hard drives. The only time they seem to get any film prints is in those increasingly rare cases where a movie is released only on film.

quote: Scott Norwood
When files are delivered by satellite, do they send a backup copy on physical media, or is satellite transmission reliable enough that this isn't necessary?
I'm not aware of satellite transmission even being very common at all yet. Most Carmike locations have satellite dishes installed, but they're still getting their movies on disc.

quote: Scott Norwood
Is there ever any confusion as to what format (35mm, DLP) should be delivered? In other words, have theatres ever expected a feature to play in DLP and gotten (only) a 35mm print, or vice versa?
Given that providers like AccessIT are directly involved in the booking process, I'm not sure how they could mistakenly send a movie theater a 35mm print instead. The nearest thing I've seen along these lines is a theater getting a 35mm print and finding out late that the movie didn't have any d-cinema version at all.

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
You left out a major thing thing! The Dolby server generally takes a hot pluggable HD to load in the contents, its been this way from day 1.
All I know is AccessIT is implementing something different (and much faster) to get movies loaded into the Doremi servers. Outside of USB 2.0, there's not much other choice than to go with hot-swapping hard discs in/out of the server or using a higher bandwidth connection standard like eSATA to offload the data. I'm kind of wondering how Firewire 800 would stack up in all of this (and wondering why they didn't use that in the first place; lots of external hard discs come with Firewire 800 connectivity).

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3059
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002

- posted 11-01-2007 05:34 PM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Scott Norwood
Stupid question: do they still send 35mm backup prints for DLP shows? (I'm guessing no, but....)
We once or twice received both formats, but I think this was simply an error.

quote: Scott Norwood
When files are delivered by satellite, do they send a backup copy on physical media, or is satellite transmission reliable enough that this isn't necessary?
I don't know, but if they were going to send a physical copy as well, then I can't see any point in sending the satellite copy at all, except possibly as a test to see how well the system worked.

quote: Scott Norwood
Is there ever any confusion as to what format (35mm, DLP) should be delivered? In other words, have theatres ever expected a feature to play in DLP and gotten (only) a 35mm print, or vice versa?
Whether by reason of confusion or otherwise I don't know, but this has happened several times, both ways, to us. Expecting digital and receiving film seems to be more common than the reverse. This is out of a total of probably something like twenty digital films so far since the first one, in March. We normally run at least four different films per week, sometimes more for special events, private hires, etc. I was working the last two Saturdays, three different films each, everything was on 35mm. On another recent week The Saturday morning children's film was the only thing, except for the adverts and trailers, all week which was on film. I think September was about 35-40% digital screenings, and that's probably the highest so far. It really does seem to be pretty random at present.

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Jeffry L. Johnson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 809
From: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Registered: Apr 2000

- posted 04-04-2008 02:55 PM      Profile for Jeffry L. Johnson   Author's Homepage   Email Jeffry L. Johnson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
audio and photos at web page

quote:
NE Ohio movie chain switches to digital projectors
No more film reels
Tuesday, April 1, 2008

The movie industry appears to be getting past a logjam that has lasted six or seven years. Movie theaters are beginning to switch over from film projectors to digital projectors ... and that's opening up a whole new menu of entertainment options. One small locally-owned theater chain in Northeast Ohio has taken the plunge and converted all of its screens.

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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999

- posted 04-17-2008 09:44 AM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A buddy of mine went from working for HBO to a new company that books "alterative content" for the theatres which have installed digital. He's looking for another job because they are about to go bankrupt. No one wants alternative content. They want mainstream blockbusters. Well, yes, there are a few theatres that have booked the odd concert or the Met operas and the occasional business conference meeting -- no video game deals so far; he says the game copyright owners so far are thinking like the studios -- they want 90/10 deals.

So far, all these great alternative content ideas have turned out to be much too nitch-oriented with little evidence that there is any substantial demand for it, at least not enough to sustain a distribution company that only handles that type of program material. Perhaps with proper (read: very expensive) regional advertising, they might be able to generate demand for say a gaming competition, or a sports event, but to date they can't get investors to come forward to plunk down that kind of $$.

If I were a theatre owner contemplating digital conversion, I don't think I would rely on my bottom line being helped much by profits that I might find booking alternative content.

One other point he made clear is that they don't care if the theatre has installed D-Cinema for the programming the company was hoping to offer -- they are so in need of bookings that they are perfectly happy allowing programming of this sort to be run on E-Cinema projectors which most theatres have anyway. The D-C equipment is really not even necessary.

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David Zylstra
Master Film Handler

Posts: 432
From: Novi, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2007

- posted 04-17-2008 12:49 PM      Profile for David Zylstra   Email David Zylstra   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Frank Angel
So far, all these great alternative content ideas have turned out to be much too nitch-oriented with little evidence that there is any substantial demand for it
You are exactly right - my company has been dabbling in alternate content since before 2000, the only content that hit big time was wrestling and the WWE eventaully told us to stop in 2006 even though DirectTV sold us the package knowing we were a theatre - turns out they were not supposed to.

Currently it seems like the alternate content business is doing the shotgun way of trying to find what makes money - i.e. throw a bunch of stuff out there and see what brings people in.

Personally I think what needs to happen is a way to apply theatre attendance to nielson ratings - then we start showing popular pay per views, TV shows and sports during the week. (Nielson factors in TIVO views somehow, why not theatre attendance?)

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Lyle Romer
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1400
From: Davie, FL, USA
Registered: May 2002

- posted 04-17-2008 01:41 PM      Profile for Lyle Romer   Email Lyle Romer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The way to view alternate content is as a way to fill some seats during typically slow times.

The D-cinema pushers and alternate content companies are making it sound like alternate content is the new savior for the industry.

Yes, it can help bring in a little extra revenue on a september wednesday but no, it isn't going to suddenly double the location's revenue.

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000

- posted 04-17-2008 03:31 PM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
That's the approach I've seen here. NCM Fathom Events schedules on traditionally slow nights with some of the local Regal locations. I've attended a few of their anime screenings, which is a niche market if there ever was one.

NCM delivers the content via secure satellite link. The playback is done through each screen's pre-show projector.

I could be picky and gripe about the rather low image quality when doing it this way (e.g. the Castle of Cagliostro source was up-rezed from the latest DVD re-master of that title complete with macro-blocked colors and way way too much edge enhancement), but at least these companies are trying something different, and maybe making a few extra bucks along the way.

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James Westbrook
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1133
From: Lubbock, Texas, Usa
Registered: Mar 2006

- posted 04-17-2008 04:44 PM      Profile for James Westbrook   Email James Westbrook   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
One of my screens is set up to run live events through NCM, using an Infocus projector which replaced the Christie LW25 in that house. The high resolution operas and the one concert (Garth Brooks) looked good. (Garth sold out, BTW.)

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