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Author Topic: HATEFUL EIGHT 70mm - all discussion
Buck Wilson
Jedi Master Film Handler

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From: St. Joseph MO, USA
Registered: Sep 2010


 - posted 01-01-2016 05:07 PM      Profile for Buck Wilson   Email Buck Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Most have probably seen this but for archival reasons:

Meet the Brave Projectionists Behind 'The Hateful Eight' 70mm Roadshow

By Chris O'Falt | Indiewire
December 31, 2015 at 2:04PM

Have “The Hateful Eight” roadshow problems been overblown?

http://www.indiewire.com/article/meet-the-brave-projectionists-behind-the-hateful-eight-70mm-roadshow-20151231

quote:
Before delving into the Sisyphean task of putting together the 100 theater roadshow and some of the problems with individual 70mm screenings you’ve been reading about, it’s important to first remember that while the ability to shoot on film might have recently come back from near death, the battle between digital and film projection has been over for awhile now. Even at the prestigious, filmmaker-friendly New York Film Festival -- whose state of the art facilities are the rare venues still capable of screening 35mm -- movies that were shot on celluloid, like "Carol," "Bridge of Spies" and "Listen Up Philip," have screened digitally (DCP). Recently, only "Inherent Vice" screened there in 35mm and that was big deal.

So the idea of a three-hour 70mm film, shot in Ultra Panavision -- a format for which hasn’t been used since 1964 and has an unruly 2.76:1 aspect ratio -- screening four to five times a day in 100 different commercial theaters that ripped out their 35mm projectors years ago? Ridiculous. Yet that’s what Boston Light and Sound, a speciality projection and sound company, was tasked with early this year when they were approached by The Weinstein Company about "The Hateful Eight" roadshow.

BL&S Co-Founder Chapin Cutler
Boston Light and Sound
BL&S Co-Founder Chapin Cutler
The parameters of this project are nuts," explained Matt Jones, a curator of the Moving Image at the Moving Image Archives at the UNC School of the Arts, who is currently a roadshow projectionist at the AMC Potomac Mills 18 in Virginia. "They don't make parts anymore, there is practically no industry left for film projection. So it's a minor miracle they got it all pulled together in the first place. This is my first time working with BL&S, and I am truly astounded by their expertise and how game they are for all of it. It's a company of techs and engineers, so it must have killed them how quickly this had to move. But between the technical feat itself, the negotiations with 100 disparate venues, and dealing with a Hollywood studio and its timetable everything, has had to pull together fast."

Added BS&L’s co-founder Chapin Cutler, "By any metric, this project should never have come off as it has."

The project began with a nationwide search for 70mm equipment that had been abandoned or destroyed. Because there were not enough working or complete projectors and backup parts, BL&S had to design and manufacture 125 different parts, including gears, shafts, sprockets and rollers. They would also have to manufacture two different anamorphic lenses that could widen the image to accommodate Ultra Panavision’s extremely wide aspect ratio, develop kits that allowed old 35mm platters to handle the extra weight of a 3-hour-and-20-minute 70mm print, and locate and refurbish DTS playback systems to properly play the film’s sound. Oh, and so as to not burden DCP theaters that ripped out their film projectors years ago, all of this would need to be designed as a plug-and-play kit that could be shipped and quickly assembled in projection booths around the country.

To give you a sense of just how vast this undertaking was, watch this three minute tour of all the once obsolete equipment that needed to be found, restored and retrofitted for the roadshow.


The Projectionists

Possibly the hardest job in pulling off the roadshow has fallen on the projectionists. To man 100 booths, BL&S scoured the country for the best possible candidates, reaching out to film festivals and cinema archives, training current projectionists, asking their own technicians to step into the position when necessary, and pulling celluloid projectionists out of retirement.
Hateful Eight Projectionist Jason Garnett
Hateful Eight Projectionist Jason Garnett
The deck is stacked against these technicians right from the get go, with a majority getting their assignments late in December and given at most a day at their roadshow theater to prepare.

"The technician assigned to the venues in Florida told me that when he used to work for a large theatre chain setting up projectors, they would spend a month testing and working out kinks before it was ready for showing," explained Noelle Alemán, a roadshow projectionist stationed at the Regal Kendal Village Stadium 16 in Miami.

The reality is that, while BL&S did an amazing job building the 70mm projection system in time for the roadshow, the projectionists needed even more time to prep for the cobbled together machines. Scott DuVall, projecting "The Hateful Eight" at the AMC Southlake 24 in Morrow, Georgia, told Indiewire, "With the way some of these theaters have been outfitted and, for a lack of a better word, Frankenstein'd together, every venue is a minefield of potential issues to overcome."
"Many of these projectors are practically antiques, the platter systems were never intended to support the weight and size of 70mm," wrote Adam Witner, in an article for Indiewire about his experience projecting for the roadshow. "Dozens of tiny mechanical failures are bound to happen, and part of our job is to make sure small issues don’t propagate into catastrophes."

Alemán told Indiewire about one of her close calls: "[It was] the last 20 minutes of the [show] and the film very nearly fell off of the platter. I caught it in time, but because of how distorted it got, I had to hand-feed the film through the rollers for the last 20 minutes. Let me tell you, that was the most nerve-wracking and agonizing 20 minutes of my life."

Hateful Eight Projectionist Jason Garnett
Hateful Eight Projectionist Jason Garnett
For this article, Indiewire talked to seven different "Hateful Eight" projectionists and all of them told the same story: for every one problem that interferes with one of the roadshow screenings, there are nine near catastrophes they are able to prevent. It's intense and grueling work.

Roadshow projectionists screening the movie four times a day are working 16-hour shifts, while five shows a day means a 20-hour shift, all without a day off for 14 straight days. They are sleep deprived, hungry and most are stationed in a strange city away from their families for Christmas and New Years. What's developed though is a support network amongst the projectionist, who stay in constant contact over their smart phones, lending technical and emotional support.
"I can tell you in all of my years I've never worked with a more talented and dedicated group of people," wrote Cinemark Paradise 24 projectionist Jason Garnett in an email to Indiewire. "What we're pulling off is nothing short of a miracle. It's cinematic history and I know everyone loves being a part of it." And that's what really binds the BL&S employees and their projectionists together more than anything: they are all cinephiles, just as passionate about film being projected as Quentin Tarantino himself.

Hateful Eight
Wrote projectionist Matt Jones:

"I've seen this print 22 times so far. There is no question it's light years better looking than the DCP. The digital files is flat, dull by comparison. And I've had shows that simply couldn't have gone better, but I've also had to stop a few times to work on something, and I'm sure I've disappointed a couple audiences in the process. But what we're doing here is allowing audiences to see what we've lost as a society. It's a glimpse into how things were, and all the effort is worth it when you talk to someone who truly experienced something different than what they've become used to. The excitement is palpable!"

"I'm not naive enough to think we can turn the clock back on an entire industry, but it is my fervent hope that we are engaging our audiences not only with watching film, but that we are opening some eyes to how far the industry has drifted from how it began and thrived for the better part of a century, and maybe even make them consider if that has been for the better or not. We're demonstrating that film is not dead, that there are still true believers ready to rage against the dying of the light!"

As for the problems themselves, most projectionists, with the support of BL&S's 22 roving technicians, feel as if the worst is behind them. They also believe that the problems have been overblown: "Our failed show ratio is way below 1% when you add them all up," reports BL&S's Chapin. "It is unfortunate that they happened. But, as with modern technology, occasional problems do occur. They can’t be avoided."

"No one has done this before, certainly to this extent, by most measures, it has been a success," he concludes. "We have learned from it, and if given the opportunity again, will certainly improve our track record. But, given the response, including audience members waving at the projectionist when they leave the theatre, I believe that Mr. Tarantino and The Weinstein Company have provided an experience many will remember for a very long time."


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Bill Brandenstein
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 - posted 01-01-2016 08:43 PM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Went to AMC Universal City today to see Star Wars with the family, and before leaving watched a few moments of "Hateful Eight" by peeking in the balcony of Screen 14. That is a large room and large screen, the projection using both engines of a 3D system that is neither bright enough nor capable enough of good black levels to look visually impressive. But you know what it had? Sharpness. There was visual detail there far superior to the Star Wars IMAX screening we'd just seen, no doubt because it was true 4K, which Star Wars most definitely is not.

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Lyle Romer
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quote: Bill Brandenstein
There was visual detail there far superior to the Star Wars IMAX screening we'd just seen, no doubt because it was true 4K, which Star Wars most definitely is not.
From the balcony of an auditorium (assuming a similar design to the 2 balcony auditoriums at AMC Downtown Disney 24 in Orlando), you are too far back to be able to see the difference between 2k and 4k based on the limitations of our eyes.

In Orlando, the screen is around 60ft wide. Do they even use 4k projectors on the screens that are too big for the Sony Projectors to work?

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Bill Brandenstein
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I tried to factor that in, Lyle, from the front of the balcony in that unusually large room. But you're right - I can't be sure. However, in these threads the DCP has been identified as 4K, and my son and I both noted how vastly superior the detail looked. Now I wished I'd tried to identify the projector to see if we could confirm 4K chips. The websites don't help either. In any case, it didn't look impressive in any other way than very clean and crisp.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

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quote: Buck Wilson
Meet the Brave Projectionists Behind 'The Hateful Eight' 70mm Roadshow
Y'all are so brave and courageous. And brave. True heroes. It takes some serious balls of steel to run film. Not sure how it's even possible.

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Brad Miller
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 - posted 01-02-2016 04:18 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Joe, BLSI supplied Osram bulbs. Now do you understand the "brave" part? [Razz]

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Monte L Fullmer
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True, the H8 content is 4K, but a good chance that the majority of the DCP screenings are doing 2K presentations.

We're shooting ours through a 2K Barco.

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Sean Weitzel
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From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall)
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 - posted 01-02-2016 08:32 PM      Profile for Sean Weitzel   Email Sean Weitzel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Oh no Sam. Someone on the internet claims there was a problem "jam/melt" last night during the overture. He went on to say the rest of the show was fine. Is that true? [Frown] [Frown]

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Manny Montes
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it's unfortunate how there is very little unbiased media now, I would have loved to read about the technical aspects of the roll-out and how they handled it, its definitely a feat. Then again I did get to enjoy part of the roll-out so I have a slight idea at least locally about what it took. It seems that with this issue (70mm) there is no middle ground, each article is either "it was a waste of a rollout and tarintino is a big cry baby for a dead medium" or "the public should be honored that these projectionists risked their lives for 70mm film which is basically the next coming of jesus"

I watched it and thought, wow this was great, great vivid color and light on screen. The only perplexing aspect was the format, not sure why he would choose to shoot in a wide format for a movie that is mostly shot indoors and most cinemas don't have screens wide enough to accommodate. But I definitely think these projectionists were "honorable" or anything like that, it was a job they signed up for, yes the hours suck, its tough.

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Daniel Schulz
Master Film Handler

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 - posted 01-02-2016 09:16 PM      Profile for Daniel Schulz   Author's Homepage   Email Daniel Schulz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just chiming in to report on my first screening of the film with the general public - a noonday Saturday show in one of the big houses at Arclight Hollywood. Honestly I'm sort of glad it's there and not in the Dome, as I'm not a big fan of the deep-curve screen in the Dome.

I am happy to report on a near-flawless presentation - no curtain of course, but the large screen (a constant-height screen) was properly masked off to 2.76:1. The image was bright and steady, perfectly in focus, and the sound was great. My only concern is that only a week into the run the print is showing some scratches - the first a light vertical scratch on the left-hand side of the print, for the first 10 minutes or so of the movie. The other scratch is something I don't remember ever seeing before, as it was not vertical but stayed stationary in the middle of the screen towards the top left quadrant - a sort of cross-hatch pattern, only noticeable on bright images.

The audience responded enthusiastically, and it was gratifying to me to see all the hard work from the filmmakers, Weinstein, Datasat and especially Boston Light & Sound paying off through sold-out houses running the show in Ultra Panavision.

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Sam D. Chavez
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 - posted 01-02-2016 09:23 PM      Profile for Sam D. Chavez   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Oh no Sam. Someone on the internet claims there was a problem "jam/melt" last night during the overture. He went on to say the rest of the show was fine. Is that true? [Frown] [Frown]

News to me. Where did you read it?

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Mike Babb
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I'm not an employee of BLS but I do know many of the people who worked on this project.
Joe, the y'all you are addressing are not here. There are over a hundred brave projectionists and probably another 50 or so engineers, installers and print assemblers associated with this project. Almost none of them post on film-tech. This is the film-tech film handlers forum, it should be a resource for the biggest film event in years. It's so big many on this site predicted failure. And there is a lot of great information on here that could benefit them, even if some exists in the form of disaster predictions. Brad knows a ton about platters and many other aspects of the project. Louis Bornwasser and Sam Chavez are among the most knowledgeable people I have ever met, as well as being among the nicest guys. Steve Guttag, who I don't know, is an encyclopedia of projection and sound information. Yet most of 100 working right now projecting film are not here. Why do you think that is? My guess is it's a bit like a bacon and shit sandwich. Regardless of how much you like bacon, it still leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

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Just come right out and say what's on your mind. Don't try to disguise it.

No, they are not brave. And no, running film is not "fucking hard as hell" or whatever the quote was.

Brad's joke does carry some weight, though. OSRAM bulbs are usable for nearly two weeks so that's my guess why BL&S used them. God forbid they try to push it for three weeks,though.

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Sean Weitzel
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 - posted 01-02-2016 11:46 PM      Profile for Sean Weitzel   Email Sean Weitzel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sam, the post was made by a Matthew Vaughn. He's a pretty regular poster on facebook in the motion picture technology group. His friend in the same thread posted a photo of the screen. It's definitely the Tower (based on his comment and the chandeliers I saw in the photo back that up). I don't have any reason to disbelieve him but I thought I would try to fact check with someone as closely involved as possible (you).

quote: Matthew Vaughn
Not a fan of the film but the image was very beautiful. The best color rendition I've ever seen.

The projector jammed during the overture and you could see the film melting.

The focus was a bit odd. One second it looked perfect and the next it looked soft.

I commented that I was sad there was a technical problem. He responded with:

quote: Matthew Vaughn
It wasn't a big deal. It was a minute into the overture and we only had to wait about 4 minutes. The rest was excellently presented

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Sam D. Chavez
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I've got to say the whole thing has gone off better than I dared to hope and that's not to say there have not been issues, mostly minor but everything has to work just right to get a great show every time. Rust is one of the issues, certainly on me and some of of the other techs and operators. We used to do this sort of thing routinely for a living, and now it's considered exotic. Really, the only exotic part was the 2.76 ratio that is hard to adapt.

I don't think a certain good natured irreverence is out of line on this thread and I think maybe Babb is taking this all too seriously. Not everyone gets Joe's sense of humor, can't say I can keep up with it.

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