Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Hey you, you suck! (AKA: Outing bad film handlers)

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Topic: Hey you, you suck! (AKA: Outing bad film handlers)

Kevin Wale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 167
From: Guymon, OK USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 08-22-2003 09:28 PM

Ok, splice topic continued here...

new thread

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Bob Healey
Film Handler

Posts: 93
From: Milford, CT
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 08-22-2003 11:12 PM

Whomever last had Daredevil print 1725, you suck. [thumbsdown]

There is this little thing called an ID frame on the leader. Since someone was so generous to leave 2-3 on each leader, you should take the time to match the proper end of the leader to the start of the reel. (If you're reading this, that's the end with the lower number).
If you insist on using yellow tape, either leave all of it on or none of it on. It is much easier to remove when the adhesive isn't all over several layers of film.
Speaking of splices - the foot long masking tape splices just don't work. I had up to half a foot of film at the start of each reel that was folded, spindled, or otherwise mutiliated. Also, random snips of the trailer should NOT be placed before the 20th Century Fox logo
In summary: Learn basic math, learn how to use a splicer, and you may be fit in the future to push the start button. [Roll Eyes]

I am normally much more tolerant of the yellow tape, but when the cellophane layer is peeled away leaving just a gunky, yellow adhesive, that really ticks me off. [Frown]

Edit: This print appears to be a composite of several other prints. So my apologies if I accused the wrong person. Whomever had this composite print last in the Albany area, you still suck.

[ 08-26-2003, 10:40 PM: Message edited by: Bob Healey ]

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000

posted 08-25-2003 03:32 PM

Loews Pipers Alley (Chicago)

Sundance Film Series "The Other Side of the Bed" Print 3.

You received it in like-new, never-built condition.

You cut the leaders off 4-6 frames into the film (you're not even consistent with your evil).

You build up your prints with opaque splicing tape.

You returned the print with heads reattached with this awful tape and tails just hung on with paper tape.

What a conscientious operator!

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 08-25-2003 05:31 PM

It is such a shame that probably 90% or more of the people who need to read this thread, have probably never heard of Film-tech. [Mad]

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Ron Lacheur
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 650
From: British Columbia, Canada
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 08-25-2003 06:10 PM

or just don't care.

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William H. Ward
Film Handler

Posts: 27
From: SAn Antonio, Texas
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 08-26-2003 04:21 PM

Some years ago, I saw a picture in the IA Bulletin magazine of an exchange reel of a movie where the operator could not get the band to stay on, so he nailed the sucker to the film with a 16 penny nail. Went all the way almost to the core. Someone should have done a number on him.

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Andrew McCrea
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 645
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 08-26-2003 04:36 PM

As Daryl said:

quote:
Outing: Famous Players Jackson's Square, Hamilton, ON, CA.
Auditorium: 'Strand'
Showing: 4:10pm, Saturday March 15, 2003

1. This screen has had a hole in the centre of it for I don't know how long now... it looks bad and you suck!

2. Whoever built up your print of Tears of the Sun should be sent back to the concession stand. Their ability to platter scratch the entire show is second to none. YES IT WAS YOU!!! You managed to scratch every ad, trailer, Famous Players feature snipe and reel of the print in the exact same spot.

3. Somebody managed to misthread a roller in the week you've had it. The nice green emulsion scratches down the centre-right of the entire print complimented the black base side platter scratches nicely.

4. Learn how to clean out your gates. I was disappointed with your consistency on this issue. You only managed to totally destroy the Dolby Digital track on reels 2, 3 and 4. What happened to wrecking the track on 1, 5 and 6? The aperture dirt was very nice too -- it adds to the theatre's 'old fashoined' setting.

5. Speaking of destroying the digital track, your analog reproduction is great. You might want to try aligning that analog pickup... listening to the sprocket holes go by for half the film gets annoying!

6. I have never seen a print at this theatre that hasn't been absolutely filthy, this one included! Not one. Not even the day after it opens. In fact, I can think of only one that wasn't somehow scratched.

Now I was going to go through all of this with a manager, but like usual nobody was around -- except for their idiot concessionists that don't know what it means when you say 'no I don't want to upsize my popcorn, this is already costing me $9 for a small drink and a large pop'.

Bottom line: See what happens when you let all your experienced projectionists go? YOU SUCK! Am I ever glad that I don't receive prints from you, to show them would be the most embarrasing thing I've ever done.

Didn't you know it was company policy? [Big Grin]

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 08-28-2003 04:58 AM

quote:
Taping only one side of the print risks having the splice "fold up" in the projector, usually in the upper or lower latham loop, possibly causing a jam or film break.

Kinoton projectors astonishingly tolerant of this mistake. I once worked with a colleague who had come from a background in TV news editing (in which, for putting cut reversal originals through Ranks and the like, splicing on the base side only was common practice) and who, every now and again, would forget to splice both sides.

One Thursday night I packed off a print of Schindler's List which had been shown three times a day, every day, for the past nine weeks. I found that two of the reel joins were only taped on one side. This print had made 189 passes through an FP-20 and the splices had held. I didn't even notice an especially loud pop on the soundtrack, either.

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John T. Hendrickson, Jr
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 889
From: Freehold, NJ, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 08-28-2003 08:43 PM

Whoever last ran print # 317 of The Italian Job, you suck! [thumbsdown]

Didn't you know that reattaching the heads and tails protects the film? Because you did not do this, I had to remove damaged film from the beginning of two reels, because you simply threw the reels back in the cans and left the heads and tails rolled up ( with your zebra tape still on them).

Then, because you are probably blind, you left yellow marking tape 3 feet from the beginning and end of each reel.

You also failed to remove two bad lab splices. All the tails of each reel were creased from tucking the film in the reel slots, necessitating cutting a frame from each end of each reel, except the last one, of course.

Your sloppy breakdown left film damage at the end of reel 1. I had to remove frames and make two splices.

Oh, yes, you also never bothered to put back the DTS discs, either.

Incidently, I reported all this to the local ETS depot. Unfortunately, the supervisor had just left for the weekend, and the individual I talked to said many of the prints were shipped out without DTS discs because they didn't have enough. He blamed Paramount, saying the depot didn't have enough time to prepare the prints. That's an understatement, because this one was NEVER INSPECTED!!! Any lurkers here from Paramount who would like to email me with a lame excuse? Please feel free.

I'll wager that similar incidents occurred elsewhere, since The Italian Job was brought back in an attempt to squeeze a little extra cash out of the market. All that will happen is that a small number of people will be treated to an inferior product on the screen, and get to pay first run prices for it. And you wonder why this industry is in trouble??? [fu]

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Kevin Wale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 167
From: Guymon, OK USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 08-28-2003 10:36 PM

I don't want to number the print because we are still in the process of trying to end these practises accross the board ourselves, but the print of Itallian Job that came in had a tail that was wrapped in one reel comming from another one and another set of reels the same way. Had to take three reels out at the same time to keep from really crunching all the film up.

I just happened to be there when the projection manager opened the can because we were talking about splicing heads and tails back on when breaking down, not using masking tape, etc. It was a perfectly timed thing so that there was object for the object lesson.

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Aaron Garman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1470
From: Toledo, OH USA
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 08-29-2003 04:14 AM

I wanted to check out our print of the Italian Job tonight, but someone else built it instead. I did ask if it had heads/tails spliced on. Of course, that good ole' masking tape was there. WHY DO PEOPLE DO THIS?! It's one of those days I wish I was in charge and could tell our people never to use masking tape.

We did get DTS discs but they had several thumb prints. Again, handle the discs on the side or the center hub people! Little things like that and splicing heads and tails can go quite a long way.

On another note, going back a ways, our re-release print of Charlie's Angels had a nice suprise for me on the head of R1. The head was masking taped of course, but the head of the reel wasn't a straight splice: it somewhat resembled a sin wave. Of course, it was all black so I sat there and counted sprockets to make sure all was in frame. If I had a digital camera, I'd post the pic because I saved the part I ended up cutting off.

Maybe one day our great industry could setup some nationwide/worldwide standards for running a booth correctly. It is just getting sickening out there.

AJG

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Kevin Wale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 167
From: Guymon, OK USA
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 08-29-2003 12:08 PM

Our print is in bad shape. At reel 3 a big emulsion scratch on the right side of the screen appears and doesn't dissapear totally for the rest of the movie. There are base side scratches everywhere as well running all kinds of different directions but they aren't all that annoying. I can't help but wonder how the film was treated since it was all wound in the other reels(I mean we had to litterally unwind things to get the film on the right reels.)

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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 08-30-2003 01:49 PM

For those who think Reel Bands are useless and throw them out as soon as they encounter them (that definately belongs to the "You Suck" catagory), THIS is what happens when Reel Bands are not used. [eyes]

Kevin said:

quote:
the print of Itallian Job that came in had a tail that was wrapped in one reel comming from another one and another set of reels the same way. Had to take three reels out at the same time to keep from really crunching all the film up."

Unless they are not tied on correctly or are so old that the string has been replaced with a snippit of masking tape which has come loose, the paper Reel Bands perform an important function: they keep the film where it is supposed to be -- on its proper reel and not sliding all over other reels in the can.

I can't count the number of times I have received prints in the chaotic condition that Kevin describes -- film splayed all over the can. And it is almost ALWAYS with prints that have no Reel Bands, or ones that have incorrectly attached bands. Many times it takes a good deal of patience and quite a bit of 3D puzzle-solving acquity just to be able to get the reels out of the cans without tearing film. I can't imagine what the popcorn jockey will do when he is in a rush and encounters such a mess.

What baffels the mind is why the classics departments of studios like MGM or WARNERS or UNIVERSAL would send out otherwise mint prints and not protect them with inexpensive Reel Bands. One would think that after spending a nifty chunk of change on striking a new print, they would spurge and spend a couple of bucks to make sure that the first few feet of film (many times well past the leader and into the body of the print) on each reel doesn't wind up being chopped up by the reel edges as it wraps itself around and under the lips of the adjacent reels.

Bottom line, be sure you use a really good length of new artist's tape to tape down film ends when shipping out a "reel band-less" print. Don't reuse whatever tape came with the print as this surely will be less reliable than a fresh piece of tape.

Frank

And BTW, Aaron said:

quote:
Maybe one day our great industry could setup some nationwide/worldwide standards for running a booth correctly.

The SMPTE does have a recently revised Projection Manual that has just about everything you need to know about booth operation, from protocols for handling prints to explanation of equipment operation, to proper splicing techniques to threading the projectors. Kodak also had a very informative series in the form of a magazine called Film for Reel People which had many informative articles about the proper handling of prints and booth protocol, many of which were penned by our own John Pytlak.

And of course, there is Film-Tech.com, which should be required reading for anyone entering a projection booth. [Smile]

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Aaron Garman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1470
From: Toledo, OH USA
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 08-30-2003 07:04 PM

I will have to read through some of those manuals. The thing is, exhibitors should mandate such reading. I will say just by reading Film-Tech has helped me soar beyond our other projectionists. Of course, no one at my place cares about that fact. [Big Grin]

AJG

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 08-30-2003 07:52 PM

All of the back issues of Kodak's "Film Notes for Reel People" and "Cinema Notes" are here on Film-Tech:

http://www.film-tech.com/manuals/manualindex.html#FILMNOTES

I have been a contributor to this Kodak publication since the early 1980's. Kodak's Paul Preo was the first editor and writer, and one of my mentors, as was Dr. Fred Kolb. Some of the early issues still discuss cement splices and call platters "new fangled". [Big Grin]

The Kodak website has my later articles:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/newsletters/pytlak/

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