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Author Topic: Union Projectionists
Justin West
Master Film Handler

Posts: 271
From: Peoria, IL, USA
Registered: Jul 2001


 - posted 11-10-2003 12:39 AM      Profile for Justin West   Email Justin West   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Martin said, "...no professional should have to work for minimum wage. Minimum wage is not a living wage. Personally, I think every projectionist in the country who makes less than $15 per hour should walk out for a day (preferably a Saturday). And those who make more should walk out in support. Don't let the theaters get away with this crap!"

I agree wholeheartedly and would go further to say that all workers, in every industry, with a McJob or better (considering what few better jobs are left)should walk out on a National One-Day STRIKE to send a message to politicians and corporate hacks that we are tired of being walked all over, taken advantage of, seeing our pensions being stripped, our medical care being deleted, our rights and protections on the job being ignored, all the while witnessing the plain decimation of the American middle class. You cannot raise a family or build a future on minimum wage...you can barely raise a family on double that. [Mad]

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 11-10-2003 12:50 AM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Gerard wrote:
The business manager was proud of his Fortune Society program, in which he helped released offenders who had served their prison time, to become rehabilitated as trained, licensed union projectionists.


Gerard, that sounds very much like a policy Local 720 implemented starting in the mid 1980s. The program was run by one of our more militant organizers, who recruited ex-cons, drug addicts, and alcoholics for rehabilitation through training to become stagehands. We went from being a proud craft guild to being someone's sociology experiment. I wonder how many other IA locals tried this? Was this something that the International was advocating at the time? I ask only because I don't remember ever hearing about it officially--it was never mentioned in any of the local newsletters or the IA quarterly journal as far as I can remember.

How did that program work out for Local 306? Here, I think it hurt us more than helped us. That organizer felt such people would feel beholden to the union for their jobs and would thus be more loyal to the union, especially during times of required "job actions" (we had just been through a really nasty strike in 1984, resulting in a five-year wage freeze and lots of give-backs). Instead we began to have lots of problems filling work calls off of our extra-board (the "bounce" list)--no-call-no-shows, late-shows, show up without tools, show up improperly dressed, show up filthy/smelly, show up drunk, show up high, taking calls not qualified for, etc. The employers certainly noticed and became quite alarmed--you can imagine the affect this had on further contract negotiations. Even our own department heads began to avoid using the bounce list, instead requesting trusted or proven crew assistants by name, as allowed under the various contracts.

The bounce list had been a good way to earn a living if one couldn't hold a permanent house job--indeed most of my career with Local 720 was as a "bouncer." Heck, the bounce paid for my college degrees and flight training, bought my condo, provided full health benefits, and funded my retirement. But that recruiting program almost killed the bounce off. Anyone who had been around for a while and was any good at all would be on many department heads' short lists, and thus could count on getting work. Anyone new or not known to the department heads suffered badly as the bounce calls dried up. The local's business agents went to bat many times covering for the screwups, getting no-rehire letters reversed, and arguing cases at endless Step 1 hearings. But it looked to me like most of them (the screwups) never seemed to appreciate it. They just continued screwing up. Was it any better at Local 306?

BTW it was my complaining about coddling the screwups, and backing a business agent candidate that planned to stop it, that led in 1994 to my blacklisting, membership withdrawl, and subsequent lifetime expulsion from Local 720, and by extension all other locals of the IATSE. But I'm not bitter about it... [Big Grin]

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Steve Kraus
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From: Chicago, IL, USA
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 - posted 11-10-2003 12:05 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Expelled for political reasons? Is that legal or did they trump up some other excuses to cover themselves?

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Bill Gabel
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From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
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 - posted 11-10-2003 12:07 PM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here are three examples of Local 150 Job Bid Sheets from 1972, 1982 and 1990. This is how members where informed about jobs and the rates of the jobs. Note the rates they were getting, almost all the location were single screen theatres.

MOVING PICTURE PROJECTIONISTS
LOCAL 150, I.A.T.S.E.
1800 So. Vermont Avenue
Los Angeles, CA. 90006

May 30, 1972

Dear Sir and Brothers:

The following jobs are open for bid in accordance with the Seniority Clause in the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

The bid for the jobs listed below must be made by REGISTERED MAIL to the office of the Local within 14 days of this notice. Please be sure to write the word "BID" in the lower left hand corner of the envelope.

NOTE: You may bid on only one job, if you bid on more than one job your bid will be disqualified.

  • THEATRE Job Description Hourly Rate
    PANTAGES(Hollywood) Full Job $6.25
    ACADEMY (Inglewood) Full Job $5.02
    WARRENS (Downtown) Full Job $5.42
    LOEWS (Beverly Hills)Full Job $5.07
    MARINA 3(Redondo) Full Job $4.51
    EMBASSY (Los Angeles) Full Job $ *
    UA DEL AMO 4 (Torrance)4 day relief $7.53
    MERALTA (Culver City) Full Job $4.40
    SWING #10- Consisting of the following theatres.
    EL REY (Los Angeles) 3 Days $5.07
    KOKUSAI(Los Angeles) 1 Day $3.80
    LOS FELIZ (Los Angeles)1 Day $4.45
    SHO TOKYO (Los Angeles)1 Day $3.50

    SWING #26- Consisting of the following theatres.
    EDGEWOOD D/In (Baldwin Park) 1 Shift $5.47
    SAN GABRIEL D/In(Alhambra) 1 Shift $5.17
    EL MONTE D/In (El Monte) 1 Shift $5.47
    BIG SKY D/In (Duarte) 2 Shifts $5.47

    SWING #3- Consisting of the following theatres.
    FINE ARTS (Beverly Hills) 3 Shifts $5.07
    BRUIN (Westwood) 1 Shift $5.02
    VICTORY D/In (N. Hollywood)1 Shift $5.47
(*) Wages being negotiated.
The Executive Board suggests that you visit the job you wish to bid on before you place your bid.

In the above Bid Sheet, the only changes in rates were at the PANTAGES and LOEWS Theatres. If those theatres were running ROADSHOW engagements. The contract had the rate of $50.00 a shift for that theatre.

OPEN FOR BID
May 1982

The following jobs are open for "BID" in accordance with the Seniority Clause in the Collective Bargaining Agreement. The "BID" for the jobs listed below must by REGISTERED MAIL, or
CERTIFIED MAIL, RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED to the office of the Local within 14 days of this notice May 11, 1982 deadline. Please be sure to write the word "BID" in the lower left hand corner of the envelope.

  • THEATRE DAY OFF JOB DESC. HOURLY RATE
    South Gate D/In Friday Full Job $7.75
    Campus ? Full Job $7.00

    SWING #14
    Theatre Day worked Job Desc. Hourly Rate
    UA Downtown Sunday 1 Shift $7.75
    Kokasui Monday 1 Shift $6.85
    OFF Tuesday OFF OFF
    Kim Sing Wednesday 1 Shift $7.00
    Orpheum Thursday 1 Shift $7.75
    OFF Friday OFF OFF
    OFF Saturday OFF OFF
Features are not allowed to be transferred from theatre to theatre on 6,000 foot reels. All features must be broken down and shipped out on exchange reels.
Any projectionist caught leaving the booth or theatre in any conventional house will be subject to a trail and a fine by Local 150's Executive Board.
All theatres presently under an RCA Sound Contract must have an RCA Technician present when any sound work is done.
The Executive Board has ruled that when bidding on any job, be sure you are familiar and capable of running the equipment at said theatre.
BID SHEET
October 1990

  • THEATRE REMARKS RATE
    Mann's National/Plaza One Full Job- 2 screens $13.50
    (sharing) Doubles on Mon & Wed
    Fri Open & Sat Close
    Note: Mann Theatres pays 6-plex rate in Westwood.
    Mann's Culver City One Full Job & $14.75*
    (limited service) One Regular Relief Job
    New Theatre-Shifts to be
    determined.
    Mann's La Puente-6/ One Full Job $14.75*
    Mann's Glendora 6 Close Fri, Sat & Sun
    (limited service) Open Thur at Glendora
    Open Sat & Sun at La Puente
    * 6-Plex rate is higher because of limited service.
The following is from a Special Supplement from Local 150's Newsletter from May 1982.
A Note from Frank Rubin:
Daily Varirty on April 19, 1982 carried a front page banner headline: "Consider Local Liability" , with a sub-headline: "International will consider its responsibility for the actions of projectionists."

We feel that it is important that Local 150 members should know what is happening in the matter of the settlement agreement reached between our local, I.A.T.S.E. and Sanborn Theatres.
Our attorney, has been good enough and conscientious enough to write the following letter, addressed to Moving Picture Projectionists, Local 150, I.A.T.S.E.

To all Members:

I am pleased to advise all of you the settlement agreement reached between Local 150, I.A.T.S.E. and Sanborn Theatres.

As you know, suit was filed against Local 150 and the international in 1977 by Sanborn Theatres. Sanborn Theatres alleged Union acts of coercion were used in order to obtain a collective bargaining agreement.
The law offices of Levy & Goldman, represented the Local from 1977-February 1982 in connection with this lawsuit. During these five years, Mr. Levy had only obtained a $150,000 commitment from Local 150's insurance carrier and was unable to obtain an out of court settlement.
In February of 1982, the officers and Board of Local 150 contacted my office expressing their concerns that a out of court settlement was long overdue. Upon replacing Mr. Levy, I obtained a out of court settlement dismissing Local 150 from the lawsuitfor the total sum of $350,000, of which $275,000 was paid by Local 150's insurance carrier. $50,000 was approved by the membership and paid out of the general fund. $12,500 will become due and payable on both April 5, 1983 and 1984. It should be noted that no future membership assessments will be made. The money paid by the insurance carrier covers all members, and officers of the Union. Further, Mr. Kemp and Mr. Rubin and all members al legedly involed will not have to pay any additionals sums.
I would also like to state that the insurance carrier and the International will not be able to see reimbursement from the local. Also be aware that the International will, as of this date, have to pay $315,000out of its own pocket. To the best of my knowledge, the jury returned a verdict of $330,000 againist the International and they only had a $15,000 insurance policy in effect.

Very truly yours,
Larry Bakman
Counsel for Local 150
I.A.T.S.E.
(dated April 20th 1982)

A few members and officers from Local 150 in Los Angeles. Tried and damaged a few Sanborn locations with stink bombs and other things.

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Gerard S. Cohen
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Posts: 975
From: Forest Hills, NY, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 11-10-2003 09:50 PM      Profile for Gerard S. Cohen   Email Gerard S. Cohen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Paul Mayer

I wish I could give you an authoritive evaluation of the Fortune Society program at Local 306, but I can't. When the business manager announced it, I felt it arose from his deeply felt humanitarian, altruistic impulses. Yes, he was dictatorial egotistic and had long outlived his abilities, becoming deaf, blind and suffering dementia as he lived nearly a century, refusing to relinquish his tyrannical hold on leadership of the local that he felt he had worked all his life to build.

The union was always involved in social causes, feeding the poor on Thanksgiving, providing scholarship funds for members' children, supplying pickets for other unions in times of troubles, hiring without discriminating on racial, gender,ethnic, religious, age or sexual orientation grounds, etc.
So this would help rehabilitate unfortunates and gain the local
prestige for its progressive undertakings.

I don't know if there were any other perks from government involved. It wasn't that the local needed more members, since we had more members than we had jobs.

I did not know the man who hit the business agent, nor any but one of the several Fortune Society projectionists. The man I did know was a huge, friendly Southern Black. He always wore
a large woven straw fieldhand's hat, was full of laughter and good fellowship, happy noise and optimism. He liked everyone, and was most welcome wherever he went, working even the most difficult theatres, volunteering for emergencies, and became a
much loved workaholic dynamo. We were glad to be his friend.

He died of a heart attack, at less than 40 years of age.
It is my impression he dropped dead on the job at a local quartet theatre in Queens.

As I said, I didn't know of the others, nor if the program had any effect on the operations of the local other than by the two different men mentioned.

Bill Gabel

I must say the Local 150 job claim lists you post from 1972 seem to me unbelievable. I entered Local 306 in 1970 and cannot remember ever having seen any work at less than $10 per hour base pay except marginal fleapits running porno video projection. Since the local projectionists didn't want to work there, and the management didn't need them, after picketing the
owners reached agreement with the union according to which they were allowed to operate in return for contributions to the local's Pension and Welfare Fund.

In my 26 years in the local my base pay varied in the mid-teens to upper twenties, with occasional work in the thirties,
ending in a very easy single-screen near my house at around $16.

Nor have I seen such very restrictive work rules as you posted. This shows the great variations in locals based on geography and local economic conditions.

[ 11-10-2003, 11:21 PM: Message edited by: Gerard S. Cohen ]

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Tom Wienholt
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From: Towson, MD, USA
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 - posted 11-10-2003 10:46 PM      Profile for Tom Wienholt   Email Tom Wienholt   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
You cannot raise a family or build a future on minimum wage...you can barely raise a family on double that.

The minimum wage argument is ridiculous. I don't know of any company that pays their employees minimum wage and never gives raises. Don't make these general statements about minimum wage and imply that so many people struggle to live off of minimum wage. If a person actually stays at a job only paying minimum wage, then they need help. There are plenty of places that start employees off with wages several dollars above the minimum. Also, the argument that people can support a family with minimum wage is absurd. Of course you can't support a family with that kind of money, but that is something these people should have thought about before having kids. Not everyone can make a good living. There will always be those who lack the motivation to go through school and get a well paying job. Its a fact of life. Stop crying about the minumum wage. Most of the people that are being paid the minimum are 14-16 year olds at their first job. If you are not happy with your pay, get a new job or start your own business and then you can pay your employees as much as you want. I'm sure if you were the founder and CEO of a successful company, you would love to just give all your employees huge wages so that they could benefit from your hard work.

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 11-10-2003 11:03 PM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just some miscellaneous comments:

For Bill, thanks for sharing those bid lists! Seeing some of those old theater names brought back some fond memories. BTW, was the "Sho Tokyo" located in Little Tokyo by any chance? I remember going to see Japanese movies downtown when I was a kid but I can't remember the name of the place now.

For Gerard, thank you for your response. For what it's worth, those Local 150 pay rates for 1972 are pretty close to what stagehands were making here at the time. In 1972 I was a junior in high school and was maneuvering for a chance to join Local 720 the following year. My highschool stagecraft instructor was a 720 member and I distinctly remember $6.53/hour was the rate for assistants that year. Seems like west coast rates have always been lower than east coast...

For Steve, the charge brought against me under the International's constitution and bylaws (Article 14 IIRC) was "conduct unbecoming a member." It was against their own rules since I had already withdrawn my membership, but they went ahead and expelled me anyway. I never contested it, since their actions had made them an organization I didn't want my name to be connected with anyway. And it wasn't like I had ever been accepted as "one of the guys" to begin with, even after 20 years of membership. It seems that once I got off on the wrong foot with them I could never get in step.

In the end I think things worked out for the best, each of us going our own ways. But I do wish the almost continual harrassing and threatening emails, snail mails, phone calls, and occasional car vandalism would stop. After nine years it has gotten both a little silly and a little tiresome, especially when it peaks during ShoWest, or anytime I'm spotted doing work that used to be under their jurisdiction. I guess they like to carry a grudge--Lord knows I do! [Big Grin] Fortunately Nevada is a right-to-work state, so non-union status doesn't mean much here--in fact it has been a plus when doing those occasional freelance sports TV gigs.

As for reactionary union tactics, I certainly understand them even if I can't condone them. Those Local 110 guys are frightened. They are watching their way of life go away, and they're lashing out in the only way they know. Death throes. In the early 1980's Local 720 planned and did similar things when Syufy (Century) and UA bought all of the then existing screens here and kicked 720's people out. The picket lines clearly weren't working, as I saw for myself while walking in front of the Parkway Theater and the Desert 5 Drive-in. Here's a local illustration of the mentality: a plan was concocted to let loose a driverless Cat bulldozer to go slowly crunching its way through the Las Vegas 4 Drive-in--during showtime! [evil] I'm sure it would have been spectacular to watch, but as fate would have it the guys couldn't get the thing to start that night. I think all sides came away very lucky for that--they all got to live to fight another day.

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Bill Gabel
Film God

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From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
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 - posted 11-11-2003 12:17 PM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Paul

I think it was in Little Tokyo.

Gerard

Yes, Gerard those were the rates of the theatres at that time. Around the mid 90's the single screen rate was just $10.50 an hour. When I worked for Pacific Theatres, I did a vacation at the Cinerama Dome for a week and after that another vacation week at the Vine Theatre. The Cinerama Dome was a 1st run house and the Vine was a 2nd run two dollar house. The Dome operator had no automation at that time.(Two Century JJ-2s and Two AW-3 platters at the time) He ran the show, he did all the deluxe curtain and light cues for the presentation. The Vine operator had a funky XL and a AW-3 platter and mono sound and a Maxi pad 8 automation. Both operators got paid the same rate, but only one had to the job right. When I was at the Hollywood Pacific tri-plex. Pacific tried and the local said ok to sharing. So the Hollywood Pacific operator had to take care of operating the Vine also. The Pacific operator got tri-plex rate ($12.75)plus got bumped up to 5 plex rate ($14.25) to do this job. At some of the Pacific Drive-Ins during this time like the Studio and Centinela Drive-Ins. The operator had to drive between the theatres. He got tri-plex rate plus mileage. Local 150 gave into the sharing idea that the chain wanted. A few of the new jobs had operators running as many as three singles in an area for two different companies. The guy in Glendale had the Pacific's Roxy, Mann's Alex and Pacific's Regency Theatres. The Roxy was about 5 blocks from the Regency and the Alex was right in the middle of them. He made 5-plex rate for all that work.

You are never going to make the money you are worth, working for any of the theatres chains today. I spent enough years in the theatres and the Best Years working for Paramount Pictures Hollywood. Today I'm based in New York and enjoying the job even more.

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Christopher Seo
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 - posted 11-11-2003 12:36 PM      Profile for Christopher Seo   Email Christopher Seo   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
The minimum wage argument is ridiculous.
I disagree. The "opportunity for advancement" counter-argument has merit, but ultimately the fact remains that as long as there are a large number of minimum-paying (or minimal-paying) jobs, a large number of people are going to be stuck with them. I would guess that there are many more low-paying jobs than there are teenagers who need a little extra spending money and the instillation of a work ethic in lieu of decent wages. In this sort of system, a big winner necessarily implies one (or likely many more) losers.

Bill,
Those numbers really are surprising... do you happen to have minimum-wage figures for those eras... or at least, cheeseburger or gasoline prices? [Big Grin]

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Philipp E. Quadra
Film Handler

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From: Van Nuys, CA, USA
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 - posted 11-11-2003 12:47 PM      Profile for Philipp E. Quadra   Email Philipp E. Quadra   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I am just a newbie on the field, just reading and learning the posts on the board. As far as I know there are independent or private screening rooms in the Los Angeles area who pays per screening for $225 on a weekday rate Mon to Fri and on a weekend $350-$400 and these projectionist are non-uion members, but no other benefits, just like a independent contractor. I believe they get their jobs thru word of mouth within the industry. From what I have heard from them that this is just a part-time job not a full time kinda after 8-5 work job.

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Scott Norwood
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 - posted 11-11-2003 01:02 PM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
$225+ per screening? Damn. I've done lots of one-off shows (16, 35, and video) for ~$40-50/show, and it's usually only about three hours' worth of work (including print inspection). It's fun if the feature is at least marginally interesting, which is usually the case.

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Mathew Molloy
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 - posted 11-11-2003 01:35 PM      Profile for Mathew Molloy   Email Mathew Molloy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Philipp, I've worked at several screening rooms too. I earn a three-hour minimum rate that totals between $40 & $50. The screening room rental runs between $200 and $400. There are screening rooms owned by guys who run most of the screenings themselves so in a sense, they are making $200-$400, but they also have to pay all the bills.

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Bill Gabel
Film God

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From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
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 - posted 11-11-2003 01:57 PM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Phiipp

Are you getting these figures from what the room rents for an hour. Because those figures sounds more for private home screenings, not the independent screening rooms. Because here are some of the hourly rates from the independent screening rooms. Those rates productions have to pay to use the room.

  • Artisan Screening Room rental start at $125-225 an hour.
    Aidikoff Screening Room rentals start at $240 an hour.
    Charity Screening Room rentals start at $250-275 an hour.
    Interactive Screening Room rentals start at $175-325/hour
    Ocean Screening Room rentals start at $125-350 an hour.
    Sunset Screening Room rentals start at $125-300 an hour.
    Wilshire Screening Room rentals start at $200-400 an hour
Those are the rates of some of the area independent screening rooms. While the Academy charges $600 an hour and the DGA Theatre #1 goes for $4000 on flat fee. Because the rates that you stated are more in tune to the Bel-Air curcuit of screening rooms. I have worked the screening rooms around Los Angeles.

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Philipp E. Quadra
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 - posted 11-11-2003 02:51 PM      Profile for Philipp E. Quadra   Email Philipp E. Quadra   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Bill, from what I see, a client rents a theater for 3 hours private screening (Seating capacity between 20 to 500 seats) as a package Theater rental cost range $2k-5K depending what type of screening, includes Theater, House Manager, Security and Projectionist. The theater owner pays the Projectionist as independent contractor depending on the day of the week, usually the projectionist work for 3-4 hrs per screening.

I notice that this trade is a tight knit family, it's who you know on the industry. Needs a lot of networking.

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Bill Gabel
Film God

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From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
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 - posted 11-11-2003 04:55 PM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It all depends on what type of a screening it is. Because the rates most of the time only are for regular 35mm composite prints. If its a double-system or video show, its is a different rate all together. If you are renting a large house like the Academy, for a show. You get a House Manager, Projectionists, security for that large flat fee. But if you are renting a smaller screening room you pay the hourly rental rate. And you get the manager/booker of the room and a projectionist. And on some rooms the projectionists does all the work. Say you rent a room like the Aidikoff Screening Room. During the day and the rate is $240 an hour and you need the room for 3 hours. You will pay $720, out of that the projectionist will get only $60 for his 3 hours of work. And he is the only person on duty from the screening room other than maybe someone from the studio/pubicity person. The owners of these screening rooms like to keep the operating costs down. So they can keep the large piece of the pie. I handle a studio screening room here in NYC and I handled screening rooms in Los Angeles. The operator at the DGA makes the most in the Los Angeles area. Followed by the Academy, TV Academy and then the WGA Theatre. Those are the high paying jobs in Local 150.

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