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Author Topic: MPAA, you suck! John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 11-14-2003 02:53 PM                        Thanks, Brad. I usually don't get "hands on" with current release prints. Are all the new code dots exactly the same? There could be differences among various pieces/vintages of equipment, and lab location.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 11-14-2003 03:05 PM                     The dots themselves look the same from print to print, just with slightly different configurations. A common one looks like this (ignore the underscores): *_*_* ____* ____* ____*_* ____* As you can probably guess, the fact that they are all in a closely knit pattern and squarely aligned makes them even worse.  |  IP: Logged Phil Hill I love my cootie bug Posts: 7595 From: Hollywood, CA USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 11-14-2003 03:10 PM                  "see me"? If you look at that example as Morse code... That's hilarious! >>> Phil  |  IP: Logged Joe Smith Film Handler Posts: 56 From: Dale City, Va. USA Registered: Oct 1999 posted 11-14-2003 03:25 PM                     I saw these "red dots" for the first time when I saw "Runaway Jury" last week. Like Jack said in another thread, they were very objectionable to me, and the first few times I saw them they didn't really register. After I realized it wasn't just a bad spot on the film or a reflection somewhere, I though it was someone playing with laser pointers. I finally realized it was on the film and was repeating. It looked to me like very sharp square red spots on the image which resembled the square spots you see on a TV when watching a digital show and some of the screen image gets dropped from the transmission. Kind of like red pixels but larger than one pixel and it appears in 6 or 7 places at once. All the ones I saw in "Runaway Jury" were in the center of the image horizontally and in the lower third of the image vertically. This is objectionable enough to me that I'd consider refusing to see any show that has them. There are some people that can't stand seeing the changeover queues once they realize they're there. Changeover queues don't bother me at all. I rarely notice them unless I happen to be looking for one for some reason, but these "red dots" are a significant distraction and cause the brain to stop concentrating on the show. They're small and quick, but they certainly are unacceptable.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 11-14-2003 03:33 PM                     I think that the dots I posted are massively out-of-focus variants of the new Deluxe CAP code. This jives with the explanation of them that I got at the time when I went pursuing the issue. --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 11-14-2003 05:26 PM                        I don't knwo what is happening in Italy too... Almost EVERY film has a threatening advice in front of it... The entire screen filled with law articles... Like all the audience is there with the videorecorders... LXG has I believe 30/40 seconds of these advices, the audience starts complaining all times. In Matrix rev. Warner asks to customers to watch for suspect behaviours... And the movie is FILLED with CAP code, also in brighter scenes... A  |  IP: Logged David Stambaugh Film God Posts: 4021 From: Eugene, Oregon Registered: Jan 2002 posted 11-14-2003 08:07 PM                        Antonio, that's crazy! 30-40 seconds of legal threats to the audience in front of each movie??!! I'd like to see what happens here if they try that in the US. They're nucking futs!!  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-15-2003 03:10 AM                    Yeah we need some pics of the real thing with its cute patterns. On M&C I only noticed it in Reel 3. But it was severe in that reel. For awhile I was noticing it every minute or so and so I started counting down to myself and sure enough there was another one. Always on the grayish ocean scenes. After a bunch coming on approx. one minute intervals I did notice one at just 30 sec. or so from a prior one. Very annoying. Glad when the reel ended.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 11-15-2003 03:14 AM                     For what it's worth, I split timed them on my stopwatch during Alien (rerelease directors cut), and got: 00:00.00 00:38.16 00:45.36 01:09.06 05:35.11 06:16.11 06:42.41 07:39.70 and then reel ended at 14:37.32; I started counting somewhere in the middle of the reel as they got annoying. I'm sure I missed quote a few of them. Steve, did you see it on an advance screening print, or on a regular release print? (Jack notes in another thread that he did not see it at a trade screening.) --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Jason Black Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1723 From: Myrtle Beach, SC, USA Registered: Nov 2000 posted 11-15-2003 09:03 AM                        Jhawk, I'd bet the print Steve saw was a release print. I noted the very same CRAP on my R3. After the 7th set, I stopped counting. I so desperately want to point this annoying CRAP out to friends and employees, but I dont' want them to be distracted while watching a film. I've already instilled in them the oblivious reel change indicators.. It's funny to watch them try and show/explain to others what they are..  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-15-2003 11:23 AM                    That was on watching a regular print at a theatre last night. I don't recall whether they were on the print I ran a few weeks ago for critics as I was watching only for projection purposes not continually but more than likely they were; I see the dots all the time when running regular prints.  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 11-15-2003 04:30 PM                        From the posts here, it looks like most of this is on the last part of reel 3 (the storm scene). I sort of hoped I could gripe enough to get a replacement reel 3, but it wouldn't matter if it was also full of this stuff. Steve, there are so many of them in that sequence... that's why I don't think I could have missed them at the screening. Brad, J-Hawk... mine are also well-defined... Comparatively, J-Hawk's scan looks like splotches. Don't know what good it'll do, but this will be on top of the topic list when I talk with my booker on Monday!  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 11-16-2003 05:07 AM                     Well, I have some more scans, but perhaps they're a bit different than what I expected. I noticed one of our 3 prints of Seabiscuit had CAP coding on R7. It's from Technicolor's lab, not Deluxe. CAP coding runs for three consecutive frames (has anyone seen this before?). Here's a scan of the three frames from the CAP coded print: And here's a scan of the same three frames from a different print: Sorry for the variability in scan quality from frame-to-frame. The scanner I used was designed for 8-perf, so there's an interruption before the 3rd frame. I also can't explain why the third frame is a bit dim-looking. All those scratches were pre-existing (and you wonder why we had 3 prints ). I have some higher resolution images that show this better: PDF file of two high resolution images. PNG file of CAP-coded frames. PNG file of non-CAP coded frames. It took me quite a while to find these frames on the bench; I kept looking for a single frame that differed from it's adjacent frame, and this failed my test... Methodology: I counted the distance out with a sync block referenced to the first non-black frame of the reel, but in retrospect, I should have counted from the beginning of the scene, in case of double-chopped ID frames or such. But even if the non-CAP version is off by a frame or three, the point is pretty clear, I think. I'll endeavor to get some scans of the new Deluxe single-frame cap code when I next run across it. That probably won't be for a couple weeks... --jhawk [Edits: specify the size of the hi-rez pix; remove hi-rez link; add explanation; add FT-hosted hi-rez pix ] [ 11-17-2003, 05:53 PM: Message edited by: John Hawkinson ]  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 11-16-2003 04:20 PM                        Mine are in that general area, but they appear (at one time or another) on the other side of center, too. Unfortunately for us, our codes are on the light side of the frame... much harder to miss than your example.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 11-16-2003 04:24 PM                        I am beginning to feel that Deluxe Hollywood has absolutely no business whatsoever in this industry, they should be shut down, and all of their employees should rightfully lose their jobs for what they have done. They obviously see no problem in ruining presentation with crap like this. The only way to prevent piracy is to not make movies at all! I am amazed they don't take this step, because they are more worried about the pirates then about the billions and billions of $$$ they already do make.  |  IP: Logged

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