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Author Topic: Best/worst projector Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-27-2004 01:13 PM                     Would you believe 35/70 X-L's...... Talk about a one giant step down. All politics I would assume. I was told they had focus/steadiness problems running 35mm but with my experience with these projectors either the runners needed to be surfaced, the lateral guide rollers were out of adjustment or they were doing something seriously wrong. Tha amazing part was that there was absolutely NO WEAR to the mechanism or intermittent. These machines were in better condition than any I've seen. They obviously changesd oil alot. The delrin rollers in the 70mm penthouses were another story though with some of the bores amost half again the normal size. These machines clearly ran loads of 70mm, probably in the print grading process. Mark @ CLACO  |  IP: Logged Jon Miller Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 973 From: San Diego, CA, USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 11-27-2004 01:31 PM                     Thanks, Mark! Why they replaced the entire system when a simple tuneup would have sufficed is beyond me. It reminds me of a bumper sticker I spotted yesterday that had a political reference and this phrase: If it ain't broke, fix it anyway.  |  IP: Logged Aaron Sisemore Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day! Posts: 3061 From: Rockwall TX USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 11-27-2004 01:49 PM                     quote: If a digital projector replaced the Norelcos, he should have been taken out and shot! There is a DLP in the Stag booth, but it sits alongside the two 35mm machines. Film still gets run there more than you might think. quote: Mark Gulbrandsen Would you believe 35/70 X-L's...... Talk about a one giant step down. Actually they were replaced with 35mm ONLY Simplex XL's (on SH1000 soundheads). At this time the Stag does not have any 70mm capability. Mark, I am glad to hear that the Stag's Norelcos were still in great shape, I really wish I could have had a chance to use them when I had them -Aaron  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-27-2004 02:23 PM                     Aaron, I was told that by Doug Raden a few years back, in fact he may have been the one that sold the X-L's to them. Perhaps they also found the 35/70 X-L the same way I have..... Whats funny is all the mixing stages there have/had the rock and roll Magnatechs which are better than whats mow in the Stag. Thanks for the insight. Mark @ CLACO  |  IP: Logged Neil Robinson Film Handler Posts: 28 From: Coxhoe, Durham, UK Registered: May 2004 posted 11-27-2004 04:55 PM                     megasystems 8/70 big green pile of junk.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-27-2004 06:57 PM                    How about the Norelco AA-II 8-perf? LOL  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 11-28-2004 07:34 AM                     I did have the chance to see a film in the Stag on those Norelcos...the picture was not impressive at all. There was notable weave and jump and the image was poorly focused (Schneider anamorphics)...the operator racked focus and it was uniform. Steve  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-28-2004 09:50 AM                        Why is it that X-Ls seem to be popular studio machines, yet one almost never hears of a Century installation in a screening room? Also, what is the difference between the theatre-model X-L (PR-1014) and the studio model (PR-1020)? And wouldn't the electronic Kinotons be more appropriate than either Simplex or Century, anyway? I'd think that the electronic controls and improved picture quality would be highly desirable features. I can't really imagine why anyone would choose anything else for a studio screening room.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-28-2004 09:53 AM                     Have not screen tested them as of yet. The runners are still at Kinoton for re-grind. The lateral guide rollers were worn quite a bit but not beyond re-adjustment. A factory (or an exact duplicate)lateral guide roller alignment gauge is almost mandatory for best performance from both gauges in a DP-70. I never saw 35mm projected from them but the 70mm screening of "Die Hard 2" was dam good. I look foreword to seeing what these two machines can do on the screen. Scott, many of those Simplex's and Centurys were installed way before electronic projectors existed, although RCA did produce them back in the early 80's, FR35, and FR35B of which dubbing theatre versions were produced. The RCA FR35B was actually a very good machine. Also today some of the determining factors would be budget and the exact use you're going to put the screening room to. If it were just a regular day in-day out room to watch film in (Like Steve K's) then I would install Centurys. I've never seen any other projector come close to the steadiness of a well tweeked Century, although don't expect the best light efficiency but light distribution is excellent with the right lamphouse. It is easy to get them to beat all SMPTE specs by a wide margin on a daily basis provided you have large enough lamps. Either a Century or a Simplex is easy to retrofit with three bladed shutters. Also keep in mind that the Simplex intermittent oil pump is not going to be doing very much work with an X-L running backwards!! The rock and roll X-L is another legitimate P.O.J. that uses the tiny moviola reversing clutches for feed and take up. They can barely handle 1K foot reels of film let alone 2k's. If it were a re-recording or mixing facility then an electronic machine is mandatory but even many of those have fallen by the wayside in favor of digital projection today because it speeds things up quite a bit over using film on the dubbing stage. Time is money in that world. Mark @ CLACO  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-28-2004 10:31 AM                        Regarding light efficiency: I have a Century brochure from the late 1960s that states that "the light path of the mechanism is designed for an optical speed of f/1.5"; what, exactly, does this mean? I understand the concept of "speed" as it applies to lenses, but how does this apply to projector mechanisms and lamphouses? And what happens if I use an f/2.0 lens in an f/1.5 projector? Does anyone make f/1.5 projection lenses?  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-28-2004 10:48 AM                     the vast majority of studio/lab screening room we service are all kinotons (from older fp20s-newer e machines) the simplexs just didn't cut it in the eyes of most lab people for steadiness especially at high speed  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 11-28-2004 03:04 PM                     Sorry...I like Simplexes over Century...the Century JJ though does seem to do quite well with 35mm ...better than the SA, in my opinion. As to the PR-1014 (cinema) versus the PR-1020 (studio) head. There are several changes...the studio head gets a 3-wing shutter, a fire shutter is standard (optional on the PR-1014 now) and a studio straight gate. The intermittent shoe and the gate pads on a studio head are different and all overlap each other. I also believe the 35/70 lateral lens adjuster is either standard or listed as an option on the PR-1020. I'll agree that the PR-1030 (reversing) runing in reverse is not a pretty sight as compared to electronic solutions (or even the Kinoton cross). Steve  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 11-28-2004 11:10 PM                     Yo, Marko: Remember when we did that screening here in Nampa at the college campus back in 1999, when we used that Kinoton setup? I've never seen a more precise, well built portable that can run 35mm so quiet and smooth. A good example of a well-built machine that shows that it is possible that such a machine can be built with such precision. Yes,I also like the Simplex XL and it's offsprings. Just wish that we can find a cure for the oil leak problem outside of the 2000Mil's "O" ring fix that was finally done with the INT case. As you can tell, I still like the P35GPS CHR for the advantage of NO OIL. Yes, Century's are great machines as well - just grease up the gears one a month,check the INT for oil level and your set for life. Any blurb on Simplex's Apogee machine? Only thing I've heard is that this machine has some bugs to clear out or something. thx-Monte  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 11-29-2004 09:15 AM                        At Kodak, we have some Century projectors that have had less than 1/10 of a square movement on-screen (about 0.0004 inches or 0.01 millimeters) using the SMPTE 35-PA (RP40) Projector Alignment film for evaluation of steadiness. With moderate lamp power (screening rooms), and three-blade shutters, we've achieved 80 line pairs per millimeter resolution out to the corners of the image (Isco Ultra MC Studio lenses).  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 11-29-2004 09:22 AM                        quote: Monte L Fullmer I've never seen a more precise, well built portable that can run 35mm so quiet and smooth. If you mean the FP-23 that's a portable version of the 20 - and I like them, too. They use a 400w halogen bulb if I remember correctly.  |  IP: Logged

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