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Author Topic: Anyone consuming HD or Blu-ray? Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-09-2008 05:20 PM                     There's no reason for the primary audio track on a Blu-ray movie disc to be anything less than uncompressed LPCM or lossless compressed Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD. However, those lossy formats (DD, DTS, Dolby Digital Plus, DTS High Res) can still be useful for foreign language tracks, commentary tracks, sound effects tracks, etc. If all those kinds of tracks are put on the disc uncompressed or lossless compressed they may hog up too much bandwidth and negatively affect the video quality. I'd like to see some isolated scores in uncompressed or lossless formats. Unfortunately, isolated scores have disappeared largely to legal problems. The music interests want everyone buying the separately packaged music score on plain CD. That model is now grossly out of date with Blu-ray able to deliver better audio quality than CD, longer playing duration than CD and more channels of audio than CD. Movie music scores on CD now officially suck ass.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-10-2008 12:22 PM                        quote: music interests want everyone buying the separately packaged music score on plain CD. That model is now grossly out of date with Blu-ray able to deliver better audio quality than CD, What if you want to listen in your car, or on a player that's not in your tee-vee room? Those score CDs are really bad sellers anyway.  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-10-2008 01:04 PM                     Since a growing number of Blu-ray movies are including the "digital copy" doo-dad, the music score could come along for the ride on that bundled DVD-ROM. They could include dubs in MP3 and/or LPCM -and not necessarily have it subject to the 74/80 minute limit of music CD. You could actually get the entire score rather than some edited down version of it. I don't think movie studios should get rid of packaged music score CDs entirely. However, since they don't sell all that well (unless the score is a major success) and they are limited in terms of duration and audio quality I just don't think that item should be the main thing preventing the inclusion of isolated 5.1 music scores on movie discs. They don't have justifiable leverage anymore. One other thing to consider, the way the score is presented in the movie isn't necessarily the same way it is presented on the music CD. Certain passages can be cut in the movie edit. The score CD of E.T.: The Extraterrestrial is one example. The Far From Home / E.T. Alone track has significant material the movie chopped through for how the scene was edited. I think if those differences are noted, it may be easier to justify the inclusion of the isolated 5.1 score on the movie disc. With Blu-ray having such tough copy protection measures, it would be difficult for someone to get the score off that disc and put it onto a MP3 player or something else anyway.  |  IP: Logged Mike Schindler Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1039 From: Oak Park, IL, USA Registered: Jun 2002 posted 08-01-2008 11:19 PM                     I'm using a PS3 hooked up to a standard DD/DTS receiver via optical cable. Some discs come with both standard Dolby Digital tracks, and one of the new lossless tracks. When given the option, which should I choose? Will the lossless tracks still sound better than the standard ones on my setup? Will they sound worse? Thanks.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 08-01-2008 11:35 PM                        You can't play the lossless tracks with that setup. If you choose them, they will "core down" to normal Dolby Digital or DTS. It will still sound very good, however.  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 08-02-2008 12:39 AM                     The "core" versions of DTS and Dolby Digital are output at the maximum bit rates of their given data lossy formats. For Dolby TrueHD, you'll get a DD compatible 640 kilobit per second data rate, which is better than the usual 448kb/s rate found on DVD. For DTS-HD, the "core" will be 1509kb/s, which is double the data rate found on most DVDs. I'm having to deal with the lossy audio format stuff for now, but plan on buying a new HDMI 1.3a capable AV receiver pretty soon for handling the next-gen audio formats and gaining 7.1 discrete surround.  |  IP: Logged Mike Schindler Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1039 From: Oak Park, IL, USA Registered: Jun 2002 posted 08-02-2008 12:49 AM                     Thanks for the info. If the HD formats sound better than the standard ones, even when "cored down," why do some discs have both?  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 08-02-2008 01:04 AM                     Blu-ray discs usually don't feature something like a Dolby TrueHD English track and DD 5.1 English track. Most of the ones I own have either Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD Master Audio as the main English track with DD 5.1 or DTS 5.1 lossy tracks offered for foreign language tracks. Both Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio have lossy core audio track capability. The only Blu-ray Disc movies I own that feature two copies of the main audio track in both DD 5.1 and a "next-gen" format are those featuring uncompressed LPCM 5.1 or LPCM 7.1. Naturally, there is no backward compatible "core" mode with choosing a multichannel LPCM audio track. Such discs require a lossy, backward compatible DD or DTS track to provide compatibility with older stereo equipment.  |  IP: Logged Cameron Glendinning Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 845 From: West Ryde, Sydney, NSW Australia Registered: Dec 2005 posted 08-02-2008 04:59 PM                     Ok, I finally jumped on the blu ray bandwagon, I noticed a sharp player marked down to $399 (average price for a player in australia is $500 plus, playstation $700). Plugging it into my Panasonic 100e 3 x lcd 720p projector provides an excelent 24 fps image (yes Larry I see why you rave!) Now all I have to do is wait for the price for the 1080p projectors to drop over the next few years .  |  IP: Logged Carey Barber Expert Film Handler Posts: 143 From: Newport News, VA, USA Registered: Jan 2003 posted 08-22-2008 09:51 AM                     From IMDB Blu-ray Sales Fly Into The Blue After a rather slow start, sales of Blu-ray high-definition titles are accelerating and are likely to take off exponentially during the holiday season, according to a report by U.K.-based Futuresource. Blu-ray titles will account for about 12 percent of video sales by the end of the year, the research firm said, and will rise to 61 percent by 2012. In a statement Futuresource managing director Jim Bottoms said, "What has impressed me most is the way the retailers are supporting Blu-ray and how much space they are giving over to Blu-ray discs."  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 08-22-2008 10:47 AM                        HD-DVD CAN STILL WIN!!!  |  IP: Logged Paul Mayer Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under! Posts: 3836 From: Albuquerque, NM Registered: Feb 2000 posted 08-22-2008 12:52 PM                        I see Mark has swung with Joe's F-T handle... I'm not quite financially ready to jump in to the Blu pool yet - I want to see the playback hardware prices come down some more, and I have nothing to lose (other than $$$) by waiting. So far I do have two Br discs though. Naturally both are animation-related and from Japan. One nice thing about Br for me is that the US and Japan are both in Region A. If a Japanese producer chooses to region-encode a release, at least I'll be able to play it without having to resort to various hacks or purchasing additional native-region playback gear. The appearance of a good reasonably-priced 1.1 or higher multi-region Br player will get me to finally jump in.  |  IP: Logged Bruce Hansen Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 847 From: Stone Mountain, GA, USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 08-22-2008 07:13 PM                     It may be that the manufactures are holding prices high at the moment, trying to pay off some of their R and D, because they know that come the day after Thanksgiving, prices are going to drop. I would not be surprised to see a $200 BR player. BTW, anyone still looking for HD-DVD discs, Fry's at I-85 and Plesent Hill Road (North of Atlanta) is selling out a bunch of HD-DVDs for $9.95. I don't know if other Fry's are doing the same thing.  |  IP: Logged Larry Myers Master Film Handler Posts: 371 From: Herndon, VA, USA Registered: Jan 2001 posted 08-22-2008 09:26 PM                 Thanks Cameron. The system is so good it's actually an improvement over film. Try "Phantom of the Opera" if they have it in Blu Ray. It's the best of the best and way better then 35mm film.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 08-23-2008 01:38 AM                     quote: Larry Myers Try "Phantom of the Opera" if they have it in Blu Ray. It's the best of the best and way better then 35mm film. Larry, I have been extremely patient with you, but am I going to have to ban you from these forums to put a stop to you spreading your ignorance and general stupidity? Just because you have a junker 35mm portable projector in your living room next to a "dlp projector" (a single chip 720P machine) on a 3 foot screen does NOT in any way qualify you to make such ridiculous and foolish statements. Current 35mm film, even "high speed release prints" is VASTLY higher resolution than what you are running. I don't care if you have an "HD" lens on your portable projector, your projector mechanism itself is not good enough to be able to resolve all of the resolution on that film using any lens, and as such you think (or maybe if the projector is in worse shape than I thought...) that you are seeing a better picture on your 720P projector. If that is indeed so, you need to start putting some blame on your 35mm setup, because that is technically IMPOSSIBLE! Clearly you have never seen "film done right" in regards to equipment quality and precision of installation...or you've never seen a properly handled film print, one of the two, or heck probably neither! Had you experienced this combination, in no way would you be raving about your 720P single chip DLP with happy little spinning color wheel video setup claiming that it is superior to film. And for the record I find it great that you happen to pick this title, as I not too long ago did a side by side comparison of a reject reel from this film that was never picked up by the depot against the blu-ray. The only difference was that we actually ran the blu-ray through a professional 3 chip dlp projector, not that $1000 toy one you keep raving about...and the film was VASTLY superior. End of story. No more stupidity. Just stop your nonsense.  |  IP: Logged

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